Due to a change in our lives (grandkids will be living with us for a while) the train room will have to be converted back to a bedroom. In order to keep the Northfield and Wichita alive, I am going to have to temporarily dismantle it and convert to a door-sized layout. I am thinking of the Atlas N-501 plan which will give me through freight operation, local freight and some yard-switching capabilities. Here is the Atlas plan: What I have done is lengthened it to fit on an 80" door. By doing this I am able to utilize my supply of #7 turnouts (they used primarily #5's in the original) and therefore should not have to buy any track, which is a good thing. Here's my revised plan: Any comments, suggestions or other feedback is most certainly welcome.
Poppy: Some comments: 1. This plan needs a way to perform run-around movements so you can serve all the sidings...and the one in the lower central part of the plan is very small and is poorly positioned to do the job. 2. Your drawings look like the #5 turnouts for the original plan and the #7 turnouts for the expanded plan are both the same length. Is that indeed the case? If the #7s are longer, then you may have difficulty fitting your plan into the same space (even with the extra 6 inches on the right.) 3. Although it is more prototypic to have mains follow the straight portions of turnouts and diverging routes take the curved portion, on small layouts the benefits of space savings and avoiding S-curves with tight radii may outway the prototypic appearance. As an alternative, you may want to consider this variation: 1. I used a 32 inch wide door, but 36 would be better, if available. 2. There is now a functional run-around to serve facing point turnouts. 3. I think you will only have room on the door for 2 tracks in the yard unless you make your main track radius smaller than 11 inches (and passing siding less than 9.5 inches) or use a wider door. 4. The mainline turnouts behind Red Wing Milling (RWM) and the Engine Shop are positioned to have the main pass through the curved portion of the turnouts. Notice there are no S-curves in this entire plan (if you put a short straight piece between the turnout and Sunrise Feed Mill). 5. I put both tracks in front of Red Wing Milling (on the lower or "south" side) so you can use one track for the RWM siding and the other to perform your switchback movement to spot cars on the ADM siding. (...unless you have access to both long sides of the layout...in which case you can just slightly adjust the angle of the track to serve the north side of RWM and use the south side track for the switchback move instead of for the RWM siding.) 6. If you want to avoid the switchback movement to get to ADM, then put a left turnout near RWM and cross over the RWM siding to get to ADM. 7. I wasn't too enthusiastic about accessing the interchange by taking a long siding and then pushing cars across the mainline. I considered having the interchange come directly off of the Engine Shop track or from the yard, but there is no run-around convenient to make that movement work. A run-around would be available if the interchange came off of the main track behind the Engine Shop, but even with # 4 turnouts, there would not be enough width on the door to complete the right side of the oval unless you used an extremely small radius and drastically shortened your yard and Sunrise Feed tracks. So the interchange comes off of the back/top of the oval instead of the front. This makes the interchange accessible by a trailing point turnout (when you are going counter-clockwise), so there would not need to be any run-around movement to serve the interchange. If you want more of a challenge, you could position the interchange coming off of the left back/top corner of the layout instead. This alternate location would require a run-around movement to complete your set outs and pick-ups at the interchange. 8. If you are into operations (switching the cars in a relatively purposeful way rather than just letting a train orbit), this alternative plan has a lot to offer. If you set up on one of the yard tracks, you would pull out traveling counter-clockwise around the oval. After X number of loops, you could serve Sunrise Feed, X more loops then serve RWM, X more loops and serve the Interchange. Then x more loops and use the run-around to serve ADM and switch your caboose and loco for the return to the yard, perhaps using the runaround again to work the interchange again on your way back. [Hmmm...If you have a pair of interchange tracks, then you could serve one track when eastbound (for example, moving counter-clockwise and maybe picking up loaded grain hoppers for ADM) and the other when westbound and dropping off empty grain hoppers from ADM.]
I think the layout would be more visually interesting if you had the interchange track pass over (my preference) or under the mainline rather than cross on a diamond. That would also let you move your right-most turnout to the yard to the right one track section which would help lengthen the yard tracks and the bypass track. I think you have enough room to make a 2% grade cross-over happen. I am not keen on long backwards running sections, so this part of the plan would not be my cup of tea, but in a small space it might be all you can do. BTW: I did not see Dave's post before making my reply. I do think he has some good suggestions.
I skimmed over ppuinn's comments but didn't see him cover my thought, so I'll throw it in: The little yard at the bottom does not have a yard lead, so you can't do any real "classification" type activities without running out onto the the main and up the interchange track. If the long track that passes afront the Interlocking / shed could be moved up to the second yard track from the layout edge, that would solve the problem. You might consider curving it to still have room for the tower. Of course, the turnouts probably wont fit then! One last thought is, if you rotate the track even slightly, so it's not parallel to the edges of the table, that's supposed to make the thing more realistic and less toylike. Or so I've been told.
The plan as shown above has a crossing diamond- if you could replace it with a slipswitch, you could have a long passing siding/runaround/industrial lead. However, after looking at Dave's drawing, I seem to like his a little better. Also, if you could get space at one end or another,you could add a staging yard ( 6 inches by, say,3 or 4 feet) for off-the-layout staging. Where are you planning on putting the door-sized N&W? How much room do you have to work with? Also, for some other ideas, check this out- several door-size layout trackplans. And welcome to the DSLC-Door-Sized Layout Club!
Dave: 1. Thanks for your insight. I hope I have understood and captured what you were saying. 2. I want to use my existing track (Code 55) and structures where possible. That's why I added the double track leading to the engine house to accommodate my existing engine house. 3. I went to a 36" x 80" door. 4. They are #7 turnouts. I just think when the image is resized they look smaller. 5. I decided to angle the track leading to Sunrise in order to give it a little more length. 6. Any straight sections will be replaced with flex track since I have an abundance of it. 7. I am also toying with your idea of a pair of interchanges. 8. Here's the new drawing: To all of the others who responded, thanks again for the input and trust me, it is greatly appreciated.
Poppy: You've done a wonderful job of capturing what I was saying!! I like what you've done with Sunrise and the engine house, too. Putting in an escape track for your locos is a very good idea. If you decide to put in an engine escape, I'd suggest curving the two yard tracks along the front left end of the oval and having the track closest to the main tie into the main as far to the left on the oval as you can go with the smallest radius turnout you are comfortable with (and which will accommodate your locos). If you make an escape track by putting a crossover between the yard tracks, you will only be able to put cars on one track. If you tie into the main, you can use your main for the run-around/escape movement and can sort cars on both tracks (building your next train on the arrrival departure track that ties into the main). That way, when the train leaves, you will have a track open to return on and will also be able to leave 1/3 of your rolling stock on the 2nd (front) track. {1/3 of your cars will be at industries/interchange(s); 1/3 in the departing train; and 1/3 left in the yard} I think adding a 2nd track to the existing interchange track would work better--spacewise--than making a 2nd interchange at the other end of the oval, especially since you might be tying your arrival departure track into the main at that end of the oval. You would be able to work one of the tracks when heading out from the yard without needing to do any run-around moves. When you return, you would work the second track at the interchange with a run-around movement to set out cars and pick up those inbound to the N&W yard from the interchange.
Looks pretty good. I would ad a small spur coming off the main next to the tail of the yard tracks. It could serve as a caboose track or you could put a freight house there. The switch back spur to the ADM is akward. I would have it coming off the main and through a small diamond instead. The reason being that the spur you have to switch through to get cars to ADM is too short. You are so close to going with a double track main that you could consider just doing a double oval. Otherwise it looks fun.
Going with what Geeky said, another possible suggestion is to switch the milling plant & grain elevator around. Come harvest time, that elevator is gonna be a busy place.
Keep the comments coming as it has been very helpful. Good point Bob. Based on the operations of the local elevator up the road from my office that is exactly the situation. The elevator is served by a siding off the main and during harvest season there are usually 6 or 8 hoppers sitting there being filled. Once they are all filled then they are picked up and on their way. Again, I appreciate everyone's input.
You could get a real yard lead in by replacing the straight track that leads into your yard with a right-hand turnout with the turnout facing right. Put some track on the end of that turnout and you'll have a yard lead above your engine house. I, too, think you are so close to a double track mainline you might consider doing that. And why not just eliminate the switch-back siding and take it off the main? You could also create a run-around along the upper part of the layout to service both industries by adding just one more crossover on the left. You'd still have interesting operations but less hassle.
Revision 5 Okay, here is actually revision #5 so let me know what you think and where I can make improvements. Thanks again.
I like your revision the best of the plans. The siding in the back is only about two feet long--probally won't hold more than four cars or so. Do you think there's any way you could lengthen it some so you'd have more room to drop off/pick up more cars? What if you changed the turn outs for the siding to curved turnouts so they could be the last part of the mainline curve and made the siding follow the same curve that goes inward towards the elevator and placed the mill along that trackage? It would lengthen the siding without changing your plan much. It also appears you need to add a crossover somewhere that so trains going the opposite way can enter/exit the inner loop. I'd suggest the far left hand side so it would double as a passing siding as well.
I don't know if it's an optical illusion or not, but it looks like the turnout off the inner loop, right by the corner of Sunrise Feed. is a right hand, followed by left hand curves off both legs, that could be swapped for a left to eliminate an S-curve entering the sidings to the ADM elevator. The other change I keep thinking of, I'm not sure if it's an improvement or not, but I'd take out the crossovers between the outer loop and the first yard track, then make a runaround track off the inner loop (similar to the one at Sunrise Feed only longer), and run the siding to Red Wing off of the runaround instead of off the main. This change will lengthen the usable yard track. Yes, you will lose the ability to back directly from the outside main into the Red Wing siding, but as is,that maneuver would be a double or triple S-curve, and likely problem prone anyway.
I think overall this is a better plan. Let me make two observations/suggestions: If you run trains as they are prototypically run both your inner sidings are reversed. You'd normally be running counterclockwise on the outer loop and clockwise on the inner loop. Since the ADM and Red Wing siding are on the inner loop it would be more prototypical to have the sidings be able to be backed in from a train running clockwise. Of course you can stay the way you are and run the opposite direction. If you create a crossover from the inner to outer loop along the front just past the curves on the left hand side, you will have a run-around you can use and you'll be able to cross trains over in both directions without backing. Additionally, you could use one of those tracks for an add/drop track and still be able to get around those cars while a switcher worked the yard. I think Zandoz is right about the curvy way the turnouts are set up for the ADM elevator. I think you could clean that up and it would make for better operation. I like the idea of a scenic divider. All in all it seems you are getting to a very workable plan.
Zandoz: You are right. The turnouts were the same; however, I did put some curved track in there. I have cleaned that up now so that it is a straight shot. I also eliminated that crossover from the main into the yard. Mark: I put a crossover in on the left as suggested and I'm going to work on the inner sidings but I am going to take a break for a day or so and then come back hopefully with a fresh perspective on everything. I also eliminated the interchange on the right. I figure if this plan was to be extended then I could expand it utilizing one of the tracks in the yard to interchange over on the left side. Once again, thanks for all the comments and suggestions and when I get the inner sidings figured out I'll post the revision.
Rev. 6 Okay, I'll go ahead and post the Rev. 6 plan and what I have done so far: Addressing the issue of Sunrise, the most it will receive are 2-3 car loads a week since it is near it's life expectancy and processing is being handled by larger facilities in other cities. In fact, rumor has it that a philanthropic organization wants to take it over and turn it into a museum and run a small steam excursion train from that point. Comments are welcome!
This recent one looks good. By looking at the trackplan, I assume you'll be backing trains into the yard at the end of the run- which is all good,since my last HO layout had the yard set up the same way. I like how you've given the grain elevator the most trackage as well. I can envision this site keeping a local busy as heck switching out loads & empties during harvest season. I can add nothing else to the design muself, other than to say it looks good from here. If I didn't have to have MY hollow-core door layout against the wall, I'd go the scenic divider route too. So, when do you start building?
Dismantling of the current modules will have to occur first and that will probably be in a week or two. This weekend I have to take care of a very nasty computer infection for my younger brother and restore his system since I'm the computer guru in the family.
