I missed this thread. The latest edition of the New York Central Historical Society magazine, the Headlight, has an article written for Model Railroader years ago by the late Lansing Vail, all about these cars, with some good photos.
Great, I hope I didn't miss anything on the masters I built. I'll have to get a copy for the photos. Thanks for the info. I'm just about ready to cast another ex troop car conversion. This one will have separate brakewheel and roofwalk.
Based on the Lans Vail article, 1960 was when the inside door group of these cars were modified as such. Interesting, as they started receiving cars to be converted to the Express cars back in 1947. I have no personal experience with any of these, just depending on Vail's knowledge, which was usually flawless.
According to the Model Railroader article, NYC had 300 cars listed by The official register of Passenger Train equipment by January 1951. They state it appears there were two batches with the first being outside door cars and the second inside door cars. I believe some outside door cars were later converted to inside door cars. See this photo. http://http://www.flickr.com/photos/31038626@N07/3211595470 This is an ex NYC car (#9219) but it is different than most other photos of NYC inside door cars. Note the door opening is taller (goes all the way to the roof) and there is an upper door track. Perhaps these were cars converted in 1960?
"According to the Model Railroader article, NYC had 300 cars listed by The official register of Passenger Train equipment by January 1951. They state it appears there were two batches with the first being outside door cars and the second inside door cars." That's the same info I've seen...the first 60-something were built with outside doors, the rest had inside doors...I'd really like to delve deeper into this and find out when the inside door cars were in service...anyone with a pic? ~Bruce
So sorry I tried to help. Suggest you join the NYCSHS so that you can get your own copy of the Central Headlight magazine and read it for yourself.
First group (9200-9399) acquired from War Assets Adminstration and converted by Despatch Shops. Cars had Youngtown doors. Second group (9400-9499) acquired from Chicago Freight Car Parts Co. and converted by Despatch Shops. Cars had Youngtown doors. Third group (9500-9599) converted by and leased from Chicago Freight Car Parts Co. in 1953. Cars had Youngtown doors. Cars were returned to lessor in late 1962. Beginning in late 1960, 55 cars from first group and remaining 76 cars from second group received 8' 5-1/4" tall inside doors. If you doubt the veracity of this info, see post #29.
The MR article seemed a little sketchy on the NYC info, Since we don't have the article you refer to, we're just asking questions. No need to ruffle your feathers. Again, thanks for the info. It's a big help. I'll try to get a hold of a copy to add to my library.
looking forward to it! ...and this reminds me, I need to take a file to the MT frames of the two 'outside door' express cars so I can shift the MT Delrin ladders to the left. Did you just use a PE stirrup for this one? ~Bruce
Actually, your info is very much appreciated; until you had posted your initial comment, I had just assumed (dangerous, I know) that the inside door conversions were right on the heels of the outside door versions. It was your comment that caused me to question my assumption and want to further investigate...I've been burned before by just assuming a modelling variant, then finding pictorial evidence showing my initial assumption to be wrong! (I just acquired four of the beautiful "Santa Fe in color" series by Stagner...on one hand I was thrilled to receive them, on the other, I was secretly sweating seeing some of my previous conversions being proved inaccurate!...lol...I'm thankful, no such evidence surfaced!) I also Really appreciate the last info you gave detailing the conversions!... based on that I'm going to have to acquire a couple more outside door conversions....would you happen to have access to any photos of the outside door versions in the two-tone gray with striping? in the '97 issue of The Warbonnet, the issue that concentrates on ATSF's Fast Mail Express, there's a picture of an F3 Warbonnet set, leading the Fast Mail West on Topock Bridge....the caption makes note of an apparent NYC smopothside baggage in the two tone, but completely disregards what appears to be a NYC express box conversion in the same two-tone, just a little further back in the consist...no date is provided for the pic, but the status of the F3 'mods' peg the pic sometime in the mid-to-late 50's...also, the scanty info I have suggests that the two-tone versions were the leased ones....the ones you report as the third group, the 9500-9599 numbers...would that be accurate? Respectfully, ~Bruce
About the best photo I've seen of one of the 9500-series two-tone cars is this one: http://canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-9533.jpg If the photo you cite from The Warbonnet was taken between 1953 and December 1958, then the car in question would have to have been from the 9500-series. If the photo dates from December 1958, or later, then the car could also have been from either of the first two groups. A December 1958 drawing revision to the painting/lettering drawing describes a two-tone gray scheme similar to, but different from, that on the third group of cars. The sides are now dark gray; there is a 2' light gray band which starts 3' 7-3/16" above the side sill and runs across the door. No stripes separate the color bands. Lettering over the dark gray was Dulux white; lettering over the light gray was black enamel. A subsequent September 1962 revision to the drawing deleted the light gray band and changed the black lettering to white. Unfortunately, author Vail is unsure how many and which cars from the first two groups were ever repainted in the later 1958 two-tone scheme or final 1962 solid dark gray.
"About the best photo I've seen of one of the 9500-series two-tone cars is this one: http://canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-9533.jpg If the photo you cite from The Warbonnet was taken between 1953 and December 1958, then the car in question would have to have been from the 9500-series. " absolutely great shot...thanks! this would certainly be the scheme for the era I model-1957....(after going back to view the pic I mentioned...i, sheepishly realized what I was seeing was another NYC smoothside baggage...not this car in this paint...but a green NYC outside door converted box immediately follows the first NYC baggage in two-tone with striping) I'm guessing that these two-tone painted cars would have show up on foreign trains, even though they were painted to run with the century consists....if the smoothside baggage cars could find their way onto ATSF's Fast Mail, then an express boxcar in two tone could also... Again...I need to order more NYC headend car decal sheets! Thanks, ~Bruce
Found this to illustrate the December 1958 paint revision but the MicroScale set doesn't have the black lettering.
