So I was totally happy with my N scale track plan of a 2'x4' switching layout, but now I've got the ability to do a 2'x11 1/2' shelf type layout. The problem is I need a continuos run loop somehow. My 3yr old is a train nut and him watching trains run will go a long way in our overall enjoyment of the layout. I'd posed a question previously about a removable loop, but I've decided to see if there may be a way to do it as a part of the layout. If I put curves on either end, that gives me about 10/11" radius on either end so there will be about 9' if switching area with a depth of about 18". Will I be able to run my Kato ACE's and AC4400's on that tight of a radius? I should be able to camoflauge the loops so they're not too prominant and will still give me the shelf switching I wanted. I havent seen any links or photos of shelf layouts with a loop attached, so if any of you have done this or know of links or photos, any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks also for any comments.
Can you add a bigger blob at each end to facilitate a larger radius? I think you would be more satisfied with it if you could muster a 16" or 17" minimum radius.
A couple of suggestions: You don't need to lose 2' from your layout for the curves - remember that 75% (I think) is still inside of the curve, so you can use it for track (it just needs to start bunching up in the middle, so maybe a single track and an industry). If you want to hide the curve and keep most or all of the real estate, you could use a grade - the outside tracks dips down and enters a tunnel (while the other tracks could rise at a more gentle grade), allowing the loop ends to be placed under the layout. Just be sure to account for the overhang of your longer equipment. As for the curves themselves, you shouldn't have a problem with 11" curves, any modern Kato/Atlas diesel will do them even if some look silly because of the overhang. Most, including the Kato AC4400, will run on 9 3/4" curves and many Kato and Atlas 4 axle diesels will even run on 8" and 7" curves! Your big problem is going to be is couplers - longer rolling stock using very short or body mounted couplers might derail if the effect of the overhang seperates adjoining cars beyond the couplers maximum reach.
Here's my 12'2" x 2' layout with 3' bulges on the end. Designed as a continuous-run layout with some customers and switching as opposed to a switching-first layout. 16" radius - more than enough for longer engines and cars. My 89' Autoracks run well on it.
Thanks for the replies so far. There's no way to "bulge" the ends. I can see how that would be better, but 24 to 26" is as wide as I can go. I've been looking at some small layout links on the web for some inspiration, but most shelf layouts are insustrial themed and don't have the continuous run option.
12" radius shouldn't be a problem. In maintaining a switching layout theme, could you have the return portion of the loop hidden behind a low backdrop or structures?
When I started my current layout it did not have continuous running I add turning ends that were the same width as the rest of the bench work, 24 inches. The image below is what the track plan looked like after the turning ends were added The end on the bottom left was hidden by an elevated town as seen below. Here is the right top end (sorry about the size) Before the layout got moved there was an industry inside the loop. Keep in mind that this only 24 inches deep. Hope this helps, Gary
That's what I'm thinking. I've always thought a low hill or something so you could just see the trains so it's almost like railfanning and going "hey, look whats going on there" would be cooler than a backdrop. Since I'm gonna do more of a rural theme I'm hoping that will work.
in addition to the back of the loop, you could also hide a staging track behind that hill for more operational possibilites. It would only take up a feww more inched of your width and you would already have the scenery in place to hide it.
If continuous running is the object, you don't necessarily need loops, you can use automatic reversing detectors. They're obviously not a good solution if you're running long trains, but if you're running only a few cars for switching, it might be a good alternative. You can run a bypass track along side your mainline, add turnouts beyond the end of the last car, and add turnout controls that is activated by the reversing relay. It will run in direction on the main, and the opposite on the bypass, and you could even run two trains at once in this method, as long as they were spaced out so they don't reach the turnouts at the same time. You could even program the delay function on the reversing relays to control this.
Check out this site: All-Gauge Model Railroading Page It may help you to figure out options that you may have, Smoke:tb-cool:
With these limits you can only "transition" the curves--that is, incorporate a spiral easement--and there is really no magic bullet that will put an 18" radius curve on a 24" wide table--obviously. Geometry is pretty strict in its mathematics.:tb-biggrin: I'd look for some "escape" space outside of your space constrictions. Can you find another space, perhaps 90 degrees off, for a larger loop?
Unfortunately, I'm limited to the constrictions of one wall. I've never been a fan of tight corners and want this to be a project that looks appropriate and keeps my interest. But part of that is going to be making it fun for my little guys to watch trains. I'm going to look into trying to figure out ways to camoflauge the curves in the ends without tunnels so they'll fit with my rural theme.
People and their minimum radious issues... If all you have is two feet, then you must use the ever popular 11" radius curves. I say go for it and have fun.
Hopefully pictures of my layout will help you in your quest. My B&M 6X3 uses 16" minimum curves mainly because I had room to do that. However since I consider this layout small, I consider it a switching layout with operations running point to point. here is picture example #1. The track with the diamond is the B&M main line, the track that crosses it is the Maine Central and the track that parallels the B&M main is the branch. Technically the "branch" is continuos. Most of the switching is done on the branch with a large siding for my concrete plant and a small industry park near this picture. In this overview the top right and second top right area of track is hidden for operational times. The curve on the lower right hand section of the branch is a "spur" for one of the buildings of the park and cars are spotted there durring operations. The upper section just behind the large curved siding is just for pushing / pulling cars going into and out of the concrete plant. That said, I love operations but since I want to take to shows, people want to see trains run, so rather than terminate the connection, I saved the loop and will hide the section with natural view blocks such as terrain, trees and buildings. You can do the same thing in your area, in fact hide the curves on either end all together and even block the back section of track with modular walls of industrial buildings. Maybe hide either end of the curves with a highway overpass or do what they do in cities and build the streets and buildings over the tracks. There are all kinds of ways to hide the curves, regardless of track radius. Does this make sense? Jim
Jim, thanks for the primer on how you figured the problem out. I'll continue working on it with suggestions from you guys as well and I'm sure something will come about.
