How much assembly would be required? Specifically the mechanism, if I had to assemble that myself I fear it would have the running qualities of a 1970's era Bachmann. Otherwise a $400 ATSF 2-10-2 would certainly get my attention.
That is what this is all about. Would you pay $300 for a quality model of that one (or more) special steam locomotive that currently isn't available. For a DCC ready CB&Q S-4, O-4A, O-5 or M-4, provided it had the detail and running characteristics of a Tenshodo or RealLine, I would break my hand trying to write a $300 check so fast. Andy Tetsu Uma
Count me in on the $300 mark provided it has DCC/sound and will pull 30 standard 40' boxcars up a 2% grade. I've already invested $250 in upgrading my LL Berks with DCC/Sound (original engine, about $120; Tsunami another $120; misc. parts); another $50 for a better detailed, factory-ready job is an easy decision for me. There are two major problems with current N-scale steam: lack of prototypical details (steam details varied widely from road to road) and lack of pulling power. Manufacturers seem to slowly be addressing the latter problem; my GS4 will easily pull 30 boxcars up a 1.5% grade, as will my Walthers Y3 and Athearn Challenger. The former problem (details) now appears to be the more serious sticking point. John C.
I've paid absurd amounts for several brass units, therefore if someone offers what I need for 300 or less, I would take it. I've slowed down in my purchase of new motive power on the pike, for the rest of the year, I imagine the only engine I'll pick up will be an AC-8 from IM when they are released next fall.
I would gladly pay $300+ for some Milw Road specific steam. I'd love to see both the S2 and S3 class 4-8-4's as well as the F6 and F6A class 4-6-4's. As has been said, I would prefer that with that price came DCC and sound, but it would not be a deal breaker for me. Nate
Well I did spend almost $300 for a Athean Challenger with DCC sound, but I don’t know that I would spend that much again although I do someday want a Intermountain AC-12 with sound. I don’t know that a die cast steamer is all the important to me. Some of the detailed plastic ones I’ve seen look pretty darn good to me. biggrin:
What I would like to see are Pennsylvania steamers. For a I1 or a M1 I would pay until about $400, or maybe $500 if the model were really good. The point is also that at higher prices we would buy one engine, if any, but not several ones. If I think about Pennsylvania I1s, there were often several of them on one train. So a lower prive might bring higher sales Just as a comparison: this year Fleischmann announced a class 52 2-10-0 for 250 Euros, which are currently $360, Minitrix announced a class 50 2-10-0 for 300 Euros, which are $435. Usual street price is about 10% off the recommended price.
Just to clear up a few points. The ATSF 4-8-4 with the hinged smokestack etc will be one of the more expnesive detail sets. Other roads will have less expensive detail sets. The time it takes to assemble is dependent on the level of the details being used. I am not sure about the time it will take for the modeller to install, but all of the chassis has been designed to hold a plug interface for the decoder. Which decoder will be determined by the size of the locomotive. Again the idea here is to have a generic drive chassis that can be configured with the drivers sizes as needed. Next you select the boiler and so on. Just as I said, similar to the core passenger cars with the brass sides. Sometime in about October, the actual announcment of the company will be made with a selection of about 8 different prototypes for about 4 roads each. My connection is only that I have been hired to work with my former company manufacture the the units. These will be all Made in the USA, in the great state of Arizona.
I don't know about $300.00, but maybe 150-200 bucks.. I got two shays for 270 and that works out to 135.00 each. The goose was 150.00, I got several cars and a 4-4-0 for almost 120.00. Am thinking about a 2-6-0 to round out my list of engines. Maybe not your short list but its a long one for my wallet!! :tb-embarrassed:
Regarding the unit you are testing. Is it just a mechanism? or a complete locomotive? If only a mechanism, how does it run? And how difficult was the assembly? If it is a complete locomotive, what is the detail level, Model Power cast on details or Bachmann Spectrum 2-8-0? Have you verified the pulling power of 'over 100 cars' w/o traction tires? If so was it 33' empty hoppers, or a general mix of cars? Or some other? And what wheels were on the cars?
$300 is a bit steep, but it could be worth it for one of L&N's M1 "Emmas".... then again I could jump to HO and pay $1,500 for a brass M1!
Still a bit vague on whether the drive chassis will be assembled and ready to run, that would be the clincher for me and I'm sure a lot of other mechanically challenged guys. I can stop putting detail parts on when they get to small to see and the engine will still run. The first paragraph sounds like a hint that there will be other Santa Fe engines possible. I may have to work some overtime to fatten up my credit card.
Sorry, not meaning to be vague. The drive mechanism is fully assembled with the selected drivers in the order. The boiler just drops on and all of the details are in steam lines and sand domes etc. I completed a sample locomotive in about 3 hours. All that remains is decaling the numbers and road name. After some touch up paint, it may give my brass units a run for the money. Pulling power was based on a simulated load, hoppers fiilled with lead shot to weigh out at about the load of 100 cars or so. The first demo unit pulled 80 car effective load, and the second run pulls signifigantly more. It pulled a simulated 80 car load up a 2% grade with no problems, no traction tires. I have now said about all I can.
Well... since I already have a bunch of them that cost over $300.00 discounted from $400.00+... I had to reply YES. Times do change... and in a few years I'd likely say NO. Now that doesn't mean that I would buy anything that was that expensive... but... since I'm a fan of historic trains in general... I might buy something even if it's not relevant to my era or favorite roadname/region.
BTW.... I'm surprised that Kato was able to make a GS-4 that has an MSRP around $200.00 (originally $198; now $220). This prototype is so unique that it would most likely be purchased by western road modelers only... specifically Southern Pacific enthusiasts. This is why I was guessing they would be the next one to bring out a completely new steamer like an FEF or a Hudson.
Thanks for the clarification. I think you've given enough info to keep us watching for further announcements, you've certainly given us more than the big name manufacturers do about future products.
Not only would I, but I already have. I know it's not for everyone, but the the question was for a specific Prototype. As Darren posted D&H, Yes. I will add to that DL&W YES and if anyone built some of the very unique D&H Steamers I would certainly mortgage the farm. A few years ago, a one of a kind, scratch bashed, DL&W 4-8-4 Pocono, built by a noted modeler came up for auction as did some of his other prototype specific steamers. I had to make a choice, as I couldn't afford all of them !!! I chose to go after the "Pocono" because besides the few 4-6-4s that they had, The 4-8-4 was the Big Power and a signature locomotive of the DL&W. I know the work that goes into a "building" a prototype specific n-scale steamer. With a quality mechanism to start with, 300 bucks is cheap given the hours of work that goes into it. Now if you model the BIG roads like UP, SP, SF, NP, GN, Pennsy, NYC, the good stuff is out there, even if you have to fork over the bucks for brass. But for us little road modelers either get out the saw and xacto or the wallet. My time is getting scarce, I'll bring out the wallet or do without ! Darren, we can only dream about some D&H 2-8-0s or how about a 0-8-8-0 to shove your train out of Carbondale?
I think that while the GS4 is unique to SP, the Daylight version at least, sold to model railroaders who don't even remotely model the lines where it ran. I know because I have one and my brother who models the PRR has a Freedom Train version. I'm sure the plain black ones that don't have the 'ooh, pretty, shiny thing...must have one' appeal didn't sell near as well. I'm sure more than SP modellers have Cab Forwards as well, again I have one even though I'm pretty sure they didn't get anywhere near Texas in regular service, While it isn't as colorful as the Daylight it appeals to the 'Wow! that's unusual...must have one' in us. Then there's the Big Boy probably the one American steamer that every model railroader/railfan in the world has heard of, I admit I don't have one of those because I like the Challenger better but I'll bet the modellers who bought them that actually model the couple of divisions of the UP where they ran are a very small fraction of a percentage of the number Athearn, and Rivarossi before them, sold. An FEF that everyone knows from excursion service or a well known icon like the NYC Hudson might sell enough to be done by one of the big manufacturers but we need more than the icons. Even an SP, UP or NYC modeller couldn't accurately model his railroad with just the engines mentioned above.
