Hi folks, I've been fiddling around with a trackplan for a while and now I would like some comments, please The layout depicts a Santa Fe branch line somewhere in Southern California, somewhere between 1945 and 1960. The trackplan is 'inspired' by the ATSF line in Anaheim, but since space is limited (so is my knowledge of the area by the way, but I'm catching up...) I've taken some liberties and adapted it to my needs. Most of the traffic is oranges, so there are a couple of packing houses, and a small icing platform, plus a couple of other companies. I don't know exactly how I'm gonna operate it (this is going to be my first real layout), but I think it has potential. Trains deliver cars at the small yard, and then a switcher can put them at the right locations. From what I understand, reefers are first loaded, and then they are being iced, before going on their journey to the east coast. I know the Santa Fe did most of their icing at San Bernardino, but then again, I have taken the liberty to create some extra switching moves for my layout (if you're wondering why the icing platform is a bit small, I've got Sanborn maps of Anaheim and the actual Union Ice co. there was rather small, about 120' in length, so it's prototipical The layout is L-shaped. The long leg is 325 cm ( 10' 10" ), the short leg is 240 cm ( 8' ), width is 55cm (22"). On the left side is a fiddle yard with 5 tracks, representing the rest of the ATSF On the right side is a sector plates, which can swith 3 tracks, it can hold an engine and a car (maybe two). If the trackplan doesn't show up here, you can find the trackplan at: San Juanita - trackplan I'm interested in hearing comments, questions and/or suggestions! Kind regards, Wilbert Vossen wilbert@rekonstrukt.nl
Interesting concept Wibert. Not many North American modellers follow this kind of process. The track plan shows interesting switching opportunities but I do have a couple of questions. 1) How does a "sector plate" work? 2) What is the fiddle yard mounted on to allow it to move from track to track?
At first look I think this has great operation potential. I am not sold on your sector plate however. (Robin - it's hard to describe, but it swivels on the right hand side and can line up to any of the three tracks - kinda like half a round table.) Here is why I am not sold - I don't think you are getting much bang for the sector plate buck (the buck being that realistic switching moves are happening 'off stage') I think you would be happy with completing the run around with a crossover and using the switch back to spot at 7 - actually I would reverse the switchback - 7 is the icing platform right? That will get a lot of switching so it should have a direct route to the main. That's my 2 cents for now.
I'd agree with Rob about reversing the icing platform crossover, if the majority of your outbound traffic is getting switched into there before it leaves then the track layout would more likely be set up to make that move easier. Ref the sector plate, I guess it depends on your available space, if you can extend enough to get the two extra switches in (even on a narrower extension board) it's probably worth it, but if you can't extend beyond that baseboard edge then having the sector plate makes a lot of sense to me. You're recreating the "off stage" operation of the two switches in a smaller area. About the only other mod I'd consider personally (i'm sort of 50% convinced as to the benefits ) would be a runround on the vertical axis. That would let you pull rather than push cars round the curve, and switch cars into both facing and trailing spurs in one trip, as it's drawn you'll have to shove the facing spur cars round the curve, switch them, come back, pick up the trailing spur cars, switch them, come back again. It would also allow you to have a second operator working the main yard whilst another was doing the other leg. The other side of the issue is that making it easier to switch might not be what you want from the layout, but I guess that's your call! I like the L shape, street running & crossing, and it looks like it will be great fun to work. Keep us posted on what happens with it, it's looking really good. All the best!
Hi all, just to answer some questions: about the sector plate, I think Yankinoz explained that pretty right. In practice it is just a piece of wood with a track (or more) on it, with a bolt through it at the end. You can use it to put an engine and a car on it and then align it to one of the 3 tracks... in a way it just replaces a couple of switches... Why did I use it? The switches at that for me don't create a special challenge, the focus is more on reefer traffic, the crossing with the SP, and switching the other industries. And I don't have the space to extend that part (that last section is already located in a closet ) The fiddle yard is mounted on free rolling drawer guides (help me out here, my English is too limited for such a specific thing), mounted flat instead of against a side. You could mount them that way too. I believe there are more such methods, but you'll have to look for them.... The crossover at the ice dock is indeed awkward... I think it is a good idea to turn that one around. The runaround on the vertical axis might be a bit difficult I think... space is limited (I drew up the maximum available space first, and then I tried to fit in the trackplan), and if you look closely, you'll see those small grey lines within? Those are the sections the layout is made out of, so I can't put any switches on those locations either... I was planning on wiring it for dual cab control, with the possibility for conversion to DCC later (cost is too high for me at the moment). I have yet to figure out how the electrical blocks will be divided, but I think I can make small blocks, so that I can operate it with two engines. I enjoyed seeing the reactions, and I'll keep you posted on the progress. Kind regards, Wilbert
Wilbert, Thanks for posting your plan. I think it looks like a great layout with great switching capabilities for such a limited space. It reminds meof a layout that has been featured in Model Railroader I just cant remember the name. I can see Geeps and SW'9s switching various reefer trains. Keep us posted on your progress I'm interested in seeing the finished product
Wilbert - Have you been reading Iain Rice's books, what with the sector plate and fiddle yard? About the sector plate, I always thought that the tracks leading up to it (three, in your case) all had to point towards the pivot point, sort of how tracks radiate away from a turntable. But yours are || with one another. Maybe a small point, but if you're really tight on space, like it sounds you are, it could be a show-stopper if tyou need to allow for it. [ 02 February 2002, 21:06: Message edited by: Bill Kamery ]
Colonel, it'll probably be a GP9 and a NW2, maybe even an RSD4/5 or a GP20 thrown in for variety, though not prototipical... But that's what I have at the moment Bill, The inspiration for the sectorplate and the fiddle yard is by seeing quite a few English layouts here in the Netherlands... amazing stuff! Anyway, they most of the time have a small depot or something and the fiddle yard is the rest of the world About the sector plate: you are right, the 3 tracks should point towards the pivot, but I was a bit lazy in this case... as long as I don't forget it when I'm laying track all will be fine Kind regards, Wilbert
Wilbert, Wire it for DCC and run one cab (with a 'pocket' you can turn on and off where you can park the switcher while a train comes in and out of staging.) I would not spend too much time or money on blocks and switches and two power packs - save that for a low cost DCC system - a second hand MRC system would be perfect for this layout. My 2 cents. (have you spent any time operating a DCC layout?)
Wilbert - I'd put a bridge/overpass just in front of the sector plate. There are a lot of real life places where the switches at the far end of the yard are beyond bridges, and it will allow the loco to keep leaving and re-entering the scene. If you havent already allowed for it - have a dead track-end on the sector plate, slightly longer than your longest loco, with a diode bridging the gap in the rail. That way the loco will always stop before running off the end, and reversing the controller automatically powers the track to let it come back into the scene. Of course, this doesn't stop a cut of cars from winding up on the floor if you push THEM onto the sector plate <VBG>
Hi folks, I went to my local club friday evening to discuss this plan and to talk a bit about wiring etc. Dual cab control is a bit too much too ask for such a small layout however, I think I'll still go ahead and do this anyway, but in a very straightforward way: cab 1 controls the horizontal leg, cab 2 the vertical leg, and the connecting curve can be controlled by both. This simplifies the wiring quite a bit but still leaves room for a possible second operator, and at least 2 engines similtanously on the layout. That will do quite nicely I think, and it still has the possibility to go for DCC later on. I have never operated a DCC layout before but from what I've read I've gotten quite enthousiastic. I'll try to find someone with a DCC-layout before I go off and buy me a system, just to be on the safe side The diode solution for the sector plate is a very good one, I'll keep it in mind. The other option is making the pivot point and large bolt that will stick up a couple of inches above the rail, that will also keep the other rolling stock from crashing to the floor But first I'll be off to make some modifications too this plan... and then I have to start saving money to buy the turnouts and switch-controls Kind regards, Wilbert
It won't be safe for your budget - usually it only takes a few minutes on a DCC layout to decide that DC is not an option any more Great idea with the two legs as seperate cabs - you can operate them as two RRs. But the vertical RR won't have a run around - that may be an issue.
Your staging is three feet long and your sector plate is two feet long. Thus it appears you don't intend to take a full train on it. I know you can use a sector plate for switching, and run around moves with the engine. It seems to me, you could shorten the sector plate if you only intend to take a few cars and an engine on it. Generally, I like your layout however I might try to get some more switching on the lower leg of the L.
Wilbert - IMHO DCC is a waste of time and money on a layout this size. Excuse me while I put on my asbestos suit.
Usually layouts of this size and stlye are run by one person. If that is the case and only one loco is run at a time, then DCC is not really necessary. Generally on a small layout, if there are two or more operator's, DCC makes even more sense than on a large one, as you are continually changing blocks. On our small layout of 2 by 8 1/2 ft, we have about 8 blocks and it is a pain as you are always changing something. When we bought our dcc for our large layout, still being built, it created a whole new pleasurable experience on our small layout - no more blocks.
Wilbert, IMHO, wiring blocks and using multiple powerpacks, selectors, etc... is a waste of time and money. If you are going to have just one operator, and run only one locomotive forever, make one block, and use one powerpack. Otherwise, don't waste your time and money wiring blocks. Do as you said and visit a DCC layout. You will see why in the future, every model railroad will use DCC. The old style block control, is a waste of time and money.
Let's stop the DC / DCC debate in this thread. (I know I started it.) If you wish to continue it, please my new topic in the DCC forum regarding the advantages / disadvantages of DCC on small switching layouts. Topic: DCC on small layouts? [ 04 February 2002, 21:38: Message edited by: yankinoz ]
