Ribbon rail now shipping Thank you Spot on, and includes shipping too. I hope that this price makes it an appealing prospect in these tighter times. Peter Peter Harris N Scale Kits N Scale Kits
I think I read that rail comes in 1/4 mile (1320ft) lengths on the prototype. If I wanted to run it this length (~8ft in N scale, unweildy I know), I'm wondering about how you ship the 50' of rail, is it all one piece so I could cut it and get four 1320' sections? I want to run an SPMW rail train which I believe used 50' flats (25 or so cars). It sounds like I should get 3 of your sets. Do you think I'd have a problem running 12 rails in the bunkers? Also, Peter, would the UP version you have be correct for the photo linked below? Here's a photo of SPMW in the grey: SPMW 5375 I haven't found too many photo yet but I'd be interested if other have links
Ryan, unless my calculations are off, you should be able to get 6 quarter-mile lengths of rail out of 50ft, no?
Doug, You're right. For some reason I had the proto 6000' number in my head which isn't 50' in N, it's 8000'. So 6 pieces of 1320' and if I'm doing 25 cars, I wonder if the rail material will be flexible enough for 18 pieces running the length of the train. -Ryan
Ribbon Rail details Having shipped the first packages today, I can confirm that the rail is in one 38' length and then a 12' length. It comes off the machine in 38' lengths at present. We may try to get the 50' in one whole piece. It is coiled, but straightens OK. It is best straightened to completely flat in a bath of warm water. This depends on the weight of your cars as there will be some 'whip' which can cause difficulty. Also, you need to consider how to attach the ends of such a long consist. On another Forum there has been a debate about constructing one of the larger end bunks and attaching the rails inside this end bunk with their wider length. You could even put some small tubes inside the two end bunks so that the expansion/contraction of the rails when running around curves could be accommodated. This is the type that they are based on. Jim Costello has some good examples of these bunks - although painted in the apple green paint scheme. I will try to find where these are located on the web. Best wishes Peter Peter Harris N Scale Kits N Scale Kits
My SPMW photos are here in my railimages gallery: http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/showgallery.php/cat/1473
Peter, Great job. I will be ordering three sets here soon. The rail looks like it came out really great and it seems like the color looks great. Could you tell us how much each bunk weighs. How well does the rail slide along the bunks and does it stay in place on the bunks. Thanks again for bringing this great kit to n-scale before another scale got something similar. This is for everyone else. I am having a hard time finding undec. 50' Fishbelly Micro-Train flat cars. I am thinking about seeing if Micro-Trains will run a special run of undec. cars or maybe a certain road. I am just trying to find out how many people would be interested in the cars. I am currently checking on prices and will post when I find out what I would be selling them for. Cody
Cody, I searched around for the undec 50' fishbelly and didn't find any. I think Micro-Trains runs their undec's in batches so it's possible that with some requests, they might push some through the pipeline sooner than later. N Scale Supply has them listed as sold out MSRP $8.35. Not a bad price especially with a discount. Can't beat ~$7/car already wearing MTL couplers for a 20-30 car train. I'm also looking for the straight side flats as SP seems to have both in their rail trains. I haven't matched up the cars but it's probably close enough. http://nscalesupply.com/MTL/MTL-45000Undec.html Another flat that came to mind is the Athearn 53' GSC. Not sure if this would fit the prototype. I don't see an undec listed and they are quite a bit more expensive than the MTL flats. http://nscalesupply.com/ATH/ATH-RS-Flatcars53.html
Ryan, I e-mailed Micro-Trains to ask when they might be doing some more undec's and they said they are in the process of restocking them. They didn't say when they would have them but said to watch their monthly releases. They have released a few different 50' fishbellys in the past couple of months, so you would think they would have some. Maybe it will just take several of us e-mailing them. Cody
Cody, Thanks for the info. Since building one of these trains will require a good number of flats, I wonder if we could get a group buy with one of the great TB etailers? If just a few of us want em, we're already over a 100. When I get closer to purchasing I'll call WigWag to see if this is a possiblity. So what road names are people planning to build? I'm going with SPMW although I just ran across a couple photos I took of a DRGW version. I can't wait for the future thread "show us your rail train"!
I e-mailed a bunch of different etailers and heard back from Wig-Wag today. They said that it would be a special order and that the price would be 20% of msrp. I am guessing that we might be able to get a little bit more off, if we cordinate and do one big order. I am planning on ordering cars within the next month or so, as soon as I get my tax refund. I also got a reply from Micro-Trains, they said that I would need to send in a Special Run request and it might run close to MSRP. I will e-mail them back to see what the cost would be and post that information soon. Cody
For those of you considering a bulk purchase for building a rail train, I have another option that might be available. I had been thinking about what flats to use for these cars before they were in production. My initial thought was "cheapest" given the times. The Atlas undec 50ft flats would be very inexpensive...around $6/car or less with discounts. But then I started thinking about performance (i.e. weight) and decided that would be important and that I'd look a little further. The prototypical fidelity is secondary on my list of criteria. Most of these cars are kinda home-built anyway. My research indicates some of the BN/BNSF cars are 53ft but there definitely seems to be a lot of variation and given the limited choices of remotely appropriate n-scale flats, I won't worry a lot about matching the cars exactly. The cars I'd seen photos of for the BN/BNSF cars were--generically speaking--mostly of the fishbelly variety versus the straight sided flats like the IMRC 60ft tractor flats, for example. (subsequently I have found pics of cars that do look more like the IMRC cars, but I digress) Besides the Atlas cars, I only knew of a handful of flat cars that met the criteria. Following is my short list and weight: 1. Atlas 50ft Stake Flat (0.5 ounces) 2. Athearn 53ft GSC Flat (0.7 ounces) 3. Walthers 53ft GSC Flat (?) 4. DI/GHQ 53ft Flat (1.0 ounces) 5. Con-Cor 50ft Flat (0.7 ounces) 6. IMRC 60ft Flat (0.9 ounces) 7. N-Scale Kits 60ft Flat (1.0 ounces) 8. Micro-Trains 50ft Fishbelly Flat (0.7 ounces) As you can see, for the fishbelly flats the DI/GHQ car is the clear winner with regards to weight. The two 60ft cars might be comparable, especially the IMRC since it is the only other metal-deck car. I recalled that my LHS had one or two of the DI/GHQ cars so I decided to buy one and see what kind of car it is since I didn't own one. They actually had eight of them that they had bought from another LHS closure and gave me a great price on them so I bought all 8. It is actually a VERY nice car, and feels as heavy as any n-scale flat car can feel. The one major visual flaw also likely contributes greatly to the weight...solid drop steps on the ends. Normally I would probably fix this by filing it off, but in this case I think I will live with it to get the benefit of the weight. But, that may be where the story ends. These cars just aren't available anywhere. BLW showed some KCS in stock and I tried ordering but to no avail...they were actually out. eBay reported 9 in an eBay store but for $25 a piece, but those aren't showing up any more, and I wouldn't pay $25 for them anyway. Contacted my LHS and 2 other e-tailers looking for more, but no joy. E-mailed DI to see if they had any left, nope. DI said GHQ still had to tooling and that they were selling undec kits at one point. GHQ replied and said no kits, and no cars available, and that production would be a long shot, especially in a small quantity. I shot back asking what the magic number would be, and here's the scoop... -We would need to order at least 200 for a price point somewhere in the $12-13 range for JUST THE CAR body. No trucks, couplers, or decorating. The price I was given was less but we would have to allow costs for for shipping, splitting the packs, etc. (I would provide full disclosure of the details...I'm not in this to make money, just to get the cars done) Then of course shipping to individuals involved would have to be added. -Probably best if a dealer got involved to handle all that and front the money. $2000+ would be a challenge for most individuals, notwithstanding the other factors like risk. While 200 sounds like a lot, if we have only 10 folks wanting to build a 20 car train it's handled. I have my eight DI/GHQ cars and the N-Scale Kits rail bunks should be here very soon if not already. I am going to do some testing before proceeding, but please let me know if you have interest in these cars. I will probably emply some of the IMRC cars if we can't get this done.
Doug, Thanks for the detailed research. I was at the LHS today and found a single DI/GHQ 53ft in KCS which had a tag something like "number 155 of 350" so I can see how limited these were. It was in the sale bin but was still $12. I didn't pick it up since I really want to get the right flat to begin my SPMW train and want to have a single that didn't fit. From the excellent photos posted my Mr. Costello and others online, I really can't tell the length or manufacturer. Does anyone have access to the book (can't remember the name right now OERM or something) that lists freight car specs that could look up 5300 series or other number series SPMW railcar flats? I'd like to get 25 or so valid numbers. Pending an answer for the type of flat car to use, I might be game for the bulk buy in for GHQ if that fits better than the other options. The Walthers and Athearn 53' GSCs are in about the same price range ~$10-12 and I think the weight of the GHQ would really help this train.
So, just got my bunks and rail in the mail today. I am just wondering how other people are coming along. I am still waiting for cars. I do have a question though, how are people going to deal with the rail possible sliding on the bunks. Cody
I finally received mine last week, and I was going to work on them this weekend and post some info but I'll go ahead and make a few comments... 1. First off, some kudos...the RAIL is absolutely spectacular, looks-wise. And it seems like it is going to function VERY well also, but of course that will need some more data to know for sure. It flexes well horizontally and very little vertically so I think Peter got it right. 2. The only downside to the rail is the short 12 1/2ft piece kinda limits how you cut up the rail. I believe Peter said this was going to be changed in future runs so hopefully it won't be an issue. My train will now end up having 6'3" rail and that's only a few inches shorter than I originally planned so worst case I will drop one car off. Really not a big deal...a 7 foot train plus buffer cars, caboose, and locomotives will still look pretty good I suspect, especially for a home layout. This is of course assuming that you will use all 16 segments of rail which may not be practical anyway. 3. The bunks are gonna be a little bit of a challenge, I'm afraid. The first issue I see is the BNSF versions I received appear to be a tad WIDE for any of the flats I own, which is everything on the list about except the Walthers GSC. I'm not 100% sure on this yet, but it seems that at very least the outside bracing will extend past the sides. Probably not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things as long as it's not too much. I am going to see if I can set up a jig to cut the inside supports down a hair if needed. 4. In my batch I had two of the UP style bunks mixed in. Wasn't a big deal for me since I'm only planning on 18 cars. But, be sure and check when you receive the order so that you don't get right in the middle of the project and have to wait for replacements. 5. The castings are kinda rough in some places. Not unexpected maybe, but just be aware you may want to allow time for some cleanup with a file. With 40 supports and 80 crossmembers per 10 car kit, that's 120 pieces that may require filing, times two for 240 pieces in my case. 6. I may be completely wrong about this, but there appears to be a pretty serious screwup in the documentation. You will notice that the cross supports have notches for four rails. On one side, the notches have a flat casting running the width of the crossmember that at first glance and looking at the photo appears to be a base along the bottom, and the photo also appears to show this piece being oriented toward the bottom. I observed several breaks in this casting and was preparing for what seemed to be a potentially extensive putty job to smooth things out. I was curious how the rail would be held in place in these notches and initially from the photo I assumed it would press fit into the notches. HOWEVER, after further review, it occured to me that the casting was SUPPOSED to have gaps in it, and that the rail was designed to slide snugly inside the notches with the skinny part of the rail sliding through the gap in the casting. This seems painfully obvious now, but I still think the photo is showing the cross supports mounted upside down. Again, I could be wrong about all this but I almost made a big mistake (I think) based on the photo, or my interpretation of it. (I'll try to post photos of this when I get a chance) 7. Procuring the flat cars has been a challenge that exceeded anything I would have expected. I have 8 of the DI/GHQ cars for now, and will probably have to find a different model to complete my train. It seems the MTL 50ft fishbelly might be the best option outside of the DI/GHQ cars if they can be found at a reasonable price. Peter said he might make some generic cars specifically for this purpose but I'm guessing that will take time. (the price was definitely right though) Like I said, I'm planning on working on these this weekend, and things may go smoother than I'm thinking they will at this point. My enthusiasm has been tempered a little by the lack of available flat cars, the fit/finish issues, and the almost two-month trip my shipment took on it's way here. (not NSK's fault, but just added to the pile) But like I said the rail is outstanding and if that's all we get out of this deal I think it's worth it. And maybe I will be proven wrong, and my enthusiasm will return.
Upon further review, I'm just not sure about #6 above. There are a lot of the crossmembers that are solid castings and would take a lot of filing and carving to work in the manner I was describing above. ON the other hand, I don't see how the rail will stay in place otherwise. Looked at the photo again and it CLEARLY shows the solid edge to be toward the bottom. I still think the edge should be on top. Guess I will need to buy some of the dental files I'm always seeing at the train shows to clean out the excess. I'm sure Peter will chime in here to point us in the right direction.
Doug, Looking at the picture on nscalekits.com you can see that the top rack is the way you first described it. I believe this is correct also, after looking at it more. I have e-mailed Peter to see what the correct way is. I will post if I hear from him before you posts here. I would say that close to 1/3 of the racks I got have some of the slots already open. They will need to be filed down and also curved so that the rail can slide better when going around curves. Cody
