Obviously I'ma out of sync here but allow me to share the following. Originally Posted by glennac What kind of heater are you running inside there? I wonder if it's a reaction to fumes of some sort." I have a Black and Decker, Frost Watch heater and an oil filled radiator heater. I don't run them at full power that would cost me...more then I want to pay out. They are set to keep the train shed at about 40 F degrees. Oop's I see what I did there...sorry about that. My four pawed mouser loves those heaters. No fumes, Kitty litter box, count? The place allows fresh air to exchange (almost like being outdoors)...remember, no insulation and no weatherizing other then some caulking at the roof line and around the bottom of the walls. At least you are out of that cold chilling wind. As far as black on the track. On another website one of the trusted members acknowledged that nickel silver track does blacken itself. Some sort of Chemical reaction, referred to by others as oxidation. Typically, dirty track is the result of environmental build-up. A positive and negative Ion thing. Extreme temperature drops isn't helpful. No-Ox will help but neither one of us has the perfect environment for a model railroad.
Nickel-silver (a.k.a. German silver, named for its color; it contains no actual silver) does oxidize, although at a very slow rate. The oxide is a pale brown color, and over time becomes increasingly dense and more difficult to remove. Different brands of track have different blends of the copper, nickel, and zinc that make up nickel-silver, which results in variations in the rate of oxidation, hardness, conductivity, etc. This is one reason why different modelers report different results for various cleaning methods. The black substance found on track and wheels, which is easily wiped off with a cloth moistened with alcohol, is a mixture of dust, dirt and stray lubricants, attracted to the rails via electrostatic charges. There's no technical name for it; most simply call it "gunk." Some maintain that the black deposits are carbon, caused by electrical arcing. This is totally false. The amount of arcing on a typical model railroad is inconsequential; just turn out the lights and run your trains for proof. In order to produce elemental carbon via arcing, the layout would have to light up like a substation melting down.
Another factor I wonder about: Are any of your tiny engine crew members smokers? It occurred to me that, in some cases, the particulate air introduced by smoking might contribute to the accumulation of "gunk".
This is quite true; smoking is in fact detrimental to model railroading, in addition to one's health. Not getting all preachy, just sayin'.
No Mike...no propane fumes at all. Plus...I have a CO2 detector in there in case the furnace exhaust clogs or somethin. better safe then sorry ;-) Been running just the space heater last few times out there...no difference...same 'gunk'. No-Ox should be here later this week...I hope
I have some Atlas track that I purchased back in the 1970s, used it for a couple years then went Peco. This track have been in a box for around 30 years and still doesn't look black, even running my finger down a rail you get a very light brown line, it still looks like nickel silver track to me! So if the black is dirt, dust, ect., then doing all the work putting anything on the rails is a waste of time??????????
I have Atlas flex track in a 2 rooms with about 250 ft of mainline. One of the rooms contains the propane fired boiler for in floor hot water heat. I just checked the rail and only get a faint dark discoloration on my finger and I have not cleaned the rail in at least 8 months. Since this in a rather controlled temperature from 70 to 80 F and there is no fan moving dust around, it does not replicate your conditions. Interestingly, we do need to dust our home weekly yet it does not seem to build up in the layout room. Maybe an important issue is that I run 2 trains of LifeLike Berkshires chasing each other with 20 cars with mostly plastic wheels. However, my Berkshires have double sticky tape on 2 wheels of one driver on each locomotive. The tape has not been changed for over 6 months and i have only run the trains about 6 times during these last 6 months. I know that this does not help much but I hope it adds to the database. Jack S
I think you meant to say a "carbon monoxide" (CO) detector, right? I mean - you produce CO2 (carbon dioxide) just by breathing.
Ok...go the No Ox today. Cleaned the track and applied the no ox according to instructions. Ran some locomotives for an hour or so. Shut everything down for the night. Will go out about noon and wipe the track down. I'll see if it helps
As the thread starter, I promised I would give everyone an update on my experience with No-Ox. As you can see it has been several years since I used it. My layout is in the garage (layout in a box). It is basically exposed to the dust heat and humidity of South Texas. For the last two years the layout has been fallow as I was too busy to work on it. This month I completed rewiring and replacement of switches. Being anxious to check my wiring I grabbed an old Kato F7 and slapped it on the track. It ran the entire layout without a hiccup at slow speed. Backing up into spurs and starting from a dead stop. No cleaning up, just a light vacuum. I just can't say enough about this stuff. Just be careful not to use too much as it can cause slippage on grades.
Now I wonder if I can get NO-OX down here. Most 'fun' chemicals don't ship well from the states I will check with the ham operator coworker what he uses on his outside gear; we do have "CRC" which is a water displacer / contact cleaner, similar to "WD40". and I have even seen WD40 down here - one hardware store sells a 2 pack, WD40 + Duct Tape. @mtntrainman you heat the RV with a propane heater, does it have a flue? i.e. does it vent outside? because if not, it will be contributing a significant amount of moisture to the room. Propane + fire = CO2 + H2O. And moisture does tend to accelerate oxidisation, not just of the layout, but of the room fittings and wirings
THERR RV is heated by the original RV furnace. Yes...it is vented to the outside. I usually start the RV and use the vehicle heater (dash vents) to take the initial coldness out of the RV. Then I turn the RV off and use the furnace to maintain heat. I do have a space heater that is set in the area where the refrigerator was. I will use that to maintain heat if it not to cold outside. Electric is cheaper then Propane...at least here it is !!
Thank you Bill for coming back and giving us your feedback years after starting this thread. I took 5-6 years off from MRR. The layout has been sitting in a rather temperate basement with a bed sheet covering it. It's not particularly dusty as no air really circulates down there but it is the basement (unfinished) nevertheless. But still, grabbed a loco (Atlas) and stutter, jerking, lights flickering, complete stop, etc. It was definitely not like this the last time I left if. Memory reminds me that everything ran fine and smoothly. Funny that I run my bare finger over the tracks and BARELY see any markings on my finger. I did get a block of track cleaner that Woodland Scenics sell with their rather new track cleaner kit - the light gray Maintenance block. I plan to run it over the tracks with my hands. No need to get a $20 plastic stick to push it around. Then I see this thread so I'm going to get some on eBay and try it out.
MK, Glad to be of help. I read many interesting posts on the net where the original poster never reports back on whether any of the solutions worked. You won't be sorry with the No-Ox. As I mentioned, just don't use too much. I take a thin smear on my finger and lightly apply 2-3 inches every 2-3 feet of track. Running trains will spread it around. YMMV, but it has worked for me both on my Christmas tree loop and my main layout. Hope it works out for you. Bill
Oh wait! I must have missed that part. I was thinking that you smear some on a finger and run it along ALL tracks. Putting it on 2-3 inches every 2-3 feet of track and letting the locos do the job is even easier! I'm going to order an 1 oz. later. There's a guy on eBay selling surplus 1 oz. jars for $3.75, free shipping! And from what I heard, an ounce will last almost a lifetime, if not an entire lifetime!
Plus if you let the locos do the work, you get some protection goop on their wheels too - the other part that needs cleaning for reliable operation
Greg: No-Ox can usually be found in the small quantities needed for model railroading on that big auction site. For a while Blair lines also carried it, so some of the big internet stores may have some. Good luck!
