I am about ready to do some scenery for the very very first time, and I have a few questions. I read the thread in "Layout Design Discussion" about plaster, but something is still not clear. What is the difference between Woodland Scenics hydrocal and HomeDepots "Plaster of Paris". Except for the price. $8 for 1/2gal woodland, $7 for 25lb HomeDepot plaster. Can I use the homedepot plaster with same result ? What about papertowel in plaster vs. Plastercloth from WS. Plastercloth seems easy, but again $7.50 for 10sq ft. seems a bit pricy. What about Mold-a-scene plaster from WS. It says it's like modeling clay. Are there any (cheaper)alternatives ? Any comments will be appreciated. Thanks Jesper
Hydra-cal plaster is a very hard plaster,where as plaster of paris is a fairly soft workable(easy to carve) plaster.Hydra-cal is an expencive plaster that gets more so with a known brand name on it. You can buy the plaster-gause rolls from any medical supply a heck of alot cheaper then WS. Paper towels and plaster tend to be rather messy where as the gause-plaster is quite neat. Personnaly I can't justify the cost of Hydra-Cal plaster of the WS plastere gause rolls.
You can usually obtain Hydrocal (a USG product) from pottery supply supply places. In the Portland Oregon area I get 50 lbs of Hydrocal for $14. I can also get it in 100 lbs bags at a local cement dealer although they charge a lot more. That is still a lot cheaper than the Woodland Scenic price. I use a modified paper towel method that is a lot neater. I place paper towels over a support such as balled up newspaper, masking tape, mesh, etc. Then with a spray bottle I wet the towels so that they conform to the shape. Then with a cake icing spatula I gently trowel on the Hydrocal. After this has set I apply a finish coat of casting plaster or plaster of paris. Before this sets I use a stiff brush to smooth the plaster out and give it a little texture. I also use the Hydrocal for all my rock castings. They are strong and don't break easily when handled. Another product that I have used in the past is Fix-All. I can get it at Home Depot in 25 lbs bags. It is strong but tends to leach a yellowish color into any plaster that is applied over it. I personally would stay away from the Woodland Scenic products unless you have a lot of money or you only want a very small quantity of material.
Thanks for the info. I made a small test hill this weekend, using plaster - papertowel over a wire frame. It acutally came out kind of OK for a first timer, but I think the wire screen was kind of difficult to control (since it was only a test, I didn't bother staple it to the plywood), so I think I'll try cardboard strips + crumpled newspaper next and see how easy that is to control. I like the idea of applying plaster to the towel when it's already in place, it may make it a little bit less messy. When I bought the plaster, I was actually thinking of buying some FixIt to see how it would work for sculpturing the scene, and I was also thinking of buying some of this insulation foam o see how easy that would be tu use for mountains. I guess I'm in the experimental stage Thanks again. Jesper
With the chicken wire method, it is a pain latter on if you decided to cut some areas out and add or replace something. With the cardboard strips, it is much easier to work with years latter when you cut to modify the area. You don't have wire sticking out, or scratching you, or having to clip through it.
Another option is drywall mud. It comes premixed in 5 gallon containers. Dont know about the price, but I ASSUME its fairly cheap. I used a lot of plaster for scenery in the past, and I have found that Hydrocal isnt nessassary, just use regular plaster of Paris. 2 Plaster is MESSY cover everything you dont want plaster on. 3 Plaster also tends to be heavy, make sure you support it well. That mountain that looks just right now will sag a lot. 4 Add a bit of dark coloring to the final layer of plaster. Plaster tends to chip, and nothing is worse than a bright white spot in the scenery. Hope this helps....Mike
An alternative to screen wire or chicken wire, is the plastic netting you see at Garden supply places they put up overhead as a sun screen for the flowers. It is light, easy to cut, shape, and staple or glue to the table. Plaster and papier-masche both bond into it well. To add stiffness like on a large mountain, apply the screen, then a layer of plaster, allow to dry, then apply another layer of the screen, and cover with plaster of paris dyed, and allow to dry again. You can also mix various fibers, and foam "packing peanuts" into the plaster to reduce weight. Experiment, be resourcefull, like you have started. You will discover a way we don't know about, and we all need help, so let us know how you do it, OK?
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by watash: Experiment, be resourcefull, like you have started. You will discover a way we don't know about, and we all need help, so let us know how you do it, OK? <hr></blockquote> There was an article in MR about making waterfalls a couple years back. In the text, the author talked briefly about using paper towells soaked in white glue for his "hardscape." I decided to try it, and have now built three layouts using the technique! I build up the mountain areas with plastic trash bags and masking tape to get the shape I'm looking for. I then get Bounty paper towels (they perforate into half sheets), and pre-tear the whole roll. I buy a gallon of Elmers white glue at Staples for $11 (enough to do a small layout!). It is really messy, and unless you want to dig dry glue out of the hairs on the back of your hand, wear latex gloves. It will take a couple days to dry, and when it does it looks and feels like translucent human skin. Eerie! After it dries, I reach into tunnel portals, etc. and yank out all the plastic bags and tape. The shell that remains is very strong, lightweight, yet flexible. Perfect for portable layouts. Sometimes I just scenic the skin, other times I paint it with drywall mud first. It also takes Sculptamold and castings well. [ 28 October 2001: Message edited by: ten87 ]</p>
Woodland Scenics make some great stuff, you pay for what you get. A little less mess than using the plaster soaked paper towels. I use all kinds of plaster for different things. Rock castings do better with a good hard setting plaster, Hydrocal is a brand of this type, there are others. I use industrial paper towels, you know the kind that are in the towel dispensers in the shop/company bathroom. You can get this type of paper at any paper products distributing company. Note: Ask the company cleanup/maintenance crew for a package, if you ask nicely you will get several packs for free. I use a brown type that is a bit thicker than regular towels, it will not tear apart when loaded with plaster. As for support I use foam board for almost everything now. I can make the hills, and countryside almost the way I want them to be before I put plaster on the foam board. I use the plaster soaked towels a few places, but mostly just cover the foam board with a thin layer of plaster. This forms a base for any castings or ground cover to be applied over.
As I'm a part time contrator/carpenter, I get alot of home improvement jobs. In turn I get to dispose of alot of old fiber ceiling tiles... I use them cut into 2 inch thick sections, and in places stacking them like a stair case and then with 36 grit sand paper sand my heart out to form them into mountains or small embankments! This is one technique I do. Glue or nail the 2 inch pieces together.. I did get a decent deal on liquid nail for decks one time and I used some of the large tubes for some carpenter jobs but a whole crate for $50 is a steal so. I took the whole thing home and I use it alot on the layout! One other one is with plaster and large hole chicken wire and old bed sheets.... I don't waist old bed sheets if they are recyclable! I'll use them as you guys use paper towels or plaster cloth! But I rip the bed sheets in 6 to 10 inch widths and 1 to 2 feet lengths.... If you get folds. The mountainous regions don't have perfect land scapes either! So Use alittle plaster of paris the soft stuff and fill in where the fold may end up and make it look like a mounds of land.... This is yet another technique of mine... Then I also use 2 inch thick styrofoam beaded type (white) and sometimes in special really up close seem places i'll use the 3/4th inch blue foam. Being its tighter grain, and really forgiving if bumped or whatever I use this tenique out along the edge of my layout where fingers and bumping are possible so I don't have a HUGH earthquake to make me a hole or crack in the landscape... The styrofoam also makes nice gorges to do waterfalls or just deep cuts. Same with the ceiling tile.... [ 28 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
