Ok I know a fair amount about how Metra operates and it has not changed over the last 15-20 years with the exception of adding more trains to established routes along with extending a few routes, but one thing that has not changed is that there seems to be 1 or 2 double headed trains per route in in the evenings. On the BNSF this happened with the Es as well as the F40s and I have seen it on other routes as well. Why is this? Is there an imbalance of power? Every night? The same train on the BNSF line back in the 90s had the bouble headed units, it was an express to Downers Grove about 5:10 (through la Grange). The trains have not grown in length as the platforms can only handle 8 cars. So what is the reason for this. If the train was any other than that 5:10 I would wonder what happened. Can an one explain, an imbalance of power I can understand every once in a while, but same train every night and what seems like on every line...that causes me to wonder, any ideas? thoughts? Thanks.
From the April 2008 On the Bi-Level: What’s that? Why do a number of UP Northwest line trains use two locomotives? When I have seen this, I noticed that these are not the longest trains? -Jack E. UP-Northwest (That is not something unique to your line, Jack. Double headers as the railroad folks call them are out in other locations on occasion as well. The goal is to have an extra engine out on the railroad in case of a mechanical problem elsewhere. It is one method used to try and minimize any delays that come up. Almost, but not quite, like having a spare battery for your car. – OTBL)
Thanks, that answers part of my question, but then why is it alway on the same train on the BNSF line at least?
Those are heavy trains! The power is needed to maintain the schedule otherwise those heavy trains would be burning out traction motors every day! I know from experience, those things load real slow when the train is heavy and on the BNSF/METRA Aurora line where I worked, seconds do count, and they add up to minutes quickly. During the "dinky parade" time is paramount to proper operation. Just one train running late messes up the whole durn schedule. The dispatchers have those crossover movements timed to the second! There are seldom any "spare" locomotives to be had. The same with coaches. When a mechanical problem occurs, it usually happens out on the line. Time,nor the operation,allows the crews to cut off a second locomotive from a train that has one. First of all, there would be no crew to operate the "spare" locomotive for its switching/hostling move. Crews have to remain with their train until relieved. Secondly, it would just take too long to swap out locomotives. It is an involved process and a brake test needs to be conducted. It is time consuming. The procedure when a train "dies" enroute is for the following train to tie on and shove the dead train to its destination terminal. I have done that before! Now what you have is two trains off schedule and the possibility of damaging the power on the shoving train since it now has a double load. The BNSF will operate some trains with a second engine as a backup when it is paired with a locomotive that has been in for non-scheduled repairs. That is a "just in case" scenario. So to recap, the double-header is due to the heavy passenger loads those trains carry.That is why it's the same train or trains every day. Those trains need the added "ooomphh" that a double header can provide. Charlie
Charlie, thanks for the reply, Maintaining schedules I thought of, but because of the trains being the same number of cars as the others (8). I just didn't think the weight was the issue since I figured that all 8 cars trains leaving chicago, weighed about the same. I can see the extra oomph needed withthe F40s due to them having one prime mover, but wht then wi the Es whrn they had 2 per locomotive? BTW I understand about cheching for maintiance issues on non scheduled units...were they regularly the lead or the second? i'd assume second. Thanks for replying, this really is interesting.
The lead unit. the 2nd unit could be kept isolated. Otherwise you would have no way of knowing if the "repaired" loco was loading properly. You would also want to keep an eye on the annunciator panel to see if a defect occurs. Train dynamics are different on each run. Those 8 car trains may carry a higher passenger count on their WB express. They need to achieve & maintain track speed as quickly as possible. If there is a need to reduce speed or stop enroute, then again it is necessary to accelerate to track speed ASAP. I can tell you that coming up that Union Ave curve & grade, you can really feel the power straining to get up that grade and that track segment is where the express trains need to accelerate to track speed. For the locals and/or skip stops it doesnt matter so much since they may be stopping at Halsted St and/or Western Ave. Those are also shorter trains and they dont carry much of a passenger count WB. On the job I last held regularly, our final WB was a 5:20PM semi-express to Hinsdale(stopping at Western Ave only)and after Hinsdale it was local to Rte 59(our last stop)the train pulled directly into Hill Yard after Rte.59. We had a small group of passengers who rode that train regularly to Rte 59 since it got them to Rte 59 five minutes before the express. The express train left about 15 minutes later but we still beat them to Rte 59. If you've ever witnessed the flurry of activity at the METRA parking lots after a train arrival you can readily understand why those passengers appreciated the extra 5 minutes! Charlie
Charlie, thank you so much for taking the time to answer the question in such detail. I can understand exactly what you mean now about the union ave curve, I've seen photos and videos of the commuters and even #5 coming out of that curve. I used to sit at Stone Ave. Station and watch the flurry when I could. I don't know if you ever ran on the 2:20 east bound 1268 which reached Stone Ave by 3 pm, but there was a conductor on that train that was so nice (I forget his name it's been 9 years) I would be heading home from that high school next to the tracks and would see him almost daily. I'd even wait incase the train was late to say hi. I honestly have to say that is about the one thing I miss about that station, was the crews running the train, always friendly and the station agent and the janitor Harold (he was the former station agent back in the late 80s.
I held 1268 as a brakeman on several different occasions. Sorry I'm at a loss for who the conductor might have been. I worked with several different crew members. 1268 was a pretty good job. I got to know a bunch of passengers who were regular riders on one of it's WB trips. The job didn't pay squat! I think it was the lowest payer on the suburban schedule. I used to bounce around from suburban service to the brakemans extra list to yardman at Eola. I had gathered enough seniority to hold regular jobs. I got tired of the extra board so I hung around the yard (Eola) for a long time since I could hold a good 2nd shift job(East Yard) It had good days off and we could usually get a "quit". I realized I could start holding some better "dinky" jobs and make more money in suburban service. I was able to hold Job #1232 for the longest time. It was a real worker but a good payer. I didn't mind the work, I was in it for the$$$$. Then I went into engineers training,completed it,was promoted but not "set up". I went back to #1232 and held that until the summer of 2004. I decided then that I was going to retire. I was "set-up" briefly on the passenger engineers extra board, took a medical leave until I could officially retire and then I retired officially in October 2004. I dont regret it. I miss the people I worked with and a bunch of passengers I made friends with. I miss being on or near the trains but I don't miss the crazy hours and the calls in the middle of the night and the countless hours I spent in freezing weather,snow,sleet,rain,dodging lightning bolts in the yard nor do I miss being away from home for hours on end when I worked pool freight. It's not a job for a family man, but by the time I began railroading, most of my parenting plateaus had been experienced(graduations,communions etc). When I worked 1232 as a trainman, we carried a lot of high school kids from Fenwick, Benet Academy,Rosary,Trinity and Marmion Academy. I used to conduct a "word of the day" seminar for the Fenwick kids on 1232! LOL Charlie
Hey, Yes,the E-8's had 2 prime movers,but they added up to only 2,250 hp. An F-40 has 1 prime mover & its 3,000 hp. If they're like NJT,the engines are cut back & load(take off) slow. Hi Charlie:tb-cool:
Charlie, I love hearing the stories, any more? I would have thought all runs were hard work why were some easier? Maybe those were the expresses. The units were all rebuilt to E9 2400 horsepower standards in 1973, 1978 in Boise. But I guess you are right abouut the 2400/3000.... 9900-9908 were E8s and rebuilt to E9 standards 9910-9925 were E9s to begin with This begs another question, why was there no 9909? There wasn't one built in the 70s rebuilt but why not? Superstition? But if that were the case I would have thought 9913 would be the one.
IIRC one of the trains in the AM rush also carries an extra loco? Similar scene but running EB instead of WB. One morning I was in La Grange when a WB hit a hardware truck trailer at speed. Good thing nobody was waiting in the station! Screwdrivers were flying everywhere. Nobody got hurt. My best memories was riding the green E's the weekend they were to be retired. It was fun to pick up an EB at La Grange, head to CUS, out to Aurora & the new station, then back to CUS before returning to La Grange. Had a blast with some of the photo runbys. At least 3 of the BN E's made it to Nashville. They could have been used for the commuter train, or as parts for the Tennessee RR Museum trains. The old Broadway dinner train used a pair of E's painted in NYC colors. IRC those E's now have a new home somewhere in NY. Sadly, it appears the BN E's rusted away waiting for a call that never came. The US flag stickers were still in place.
You got it!! They are slow loaders! They also wont load when there is brake cylinder pressure with the independent applied. I learned a trick from some of the other hoggers, some of the older F-40s would start to load with less than 10lb brake cylinder pressure so just as we were ready for the highballs from the crew(the highball is passed from rear to front and we take the conductors highball as the "official")we would release to less than 10lbs b.c.p. and take throttle 1, she would start to load and pull slack,when we got the conductors highball,kick off the independent and rip out on the throttle. It does help to keep to time with those slow loader beaters METRA has! Not all of them would do that little trick, but it was one of the ways to stay on top of the timetable. Charlie
Yup, those express trains were a snap to work. When I was on the extra board and I would catch one of those jobs, I would tell my wife that "I have an old man's job" today. I called them that cuz they were all high sennie old heads working them! They were also good payers! Some of those expresses only had 6-8 stops PER DAY! They would have 1 or 2 stops on the west end and run express to Chicago. The next trip would likely be a deadhead movement WB to Aurora or one of the other stops on the west end. Then take another train with 2 - 3 stops on the west end and express again to Chicago. Then have a 6-8 hour "respite"(layover) and the final WB would be express to say Naperville and then Rte 59 and finally Aurora. They were easy to work cuz you had the better part of an hour to do a ticket sweep. There were very few cash fares to collect as most passengers had monthlies or 10 rides. There are 26 stops on the "Aurora Racetrack" including end terminals. on job 1232 we made 25 of the stops,had a 5 hr respite after the first trip. Our 1st WB made all 26 stops, our next EB made 24 stops and the final trip was WB with a stop at Western Ave.,express to Hinsdale,local to Rte 59 and then pull directly into Hill Yard. 3/4 ths of our work was accomplished between 1:30Pm and 6:10 pm. We had very little layover time between runs. As I say, it was a worker. Lots of cash fares. But once you knew the routine, and everybody had their job routine down pat, the job was easy. And as I mentioned, it paid well. I think I told the story about a METRA conductor friend of mine(now retired).He worked the Milwaukee District Line to Big Timber Rd. With the overtime that was built into that job and with his sennie, he made 95K(you read that right!) p/yr. I mentioned to him once that you probably had to be "really old" to hold that job. He said "Nope", other than himself his crew was about 5 yrs sennie. He said nobody wanted the job cuz it was a worker. Hell, if we had a job that paid that well on the BNSF, you couldn't even THINK of holding it unless you had 30yrs or more! LOL Charlie
Actally, I have a list that has kept track of most of the es, I posted it here a long time ago, Survivors! - Page 2 - TrainBoard.com I have an updated list on my other PC and if your interested i will post it.
I can see why the locals were the "worker" and the expresses were the "payer". Actually I could hndle working that job, I love to ride the rails, and even though I know it was work, it would be fun. No you have not mentioned your friend...yikes, thats a heck of a yearly pay.
yes! METRA does pay well. We have had a lot of guys jump ship and hire out with METRA. Both trainmen and engineers. I had thought about doing that once or twice. I was thinking of going to the Electric Division. They had some jobs that originated in Chicago at Randolph St. Another METRA friend of mine who held IC seniority, told me that I could probably get hired and hold a job out of Randolph St. Nobody wanted that terminal apparently. It would be ideal for me cuz I could take public transit both ways to work. That idea fell by the wayside when the retirement law was changed. I knew then that I would probably retire early. Charlie
I remember that incident quite well. Really chewed up the WB La Grange platform shelter! The loco was METRA #195. I also know the hogger. He has got a good reputation for keeping on time. He is also a hoot to know and work with. He said that when it was obvious that he was gonna take out that trailer,he hit the deck,prone! Tore up several cars in the parking zone too! Charlie
Thats what my uncle thought as well, and so did I replaed witha HEP generator but a couple of my books led me to believe that the units still had two engines...as well as some conversations years ago with some BN guys in Chicago. Charlie or anyone else confirm or deny these allagations?
