Why N?????: or Z Scale Over Other Scales

Yes Why N? The obvious, layout size etc..., but with these old poor eyes, the greater availability of product in HO etc. and at least in my area cost, Why N?
To me, IMHO N looks more like a toy. Harder to scratch build due to size with our big old hands. Is size the only issue for most? I look at a N scale layout in action and it just doesn't have the pitching and rolling and feel of my HO.

So! lets here about all those reasons other than size cause I see many N layouts 4X8 or larger. Why for you - N?

I ask this here because there are more posts in the N section then any Forum I visit.

Another question! Why do people ask questions in the N, HO etc. sections that are related to the hobby and not strictly to the scale. Wouldn't a question about paint or scenery get more responses in the inspection pit or other related sections?

SO!!! Like in the movie BIG - WHY, I don't understand? LOL

 

Ah Bruce, you have hit the nail on the head on something I share your views on. There are many areas of the Model RR hobby that are scale independent but to many folks get zero-ed into "their" scale forum and never surface to see all the other great posts that they could also enjoy and use.

One thing I have learned here is that both N and Z scale modelers tend to be major forum users and we have a great bunch of folks here in both of these scales. The other scale modelers don't use forums as much but we have some great folks in the other scales here too.

The biggest reason I've heard from the N/Z scale modelers is that they can pack in larger layout in a smaller space just do to the size.

The bulk of my collection is HO; but I have a growing N/Z collection going as the MFG's have started offering more in the smaller scales too.

:tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin:​

 

N scale allows more realistic operation and looks less toy-like than H0 scale. That is all a result of modeling space available.

If I modeled in H0 scale, I would have a shelf, switching layout.

 

As a newcomer to the hobby (well, if you don't count my pre-teen HO days...), I'll add my $.02, though they're not really different from what's already been expressed.

I like the scenic aspects, I'm on a budget, and I have limited space available. I'm modeling pretty hilly country (Appalachia), and to get anywhere near the ratio of hill-to-train that would look right with the trains threading through deep mountain valleys, I should be modeling T scale. An HO model with the scenery I'd enjoy would engulf the space I have. Scales smaller than N are cost prohibitive to me.

So, N provides the best balance of small size to get the scenery/trains ratio and length-of-run, vs. the cost of the smaller scales.

 

I started with N over 30 years ago but i've been going back and forth between N and HO during that time. I have been building my present N layout for 8 years. I can get more into the space I have with N than HO and run longer trains too. I belong to a club that is in both scales so I can run my N equipment as well as HO there and i'm still collecting HO.

 

I switched in 1980 from N scale to H0. The running characteristic was bad at this time and details in H0 are more.
You can do more in H0 scale, I like scratch building, I like sound. That's more easy with bigger parts.
If I would start new, perhaps I would go with 0n3. :angel:

Wolfgang

 

I like N because of what I can do with it in the space I have available - a room roughly 10 feet by about 15 feet with a corner taken out. Anything I could do in HO would have really tight curves and look kind of cartoonish, I think.

I am also really charmed by the size of the locos.

As far as detail, while it is easier to detail an HO locomotive, it's also possible to super-detail a locomotive. As far as RTR gear, the level of detail on several N scale models is actually pretty good now. We have some 20-some year old gear at our club and it doesn't compare hardly at all to what we have now.

Look at the recently released Intermountain AC-12 Cab-Forward for a good example of the amount of detail now available in N.


This all being said, I don't think scale is even half as important as the enjoyment someone derives from their hobby.

 

N scale. More value per square inch.

There is ALMOST as much as anyone would need in N scale in structures, engines and cars.

More people post in the N scale and Z forums because we are more literate than those who work with big trains. Seriously, I have no idea why, but it is true that the N scale forums are always the busiest.

Yes, there are very many scenery, etc. tips that work for all scales, but there are many that are scale specific and people feel more comfortable in looking at something in a scale specific forum posted by people they have gotten to "know" over the years.

 

How true !
And when I see what Bernd and his crew have fun with operation ...
Welcome to americaN
Too bad that they're too far away..

Wolfgang

 

I think a lot of this has to do with both the earlier state of N and my dryer filter theory.

Earlier in N scale, there were very few things available and a lot of what was available needed tweaking to make it run very well and detailing help to make it look passable. There weren't many N-scalers in a lot of places so, as my theory goes anyway, N scalers tended to look at online sources for exchanging tips and tricks and ideas. HO modelers had a much higher likelihood of having loads of other HO modelers around nearby so online fora just weren't as important in earlier stages.

The dryer filter theory is based on an analogy. Dryer lint filters tend to pick up more lint as they collect more lint, in part because the lint particles already collected pick up more lint than the screen by itself. I think the N scale forum here is as busy as it is simply because it was already busy. N scalers have tended to congregate on this forum simply because there are lots of other N scalers there and lots of topics and lots of knowledge and a high likelihood of good feedback.


Adam

 

I started an HO layout in high school that never really went anywhere. While in Japan I picked up some Kato N items of trains I rode when not at work, just because. They never got ran but I still had them. I was always moving around so I never built a layout in any scale for a long time. I'd go into a LHS and look around and somehow always end up in the train section. I was amazed at the selection of both major scales, but HO did, and continues to, have a much broader/deeper selection. That said I was still drawn to the N equipment for portability and the scenic possibilities mentioned by others. I had seen NTRAK modules many years ago and found the idea appealling but have yet to start one.

The family went to a train show a couple years ago and the wife bought me an Atlas N Trainman set for my birthday and it has grown from that. Adding all the SMALL details can be a pain and my models don't look like the ones in the magazines, yet, but I can still see them. I might need to use a magnifier to get them on but once the train is rolling it looks good. My current space only allows for a 4x8 L shape with a max depth of 30 inches so I could either build a small HO industrial scene or a decent small town and interchange in N. I had looked at Z but it was to cost prohibited. I haven't started a major scratchbuilding project but have kit bashed a few things and I've been fairly successful. My next major step is to build a T-Track module as a start and then NTRAK. A large home layout is still a LONG way off and most of it still needs to be portable, still may move at least once more.

A friend has a decent sized HO layout and if I really wanted to I could probably bui;d some stuff to run on his layout. It looks great and he's much further along than I am but it doesn't look "right" to me as far as the structure/scenery ratio. His hills just look short. Nothing on him specifically but when I look at pictures of the Feather River Canyon the real trains look like N scale passing through "Honeymoon Tunnels" and to do that in HO would be an entire room, not a 2x6ft module. It would look even better in Z

**I tend to only look at the home page posts and look at any interesting ones. Yes I tend to gravitate to the N ones, mainly due to volume, but any technique to improve my modeling is a good one, scale independant.

 

I don't understand that myself. I think you miss a lot if you restrict your views to a single forum. My primary TB view is "24 Hours of TB" so that I see all the posts and the titles. That way I look at the thread regardless of the forum in which it is posted.

 

I agree with you on this one in most cases. I mean, sometimes someone needs to know what looks passable as scenery item X in a given scale, but usually these sorts of threads would be better in a more general forum.

 

We seem to be having a rash of these kinds of posts lately....and we've had them off and on over the course of the past few years.

I assume Trainboard staff has looked at this, but it's hard to change people's natural habits.

It reminds me of a story about Walt Disney.
One day a couple months after Disneyland opened. He was walking through the park with park executives and they came to a spot where a dirt path had been beaten into a grassy area. The executives apologized and complained that guests were trampling through and they wanted to put up fencing.
Walt said "No, clearly the guests know better than we do." And so they created a concrete path in the trampled area because that's what traffic flow dictated.

So I wonder if Trainboard really can effectively change habits.

One thing they might do, and it would be a time imposition, is that if staff feel a thread in the N scale forum, or the Z scale forum is Scale generic, they could be more active about moving it, OR they could create a link to the thread in the inspection pit along with a post in the thread indicating what they'd done. This would improve visibility and give a subtle reminder to our N-scale friends that we will all benefit from their skills.

 

Donkey-
"...Dryer lint filters tend to pick up more lint as they collect more lint, in part because the lint particles already collected pick up more lint than the screen by itself...." I have been called a lot of things in my life, but not lint. I have been called dirt by my daughter's in laws, an SOB by some people in my line of work and we won't even go into what my ex has called me. I will have to mull over this new label on the LIRR ride home later this afternoon.

Yoho-

Your Disney story really says it all. Ideas such as the one you have posed have been kicked around for a long time by the admins and mods at Trainboard. So far, the more divisions of scale specific boards that are had, the more complaints are received that it is hard to find, to navigate, to post, and whatever else. But, it might be time to take another look. Please send a PM to one of the admins or mods about your idea, with specifics and examples and it will be looked at very carefully.

 

Why N scale. There is a reasonably good selection of quality running equipment. Modeling expansive scenery is easier. In my case, I have a 2000 square foot basement for my layout. I could change to HO or even O and have a nice layout. I am sticking with N because I can model longer distances between my towns so it feels like the train is going somewhere. I dislike the engine of a train entering one town when the caboose is leaving another. I also don't care so much about details and they are more easily overlooked in N.
If you like to scratchbuild, larger scales are more generally better suited for that. Most N scalers will settle for out of the box locos and rolling stock. It's a series of compromises.. I want trains to run through the scenery and am less concerned with with the correct horn on the loco or even if it has a horn. I do want it to run as close to flawlessly as I can make it to ensure smooth operations for when the HO guys come over to operate. Those of us who are into operations are more concerned about how well a layout operates than the scale of the layout, for the most part.

 

I have N, Z and G Scale, so I guess I could give a somewhat unique perspective to this philosophic discourse

I love the size of G, but I live in a townhouse with a minimal back yard and a smallish basement, so the G is in boxes, waiting for a move to a house with a back yard. I set up a loop around the Christmas tree, that's a little bit of a G fix for me in the meantime.

I made a big layout in Z. 15' x 5', 85 foot mainline, 45 or so switches, never finished it. Z is great fun, little jewels of models that run great if you do good quality trackwork, and big trains in Z are just a gas. You really have to drive them carefully to prevent massive wrecks, and you really do need to mu to get them up a 2% grade with a decent size train. But there is not much stuff available in Z, that is getting better with time, but it is still limited, and unlike the really, really talented modellers that build in Z, I'm just not interested in scratchbuilding or scrounging for decals to re-paint locomotives. And I started to get interested in DCC, and although there are some drop in decoders for z, the selection was limited to MTL GP's for that. Also, I was getting interested in more realistic operations, and it can be done in Z, but its not easy given the size and weight of the cars (lots of derailing during manual uncoupling, and the automatic uncouplers, well, let's just say big magnets and really small cars didn't work well for me). So when I had to take down the Z to put the townhouse up for sale. I decided to switch to N, which I had done twice earlier in my life, and just seem to gravitate toward.

To me, N scale seems to be the right size for model trains. They run great, there is plenty of selection of stuff, mostly easy for DCC, and can fit more railroad in a given space. Since I am not really into superdetailing, I also like what I call the 500 foot vantage of N scale. What that means to me is that if you are three feet away from a N scale train, its like seeing a full size train from 480 feet away, and there is no way I can see all the minute details on real trains from that far away. So my rule of thumb is that if it looks good from three feet away, it works for me. Anyway, when I switched from Z to N, I was like a kit in a candy store, so much stuff, so much stuff, and now I have way too much stuff in N just like I do in Z or G, especially since I am building and running a little three and a half by eight foot layout just to learn how to do N again. Lots of stuff in boxes, waiting for the house to sell and a move to a bigger basement.

My little layout should come apart with minimal damage to the track, and will move with me, could be the germ of my bigger basement layout, but I am locked in on N for the foreseeable future. It just seems like the right scale to me.

Todd