BNSF Glendive, MT

badlandnp Sep 6, 2015

  1. Kurt Moose

    Kurt Moose TrainBoard Member

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    Hardly any tagging on them either!(y)
     
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  2. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    There was one with a lot, no pics of that one!
     
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  3. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    It was a misty, drizzly night and morning today. But the chabce came to stand out in the cold and video an unusual train heading east, so teeth chattering and fingers going numb, the video was made,

     
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  4. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Quite the 'junker' manifest.
     
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  5. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    Yup. Quite a few flat or spalled wheels in the set as well, which seems to be happening a lot more often anymore.
     
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  6. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Too true. And being so, a bit scary to contemplate.
     
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  7. HemiAdda2d

    HemiAdda2d Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Flat spotted wheels: assuming they are caused by emergency brake applications (crossing runners, probably)?
     
  8. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Certainly many are caused by that issue. :mad::(
     
  9. BNSF FAN

    BNSF FAN TrainBoard Supporter

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    I'd be more inclined to think more are caused by sticking brakes on cars.
     
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  10. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    That too.

    My thought was simply that one hard application, where wheels might flatten slightly, does a lot of damage. 100 cars gives a possibility of 800 wheels which might slide. A lot of flat spots could quickly be created.
     
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  11. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    The winter weather helps to lock up brakes, ice in the handbrake mechanisms or freezing the shoes to the wheels. I hear a lot of hard hits in the yard here, that causes the 'set' car to slide down the rails a bit on it's handbraked wheel. These things are quite the most common causes of small flat spots. Spalling tends to show up when there are forging defects in the wheel itself. The spall's appear when heat or impacts cause a bit of the wheel surface to flake off. This is a simplistic explanation, but it's a good start.

    Emergency applications do cause a trainload of flats, yielding a 'slow order' for the train after it recovers and is released to go. Those a re an operational headache and a huge expense, depending on how bad the resulting flat sots are.

    The danger comes in icy weather when the result of many wheels hammering a spot on the rail can cause a fracture or failure. Derailment time. The hammering can also cause a piece of the wheel to break off, though this is rare.

    In any case, the long term effects are just all bad.
     
  12. gjslsffan

    gjslsffan Staff Member

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    Flat wheel spots, build-up and spalling can be from many different things. Not at all uncommon to move cars around within an industry, or switching with the handbrakes still applied, unless the handbrake was applied with vigor, the wheels will roll short distances without sliding. Loads will almost never slide. Some places it is desirable to keep some hand brakes applied to assist in spotting cars. It can be a challenge to spot cars within a few inches 1/4 mile or more, from the locomotives, grain cars that get loaded at elevators a few at a time are subject to this for that very reason, often resulting in flat spots. Slack adjuster malfunction, triple valve, or other brake equipment or rigging can certainly contribute to the flattening too. Switching longer and longer cuts doesnt help either.
    As far as automatic applications (6-8 lb reduction), that can be an issue, but not as much as one may think. A minimum reduction, unless there is a mechanical malfunction should not cause sliding of wheels. Now if you release the automatic from a minimum reduction a few times in a row, you can get a sticking brake here and there, that is why you are supposed to make at 10lb reduction after the minimum, this uses a portion of the emergency reservoir to assist in a quicker charge of the brake pipe resulting in a better release.
    Cold weather braking comes with its own issues and challenges, with ice/snow buildup on the brake shoes , meaning when you make that minimum set your simply pressing that ice against the wheels, and by the time you warm up the brakes and melt that ice/snow off there is very little to no pressure actually applied to the brake head, then you gotta set more air to actually get some braking, this can result your air being pissed away.
    Mountain grade or any grade for that matter, ops call for a blast from the past for me, well before you reach the crest of a grade, and under power a minimum set is made, if after a few minutes if you dont feel that tug from the brakes being applied, make a 10lb set, that will almost always start your train squatting, when you feel that, kick that air off, get a full charge, before start down hill, make your regular applications and all is right with the world.
    Spalding is a different thing, its almost like the wheel face is coming apart, you can see chunks of the wheel face coming apart over time.
    Build up was a bigger issue years ago when cast iron shoes were the norm, cast shoes got hotter quicker than comp shoes, and tended to transfer metal. Buildup nowadays (comp shoes) can be the result of worn out shoes as well as sliding wheels getting hot enough to pickup/ deposit metal and a few other things. With the RR's getting rid of carmen, and being able to go as many as 1500 miles between inspections by carmen, this will only get worse. They keep shoving more of those craft responsibilities and blame to the crews. Its just gonna get worse.
    I was called on a MT frack sand train 3200 tons 2 big jacks, a good train, we got a roll by inspection over a 140 miles away from our on duty point, the inspecting conductor came on the radio and said stop your train, STOP your train, so I start grabbing some serious air. We stopped real quick like,
    That conductor said we had at least 6 inch flat spots, now we had been over at least 15 hot box detectors and dragging equipment detectors. Turns out that cars hand brakes were still tied, it was 100 or more cars away, we never saw any sparks, I never felt anything out of the ordinary.
    We very gently set that car out into a house track, it must have sat there for a month while they replaced every axle under it out in the middle of nowhere.
    You just never know whats going to happen, Got reports one time of smoking and sparking wheels, only to go back and find a hobo had tied a handbrake to get a better ride for himself.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2022
  13. gmorider

    gmorider TrainBoard Member

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    Good info!
     
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  14. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    Great info! What I have is second or third hand, not actual experience operating trains! Thanks there Tom!
     
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  15. in2tech

    in2tech TrainBoard Member

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    Not knowing anything about real locomotives, I had no idea what I was looking for, or understand anything in text here. I just saw them like a kid, and went, cool! That's is all...Mash movie line :)
     
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  16. Mike VE2TRV

    Mike VE2TRV TrainBoard Member

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    That's just about how everybody started. I saw trains rumbling by, with big noisy, smoky machines in front (Alcos!), noisy clattering cars trailing behind... I fell in love... :love:

    The little boy I was said "I want one!!".:)

    Nearly five decades pass... Look at the mess I am now....:ROFLMAO:
     
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  17. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    Yup, obsessions with trains are a rare malady. Those afflicted are quite iNsaNe by all known methods and definitions, though most are very polite. Beware getting between them and the train, railroad item or tracks!!!
     
  18. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    Got out this morning in time to catch two trains heading east. The first is a coal train that I grabbed from the across the tracks behind the Whistle Stop gas station.


    Then ten minutes later, this mixed freight with a warbonnet as second unit on the point,
     
  19. Kurt Moose

    Kurt Moose TrainBoard Member

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    Nice Bonnet, and all those BN cars!:D

    That hopper @6:00!(y)
    Love finding trains like this!
     
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  20. Kurt Moose

    Kurt Moose TrainBoard Member

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    Oops, double post.

    My bad...:whistle:
     

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