I am beginning to dislike MTL more and more

Joe,

Thanks for commenting.

The order isn't that big of a deal, but I really liked the idea of them being released in order. In the same way the US Mint released the 50 state quarters in the order the states became part of the union. It's a historical thing.

I have no problem with a contest. But to make the prize ONLY available to the 180 or so contest winners does not make sense to me. To now know that my chance of having a complete collection (and yes, I consider this part of the collection as I would the engine and a probably caboose) is slim to none, reduces my enthusiasm for the collection.

I buy cars that appeal to me. I am not the super collector (like some of my friends that have every car MTL released since some date) but there are a few things I like to try and find.

But this idea of only producing a VERY limited run of these cars and only giving them away to people who win a contest, stinks. Give the cars away. Then in 36 months, or 40 months, make the car available to the rest of us.

 

First off, Joe some of us still love ya baby! Just order my 4 pack of 89' flats. I just hate general statements like hating MT. As others have stated it has 2 sides. I never collect cars even though i was tempted to buy Wyoming and Alberta, my 2 favorite places in the world. But the other side that makes quailty cars I could not do without. And the trucks and couplers folks. All 500 of my cars reguardless of make are sitting on MT 1035's. Something my friend Grant at SAR taught me about N scale when I switched 12 years ago, "If you want to run trains of length put them on MT trucks and couplers". I run 30 -50 cars up 2 percent and need the quality and dependability of MT. Oh hell now I am going to go by those 2 collecter cars, just don't tell Grant.

 

As for me, I do like MTL. They are among my favorite manufacturers. My two favorite mass produced N scale rolling stock is MTL, and Intermountain, Atlas being in my personal 3rd place.

That said, personally, I don't really like the fantasy stuff, but do have quite a bit of it. And I got to tell ya, I have a bit, that I use to re-sale on Ebay, and other outlets to finance my personal likes. Some of the fantasy stuff has been very good to my personal wishes for my own layout.

Many people fault not only MTL, but other manufactures of just about anything. I hear "they are only concerned with profit and money...". Well, yeah.. I guess that would be their primary objective. They have mouths to feed, and jobs to provide. They NEED to be concerned with their profits, and productivity, because many are depending on that. And I am not talking about the hobbiests, I am talking about Joe, his family, and every employee they employ to feed their families. IF they concentrated on one aspect of the business, or do what they personally might want to do, Joe, and the rest of those guys there would be looking for work like 10+% of other Americans in this economy. So, yeah, I WANT MTL to think about their products in all markets to make their money, so they can keep providing ME with pretty decent stuff to play with..

Just my 2 cents..

 

testing

this is a test...1st forum

 

This is the first set of MT cars that I am "collecting". I thought it would be a nice way to have my 4 year old involved in learning to collect and care for something that wasn't a "toy". It was also a nice way to teach him the presidents.

I really dislike the change in order also. Not enough to get so fired up about it but it does really throw my plan of teaching my son the presidents, in order, into shambles. He already knows the states and capitals. This would be a fun way to learn something new.

The order bothers me more than the contest car. The presidential oath car just means you have to work a little bit to get it. Not everybody will have one and if you do, it means you tried harder. Nobody will be able to monopolize the cars, one per person, so there hopefully will be no way for a collector to hoard them and hey, if I win one, in a couple years maybe it might help put my son through school.:tb-wink: The days of truely limited production run items that made people quite a bit of money on MT collecting are gone. This is one thing that we might actually get to know the true production numbers on.

 

MTL 4 Life...

Wow! Gregg and a few others seem to be very upset about this whole “Oath of Office” car. I’ve read a lot of different forums over the past few years, but I’ve never seen anything as ridiculous as this. Sure it would be great to have the opportunity to purchase this car but my understanding is that this car is above and beyond the regular collector series, a “bonus” car if you will. If you have all of the presidential cars, loco, and caboose then you have the set! Rather than complain about the oath car, why not simply try to win one. That is the point of a contest; you don’t win by simply complaining. Or I guess you stop collecting after 8 presidents and tell your friends that you got upset over a free contest car (Yeah that will teach MTL and your friends). Oh, wait your friends would say that’s just plain stupid to quit midstream after you’ve already invested your time and money into collecting a partial series. I’m not sure the reasoning for MTL to have this contest, but like someone else said, it’s probably being done to create a buzz. Mission complete! Someone mentioned in the early blog that they got out of the collector series a long time ago for this exact reason (using this oath of office car as an example). I think there is only one little flaw with that line of thinking. I’m just not aware of this really happening in the past, so I’m not sure if that argument actually holds true if this is a first time thing. Someone also mentioned that MTL is doing whatever it takes to make money. That person may or may not realize that when something is “FREE”, no money is made, in fact it always cost somebody something. In this case I think MTL would be the loser as they are giving away cars, while losing money in the making. When was the last time any other companies just gave something away? Precisely! But hay if you want to drop MTL and only collect from other business that’s up to you. The last time I checked MTL is still made in America, but if you want your products from China and beyond, go right ahead. Maybe it’s my American pride, but as for me I’ll stick with MTL

 

The only “fantasy cars” I ever purchased in any numbers was Aztec’s Brewery series of box cars.

I did this because I have always had a brewery on my layout and they made it pretty clear what that structure was. In addition they were great looking cars that actually represented a valid industry.

Even so after buying six or eight of them I’d collected enough to fulfill my needs and haven’t purchased any addition releases.

As far as true “FANTASY ‘fantasy cars’” I’ve avoided any and all of them.

 

Folks,

Disagreement is just fine, but let's try not to ridicule one another's opinions. We're all entitled to our own opinions, even about MTL cars.

Thank you,
Adam

 

Joe, would it be possible for Micro-trains to put somewhere on the new releases which one's are prototypical?

This month the CB&Q and NYC cars are both pure fantasy while the CR car seems to be based in reality. It would be nice for the casual modeler to know if the cars he/she's buying are correct or not.

Thanks,


Jason

 

Or to paraphrase The Burger King...

"Hold the Rapidos, Hold the pizza cutters,

Nonprototypical makes us mad and makes us stutter!

All we ask is that you build em our way.

build em your way,

have em your way,

have em our way in N Scale today !"

:tb-wink::tb-biggrin::tb-cool:

.

 

What?!?!?

Excuse me, but a bit of research on your part would be in order before a misleading statement such as yours.

There is a photo of the exact Burlington car CB&Q 34236 on the "Boxcars & Freight Cars of North America website and unless its webmaster and freight car scholar Ken Harstine has nothing to do except Photoshop fantasy cars into 1970's era photos, it's legitimate and real, also actual and prototypical.

There is a photo of the exact NYC 92102 in the Morning Sun Guide to New York Central Passenger and Freight Equipment, Page 85. It is in fact a PS-1 50 foot boxcar, single door, and as such is significantly closer than some of MTL's other releases on this body style. I'm sure that photographer R.S. Short thought he'd pull a fast one on September 23, 1958 and put up full size cardboard cutouts of a boxcar in the middle of Mott Haven Yard so that he could fool all of us almost 51 years later. Yeah, right.

As for the Conrail boxcar, it is actually the subject of more discussion than either of the other two examples you incorrectly cite based on the white door which is unusual at best. The exact car can be found in the Monring Sun Color Guide to Conrail and is an ex-Erie Lackawanna boxcar built in 1968. MTL correctly has this car without a roofwalk as it was built for the EL, though there are differences that I pointed out in the UMTRR. Another manufacturer has chosen to model this car with a roofwalk, which is considerably more incorrect. Plan on sending any "requests" to them?

I normally don't get involved in these scrums any more-- as Mark Twain said, it's like teaching a pig to sing (it wastes your time and annoys the pig). But given that I have spent a non-trivial amount of time researching these cars for the May UMTRR I am not going to let this loaded question go unchallenged, "innocent" as it appears.

As for the presidential cars, as Wig-Wag noted five pages ago, the appropriate approach is a courteous e-mail to MTL.

 

So your telling me that the CB&Q car was built as PS-1 boxcar two full years before they were even in existance?

It clearly states in the MT discription that the NYC car was built by AC&F, but it's painted ,once again, onto a Pullman Standard box car. There's no mystery here, it's not prototypical, unless the prototype car was in fact a Pullman Standard car, then I apologize for the error.



Jason

 

Guys,

Cool it, please. You can disagree and share information without insulting one another.

Adam

 

To follow up, I looked at the picture of the CB&Q car and it clearly shows the differences.

Here's the link:

http://www.boxcars.us/Boxcars_A_M/C-CM/pages/image049.html

So except for the ends, the sides (MTs car isn't riveted) the door size (which will also mean the sil), the ladders, the roof (I know it's not a Pullman bowtie pattern like the MT car)....

I don't know what's left that could be prototypical. Maybe the trucks are, I can't tell from the photo.



Jason

 

For those who need more information about the MTL releases, prototypes etc., there is George's UMTRR and he puts a lot of effort in it to answer exactly that question. Thank you for that, George, I do appreciate this.

That's all I want to say here, have a nice time everybody.

 

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