Hi all, I know that Digitrax makes decoders specific to certain locomotives, but I also hear of companies like Train Control System that makes a sort of universal N scale decoder. Also Digitrax makes a universal Z scale decoder for some jobs like the Intermountain FT. I have decided to go DCC but I have like 40 locos to eventually convert. Thankfully they are mostly recent Atlas/Katos, but is there a universal decoder that I could buy in bulk? Thanks, Matt
By "universal", I assume you mean a wired-in decoder. You might be able to get a slight discount for a bulk purchase, but installation is more difficult than light-board replacement decoders, which are available for most recent "DCC-ready" diesels. Digitrax and NCE are two that make these. From what I hear, the TCS decoders are good wired decoders, but absent any major functional or performance difference, I prefer board replacement units. Even if you buy only a few of different models, most dealers will give you a discount based on the total number of decoders purchased. I have DN163I0's in my Intermountain Tunnel motors. DN163K0B's in my Kato F3's, a DN142 (wired) in an old Con-Cor PA1, and will buy DN163I?? for the Intermountain F3s I have on order. I also have some DZ123 wired decoders for various "old loco" conversion prodjects which are not "DCC ready". BTW, Digitrax makes board replacement decoders (DN163I1A and DN163I1B) for the Intermountain FTs, and I assume these will also be used for their F3s.
Yes, please define what you mean by "universal" - if you mean a decoder that works with a certain brand (Atlas, Kato, Lifelike, ConCor, etc) of engine, then they all would. The only difference between a Digitrax and Lenz (for example) decoder is how they are wired in (plug & play vs. hard wired) and the functions available with that decoder.
That's like saying the only difference between a Mini-Cooper and a semi is the number of wheels and how much they can carry! Althogh most decoders offer the same basic functionality, different manufacturers may implement functions differently, implement different CVs, offer different programming options, etc. Read the manuals for each to understand if the differences are significant for your application. I tend to go with Digitrax as that is my system, and DN163 decoders (of whatever physical configuration) all operate and program the same. I am intrigued by NCE's LED vs incandescent programming option for lighting effects (which Digitrax does not have, AFAIK), but am optimistic that I can get the results I want with the 163's. [ June 02, 2005, 11:55 AM: Message edited by: dstuard ]
All I'm saying is that I THINK you can use either a digitrax or lenz (or insert your favorite brand here) decoder in an Atlas (or insert your favorite brand here) engine - which is what I think the original question is. I don't think he asked about "different manufacturers implementing functions differently, implementing different CVs, offer different programming options, etc." I think he's trying to find 1 company to buy from to save a few bucks by buying in bulk.
Lenz makes a 511or 521W that can be hardwired. They are also coming out with a Gold mini series decoder that can be hard wired. Stay cool and run steam....
Universal can be very different from "Plug 'N Play",,,, if you want a drop in decoder, no each brand and possibly model will need different decoders. However, if you are good with milling, files, and soldering, then yes! You can use a "universal" decoder (or the same decoder in most) Harold
I didnt know there was any such thing as a 'z scale decoder'. I thought they were non scale specific...so one that goes into Z scale will go into G scale too if you want... its prolly just gonna be a LOT smaller. Am I barking up the wrong tree here? Is there some other tech reason for scale specific decoders?
In general, there are two things that get a decoder labelled for a certail scale. One is size, and the other is the amount of current they can supply. Decoders labelled as Z scale are smallest, and would be expected to provide the least current. Depending on how it protects itself, a Z scale decoder will probably either not move a G scale loco, or, not move it while providing a nice smoke effect for a short time. A G scale decoder, on the other hand, would be real hard to hide in a N scale loco. The two things are pretty much related, the size of a decoder is driven largely by the output circuitry required.
ahh, thanks Jibos I bet that z scale decoder that was moving a g scale loco WOULD provide smoke after a short while
disisme: The Z scale decoders would work for Z scale and N scale loco's. I often use the Digitrax DZ 143 decoder in some of my steamers. They have a higher amp rating than the Lenz 521W's and work better in loco's like the LL 2-8-8-2 which has a high "stall" factor. Stay cool and run steam.....
North Coast has also just released a bunch of N scale decoders in the last month. I'm gald to see our options expanding in N Scale. I've had three Digitrax decoders in HO and 2 have gone funky on me after installation. All three were installed the same way..wierd. I've had better luck with NCE decoders in HO but, no problems with Digitrax in N.
I prefer to use Lenz decoders wherever possible. I used the Lenz 521W for years. Now Lenz has come out with a mini gold series and that decoder is 2/3 rds the size of the Lenz 521W, which was one of the smallest decoders on the market. Needless to say, I ordered a bunch of the new Lenz gold min series decoders. They'll be particularly useful in converting many older Atlas and Kato loco's to DCC, as this will minimize the milling of the frames. Stay cool and run steam.... [ June 23, 2005, 09:54 PM: Message edited by: Powersteamguy1790 ]
I am not sure why you need to buy a decoder "in bulk"... most dealers resell decoders in a discount that will allow you to mix or match for a similar, low price. You must understand that Plug 'N Play decoders are different depending on the manufacturer (for obvious reasons...) But if you want to mill frames and hardwire, I am sure you could find a decoder that will fit everything Harold
Harold: I use the Lenz decoders in most of my hardwired loco's. I get a great price when I buy the decoders in bulk.. When I need Digitrax plug N' play decoders I buy whet I need for certain loco's. They all find homes in my older Atlas & Kato loco's . Stay cool and run steam....
I understand Bob, I have never had to hardwire any decoders, (other than the PnP that don't work ) Harold
Harold: Hard wiring decoders is another facet of DCC. It keeps things very interesting. Stay cool and run steam....
