I know these IHC FM C-Liners are not all that good as modern HO locomotives go, so i ask you top of the line modelers not to tell me to throw them away or mount them on a better frame, etc., please. I do like their looks except for that ugly bumper in the front, and the ones i have run decently enough for not having flywheels. I got a bunch of them from IHC on clearance- $8.89 powered and $5.58 dummy- to use on my branch line. They will be painted in my own RRs livery, so prototype body details are not a concern. Mostly i'm wondering about any improvements that are inexpensive to improve how they run in general. Also any help on re-doing the front coupler area besides cutting off that ugly growth and putting a patch over it before painting. I've read stuff by a lot of you guys who tinker and tune-up locomotives, and would like to hear your thoughts on making my econo-locos as good as possible. I have 10 powered units and 4 dummys, so i'm pretty serious here. Thanks, Curt
Maybe i'm really out of it, but wasn't there a MR article recently about making some C liners better? I think i need to go look cus i may be way off here... Maybe they were Penny Sharks
Thanks for checking on that Tunnel. I have dug up a Model RRer article from april of '99, but it was the type of fix that said to take off the shell and throw away everything else-that's the kind of advice i DON'T need. Thanks, Curt
I don't own any IHC or AHM locos, so do not know specifically where their mechanical problems are, but there are two basic possibilities, motor or drive train. Easy enough to replace motor, and add flywheels, but if problem is gearing, I can't tell you what to do, because you asked me not to. Honestly, the cost and effort of replacing the motor makes the units not so much of a bargain anymore, doesn't it? It just occured to me that another problem may be electrical contact, the unit may only pick up power from one rail per truck. You can add wipers to solve this. Good luck. Gary
I guess i was not being clear on my request for help-i'm not having any specific problem-they actually run pretty well, i'm just wondering if their are any ways to maximize their potential. Maybe this is a philosophical issue-i've read so much stuff bad-mouthing these types of locomotives-inexpensive AHM and IHC units, that i figure i'm just not sophisticated enough to know they're not very good. The are not very noisy, they run well back-to-back and pull decent. I don't have a section of my RR up and running yet where i can see how they run over turnouts, so that could be a problem, but i can't really find anything wrong with them. Curt
Prior to the release of the Proto 1000 FM C-Liners Bob Boudreau did an article on "tweaking" the old AHM/IHC locomotive. While I can sympathize with you on not wanting to mess with the mechanical side (I'm not very mechanically inclined) there is no reason you couldn't follow a few of his cosmetic ideas on your locomotives. It's a matter of following the theory of take what you like and toss out the rest. Just because it's in print doesn't mean you have to do it. Drew
I wouldn't mind doing a little electrical work or somthing simple. If we're talking about the same article by Boudreau, he is saying not to keep anything but the shell of the original. Curt
Glad to hear you like the way they perform, as I will likely wind up with a couple too. If you go into that kind of a purchase knowing you will get what you paid for, then you won't be disapointed...even when the thing performs like garbage (I know, I have a steamer that cost next to nothing and I am just happy it moves).
Curt, Remember rule #1: It's your railroad, run what you like! Anybody has a beef tell 'em to refer to rule #1!! I remember having one of those C liners painted up for the UP when I was a young-un, back then they really didn't run good!! But I made that tunnel portal on the front look a whole bunch better by cutting it off and putting a monster snow plow casting in its place! You can still get that casting from Walthers too, it's made by Metal Minatures part #340-51 $3 so the price is right. The coupler attaches right to the snowplow casting. Anyway try one and see what you think! 2slim
2slim, now that's what i call a really useful idea! I found the one you were talking about-i had thought about using a snowplow, but had no idea how to figure out which one would work well. I'll round one up and tryer out-for $3 bucks each it would be great. Thanks much and keep the ideas coming. Curt
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> but i can't really find anything wrong with them. <hr></blockquote> Curt, I know absolutely nothing about these engines, but in light of the above I'd recommend the old adage - "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
Curt, I agree with Mike, if you like the way they run now the best thing to do is to keep 'em running that way. Keep the wheels clean and the motor and trucks lubed and they should be fine. I saw that Details West has a snow plow for a Alco PA that would give a different look to the pilot, that is if it fits! I would also read that MR article and see how that guy fixed the pilot on his, might be some useful info there. Also check out a Locomotive spotters guide to see which roads used C Liners. The reason I say that is you might add some road specific details which would indicate which road owned the units previously. Pennsy had a nifty antenna on their cab units which would be a givaway as to the previous owner no matter what color it was painted! 2slim
It sounds like you guys are NOT a bunch of nitpickers and i guess i let myself get worried about what others think when i am usually the champion of "do your own thing that makes you happy!". Thanks guys for the encouragement. I've about memorized that Model RRer article by Boudreau on C-Liners. He even has a pilot template printed in the article-a real big help since i'll be making 12 or 14 of them. I'll see if my hobby shops stock any snowplows and see how they'll look on the front end. I'll add the lower two steps of the ladders that hang below the shell and put on windshield wipers for details. The metallic copper paint i have with some dark green decal stripes will give it the Arizona copper country look my freelance Orca Mtn. RR represents. Going to paint up some IHC smoothside passenger cars with the same colors and have two push-pull commuter trains operating with the C-Liners along with the copper, coal, timber and cattle freights. Love this hobby-been doing it over 40 years, got about 40 more to go! Thanks for all the ideas and encouragement. Curt
I'm a pretty detail oriented kid but i'm not gonna force that on someone else. And i think everyone has a different part of the hobby that they really love most. So dont care about what others really say, and its your model isn't it
I have one of these beasts - it runs, but it's what you'd expect from a locomotive of that vintage. I started to redo the shell years ago, but stalled out - I don't model that period, and now there's the Proto 1000 C-Liner available anyway. It's a good value. As far as improving the AHM/IHC drive, I found that all you could really do with it was clean the motor and lubricate the gears, and that was about it. They aren't so bad, just not much good at low speed running. But hey, who uses a C-Liner as a yard goat? If they don't run well enough after that, the next step would be adding a new drive - I think Boudreau used the Athearn GP35, which is often available for cheap. Good luck! (Meantime, anybody want an AHM C-Liner?) B-Dubya
Changes to consider to improve performance that probably are with your (perfectly understandable) parameters. All are on a "if needed" basis: 1. Add wipers. 2. Add weight. 3. Correct wheel gauge. 4. Lube. 5. True up any alignments in drive system.
The mantra of an engineer, and a model railroader..... If it's broke, fix it. If it does work, take it apart. Mark P.S. I'm also one of those "make it better" types that refuses to spend a lot of money on it. I do Athearn's, so I'm not much help for you. I agree that the best efforts are probably in cleaning up the drivetrain and adding weight. The weight will smooth out the operation some, as well as greatly improve tracion and road worthiness. You can keep adding weight until you can just barely slip the wheels under full throttle. I've got 2 AC4400's that each weight close to 2 pounds, which improved them a bunch. The wheels can still slip, so I'm O.K.
Changes to consider to improve performance that probably are with your (perfectly understandable) parameters. All are on a "if needed" basis: 1. Add wipers. 2. Add weight. 3. Correct wheel gauge. 4. Lube. 5. True up any alignments in drive system.
Lots of good feedback guys, i really appreciate it. My big interest right now in C-Liners is that unique look, so i will continue to work with my shells by kitbashing and painting them for my branchline. As for the motors, etc., i will do the lube thing and make sure all the gears turn smoothly. As for wipers, i'm figuring this is electrical pick-ups? Any sites anybody knows of that tells how to add these? It looks like a wire runs to one side of truck on one end and the other side of the other truck. Wondering if this means that-never mind, i just pulled one of the trucks out of the frame, and it does only have wipers on on side, but it also has the identical mounts for wipers on the other side-i'm guessing if i order wipers from IHC-got the part # right here on the parts list-i can just run those extra wires from motor and solder in place? This is cool stuff! I just got a tiny, tiny glimpse of what it must be like to be "mechanically inclined" like Watash or John! You two always amaze me with your easy familarity with things mechanical- guess i wasted a lot of time in college studying the human mind when i could have been studying really cool and useful stuff like mechanical engineering. Oh well, never to old to learn! Thanks for any help on installing wipers. Curt
Curt, I've done the same thing on my C-Liners with the buy extra wipers, You can order them I got the parts number you'll need! Anyway I did mine the hard way as always I made my own wipers from half hard sheet (.005 thick) brass from Watash. That I had him get and sent to me and paid him for. I couldn't get it. No where in my area had it! Which stunk but.... I got it. And made the wipers from it added a small length of telephone wire to it and ran it just as the others to the motor. Make sure your left wipers are together and your right wipers are together in the wiring to the motor or you'll create a short and it won't run. This is your possitive and negative.. Keep them apart in all your wiring... It helps to color code the wire... Like Red for the possitive, and blue or black for the negative. [ 12 November 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
