Becoming an Engineer ?

GM&O Fan Dec 26, 2004

  1. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Precisely my point. Too many college grads these days, come out well socialized. With an arrogance. A false bravado.

    It's too easily seen. (Except by those jokers.) Just look at the past two, and slightly more decades. All the incredible messes such greenhorns have made of railroading......

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Boxcab E50
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  2. GM&O Fan

    GM&O Fan TrainBoard Member

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    Excellent points guys !


    Mopac, what do they have against railfans ?
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  3. Mopac3092

    Mopac3092 TrainBoard Member

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    they feel and i have seen it it firsthand that many get hired and think they know it all about railroading. i seen many come and go because it is nothing like "playing trains". i was and still am a railfan and n scaler, not many out there knew that.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  4. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    I know of one recent example. A foamer of great repute. (At least in his own mind.) Got into conductor training. And promptly flunked out.

    [​IMG]

    Boxcab E50
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  5. Sten

    Sten TrainBoard Member

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    This is an interesting discussion, I had given thought to getting a green card (my mom has citizenship) and applying for a job. but after reading a few things I'll think I'll let it pass. Already a conductor here in Aust, could go to driver (engineer) any time I feel I want to and from what I have read our OH&S laws are alot more strict than over in the states (ie we can't loose shunt on the freight side) That and looking at the wages for the job required I think I'll stay here, The US seems to love min wages - don't you have unions and threats of strikes?? We just got a 12% payrise over the next 3 yrs (only after we threatened to shut down Sydney hehehe [​IMG]
    Alot of what people have said is very true about here as well, when I went to the seminar to join CityRail there were about 500 people to apply for station positions (basic starting place for Network Ops) The speaker gets up and says you'll be tested for drugs and we will do a police record check about half walked out. It's also best to keep the interest in trains on the quiet side. most people I know, know that I am and it helps alot with the job - but forget the history - no-one cares when it was built or who by etc etc. They only want to know if they can get to Point A if travelling on said track and other stuff that affects the operation of the train.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  6. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Sten-

    Could you explain OH&S laws over your way? Am wondering how they compare to anything over here.

    Yes. There are unions here. But the competition with mostly non-union trucks has been a factor. Well over 90% of all freight moves non-rail. (I don't have figures for 2004. So am going off previous years.)

    Unions here have hurt themselves over and over. Especially by merging crafts. They think strength is in numbers of rank and file. Having seen it from the other side, that's a huge error. It's in numbers of crafts. The less, the easier to negotiate with all of them! The less effort and cost to the RR company to get a new contract worked out.

    Also, a lot gets farmed out to non-union outside contractors. Derailment cleanups, car repairs, engine repairs, painting, track work. So the actual numbers of union workers has dropped drastically. And continues to dwindle. Shortline spinoffs. Loopholes in laws. Etc.

    [​IMG]

    Boxcab E50
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  7. Mopac3092

    Mopac3092 TrainBoard Member

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    sten i was union with the brotherhood of loco engineers, and believe me all they did was collect a union due from my pay. when i was injured they called to see why they had not received dues from me, well when not working you don't have the money to pay, well i was told that if i needed anything to call them or my local rep, long story short, they forgot who i was immediatley after that call. alos with all of the corruption in the unions such as the utu both the president and vice pres in that union just went to prison after taking several millions from its members.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  8. Sten

    Sten TrainBoard Member

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    Boxcab,

    Alot of things that occur in the United States esp with the movement of freight don't occur in Aust because of insurance and with that tougher Occupational Health and Safety rules which mean that the company is responsible.
    Example of Rules
    Anyone working in the Rail Corridor must be wearing a high visibility vest (see a pic of Flash in Railfanning Discussions ;) ) Not wearing a vest, reported as a tresspasser if caught $5,000 fine and 2yrs prison (if actually a trespasser, if railworker - suspended from safeworking activities. (Safeworking is the name given to the rules and regulations - which covers everything from walking around the tracks to signals and signs to systems of train operation eg if you wanted to find out about the rules of Block Telegraph then you go to the section on "Systems of Safeworking"
    http://www.ric.nsw.gov.au/
    The web page is owner of the Metropolitan RailNetwork in Sydney and you can apply for a log on and access the rules and Regs which can tell you more

    On the freight side
    No loose shunting - couple loco to car, move car, uncouple car
    Can't ride on freight cars, shunter must walk beside train to direct movement, max shunting speed is about 8km/h - a brisk walk
    Can't jump on and off moving trains - instantly sacked if caught and the person driving the train will also recieve disciplinary action for allowing it to happen (if he/she sees it)

    That's the main differences that I have seen, esp since having a look at the job descriptions
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  9. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Here they have to ride the cars at times. This is due to the length of some trains. If they had to wait for a crewman to walk from one end of the train to another, busy corridors can become quite tangled and tied up.

    In past conversations with various company officials, and reading Codes of Rules, (GCOR, or), I understand that dismounts and mounts onto trains are supposed to be done from a standstill. But.......

    I cannot say that they all do, but many railroads here self-insure. Probably because purchasing premiums would be cost prohibitive.

    [​IMG]

    Boxcab E50
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 31, 2008
  10. SecretWeapon

    SecretWeapon TrainBoard Member

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  11. Sten

    Sten TrainBoard Member

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    Here they have to ride the cars at times. This is due to the length of some trains. If they had to wait for a crewman to walk from one end of the train to another, busy corridors can become quite tangled and tied up.

    In past conversations with various company officials, and reading Codes of Rules, (GCOR, or), I understand that dismounts and mounts onto trains are supposed to be done from a standstill. But.......

    I cannot say that they all do, but many railroads here self-insure. Probably because purchasing premiums would be cost prohibitive.

    [​IMG]

    Boxcab E50
    </font>[/QUOTE]It's funny you say that mounts dismounts are banned as per the code of Rules but NS put the requirement in the job description.
    That here would be a known breach of the rules by the company and the RR would loose their accreditation to run trains - system shutdown.
    As to riding cars, a shunter fell off a spine car on a 1800metre train and was killed which caused more of a delay than walking at a brisk pace. And over here Mgt care more about the Loss Time Injury scores than anything else because it would cost them more if a worker was injured or worst killed
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  12. Gabriel

    Gabriel TrainBoard Member

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    Funny... My app for UP says getting on and off moving cars to 3MPH. Thats a good little clip if you ask me and they sure dont make the grab irons low enough for us with short legs. Saw one guy on day getting on and off moving cars, then a different guy another day waiting till the train stopped.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  13. Mopac3092

    Mopac3092 TrainBoard Member

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    sten the ns put a stop to mounting aand dismounting while moving back in 1999. only while loco is stopped. mike i thought my local was decent and i am sure glad i wasn't utu, that union is a joke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  14. Gabriel

    Gabriel TrainBoard Member

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    I wander why OSHA hasnt gotten involved and required conductors to wear safety harnesses and hook onto freights cars they are riding.

    Would that make sense?
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  15. JASON

    JASON TrainBoard Supporter

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  16. Sten

    Sten TrainBoard Member

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    Probably a higher risk of being dragged if the conductor slipped.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  17. SecretWeapon

    SecretWeapon TrainBoard Member

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    Yes, the UTU is a joke. Last year they were trying to take us over. We voted it down. So,of course, we merge with the teamsters :eek: [​IMG]
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  18. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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  19. Matt Kiker

    Matt Kiker E-Mail Bounces

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    Mopac,Why shouldn't you let on that your a railfan?? Just wondering.
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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  20. Ed Pinkley#2

    Ed Pinkley#2 TrainBoard Member

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    I am a UTU member and very proud of what they have accomplished for me.Also the reason behind the prison time wasn't stealing from its members it was accepting money from other parties.Something I know the other unions are guilty of too.

    [ July 23, 2005, 09:56 PM: Message edited by: Ed Pinkley#2 ]
    Copyright 2008 Jerry DeBene
     
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