I am thankful to all that have helped me so far, my first (and probably my last) G-Scale layout is moving along. The yard is completed and now I need to get out of the yard with single tracks at either end that will be used to connect them to two separate loops. My property slopes down from the yard, so I will have to compensate not only for the grade of the property, but I also want to build the layout elevated so my knees and other joints don't die in the process of operating. I will need to go from a height of 36" at one end of the yard "board" down to a level layout which will be approximately 1 1/2' above the ground level. My original idea was the HDPE lumber thing, but my soil is not highly conducive to just sinking 2" square posts in the ground (this is one of my alternatives) I have built stringers of HDPE lumber that have not been shaped yet, but it is my intention to use them as the base for the curves that I will need. I plan on using either 2X6's or 5/4'sX6 for the straight portions of the layout. The actual loops (there will be two) will be level, with a minimal amount of switches involved on the mainline. The only "real" grades will be those that are necessary to get to these loops, and they will be held to a maximum of 1%. Minimum curve diameter on my mainlines will be 20' and on sidings and spurs it will be 10'. I am using Aristo .332 Brass track and I personally run battery power, but I also have track power for those that run with that source. Here's the problem, the economy has put a serious crunch in expendable income, and most of my equipment and materials has been purchased for many years. Yes, I have over 1500 feet of track, 35 locos and over 175 cars. I have to use battery cars for my engines as I cannot afford to put batteries in all of my locos. I only have a few locos that have self-contained battery and sound. I live in New York State and the range of temperatures is fairly large, we have had days where the temps drop below 20 below (not very often), and above 105 (again, not very often). My layout is in the woods, so the hot temperatures run about 10-15 degrees cooler than in the sun. I am looking for a method that will allow me to build this elevated portion of the layout with a minimum of problems, as well as not breaking the bank. My primary concern right now is to get an operating layout, I will scenic it (in places, not the entire layout) as soon as I get the operation part down to minimal problems, so, what it looks like when it is elevated is not my top priority (I am more concerned about reliability, and minimal maintenance). I don't mind the occasional twig or leaf (or leaves when the fall comes, literally), but I would prefer to not have to worry about heave and level to much. I know this is a tall order, but I would really appreciate any thoughts about how this type of problem has been solved, particularly with the parameters involved. If you look at the picture, these two loops will be coming into the track that is on the right hand side. Thank you again.
every project involves money even if you are the laborer Don't I know it, all my projects involve finances and looking for the least expensive way to meet 'em. The labor is my time but materials cost money. Other than moving earth with large machinery to build a raised berm of earth to place your track or trucking in fill for roadbed or trenching and building some cinder block wall footers the only alternative I see is sinking 4x4 posts in the ground to attach your pressure treated wooden roadbed to. Which is your original plan if I'm understanding correctly? Maybe stake out your track path and hire a fellow that has a machine auger attached to a small back-hoe for digging fence post holes along the path for you to level off your post by pouring in some rock for drainage and also adjust post height. They charge by the hole so maybe call and get an estimate you can always rent those handheld motorerized augers but at my age that would be to much for me to even attempt.I have dug post holes with a pvc pipe adapted & attached to my garden hose and using water pressure to bore for me but I see your yard and there is a lot of tree root systems to dig through I would go with getting an estimate from the machine equiped post hole digger guy say to start at 50 holes. If I come up with any other alternatives I will pass the along.
Thank you so much. Would I have to sink the 4X4's below frost level? I'm guessing that I will have to have posts about 24" apart, does that sound reasonable? How long would these posts hold up before they rot out, any ideas? Sorry for so many questions, but I really appreciate your response.
On my property which the water table here in Fla. is if I dig 2' I hit water,I replaced my wooden fence after 15 years,I replace a 3rd of the 4x4 fencepost due to being rotten and that was without stone drainage at the bottom of the hole. I would span the poles out to 36" 2 linier boards can rest atop of one post just like doing a fence. I would due a test set at that span and see what happens as far as warpage to the roadbed board before you get to far ahead of yourself. Alot of things are trial and error.
Thank you again. What type of stone should go in the bottom, round or "jagged"? How much should I put under the 4X4?
Frost Level The frost level is a big killer on alot of wood projects, I know since I live in New Jersey. When we build decks here in NJ we don't sink our 4 x4 beams into the ground, rather we pour a small concrete pad down where the 4 x 4 beam wil go and then put metal aluminum feet on those support beams. Not only does this keep the frost away from the beam, but also allows our decks to float and mainly just get anchored to the house with lag bolts. I would suggest maybe also setting up a floating elevated train layout. I know you said you want to save money on a budget, but if you really want this railway to live forever I would suggest using composite decking material, it comes in many colors and it lasts a long time while holding up to weight. You have alot of rolling weight, I would build this layout using wood deck specifications as far as support spacings, better to be over board than to build under spec and have a collapse. Make sure you drill small drainage holes in your layout to get arid of rain water. This would be a expensive way to go, but would be around for your great grand childrens children to enjoy.
Thank you. I built my deck the same way, except I made the concrete supports 42" deep and put the plates on top of them, I was able to lag the one side of my deck to the house, it's been here for 20 years and still very sturdy. My Layout will not be able to be tied to anything like a house. I could probably float the 4X4's on top of concrete pads, but how big would they have to be? I am assuming at least 8X8", and 4" thick. I may need to go thicker, and could reinforce with wire screening. I could also go down about 18" with a hole, put 4" stone at the bottom and fill and support the pole with concrete. I am trying not to go down to frost level because if I have to it's going to be a horror story. I haven't found any yet, do they make a "plastic" composite 4X4? So many questions. Thanks again.
shopping Noel, When I start a project just like I'm now with hanging my RR I go to Lowe's or Home Depot walk the isle to see what is aviable and get prices to mull over in my idle little mind,I buy more(extra) than I need saves on trips back to the store, keep reciepts and take the things back that I can't use. Sometimes you have to experiment with materials but as they say do it right the first time so over -kill sometimes is a good thing. EMD Trainman comments make good sence they also make footers pre-poured just for deck type projects that have all kinds of securing hardware from the same manufacturer but as always you can use some of their products or improvise a little to save on some expence but than again sometimes just in pure time it pays to use all of their products footers and attaching hardware.
If you don't want to do pressure-treated 4x4's in concrete, I would suggest using J-bolts, set in concrete footers, set below frost line. In NY state, I would venture a guess as to 42-28" below ground level. Using 4x4's set in concrete would suffice, and would make an incredibly sturdy platform, limited only by the strength of your stringers. 4x4's set in concrete would be pricey, while concrete footers, and J-bolts would cut the price of 4x4 posts to that needed to raise the layout level to your desired height above ground, offset by the additional cubic yardage of concrete to fill the holes. As for how big in diamenter the holes need to be, I have no idea. I have no working knowledge of deck building, except what I learned as a kid, when dad built a pool deck.
Thank you to everyone that has offered suggestions, I am narrowing it down to just a few ideas, rather than mine as I am not an expert builder, and would prefer to rely on the experience of others. My next concern is that of the actual track roadbed, and I will be asking that question separately. Thank you again.
Since you're not building a super-duty structure, is there harm in digging holes to below frost line, and putting in 3-4" of stone, inserting the post, leveling it, and tamping in more stone to the ground level to hold it? Is concrete really necessary? It's sure pricey, but river gravel, or slag isn't...
I just built a new layout, and went with the ladder method. If you are going to use wood 4x4's why not go with 4" plastic pipe, then you would not have to worry about rot?
This sounds very interesting. How high can I go with the 4" plastic pipe? Do I need to go below frost level? Do I have to fill the pipe with anything? Perchance, do you have any photos of this applilcation? So many questions. Thank you for your reply.
