I think we have reached the point that our HO counterparts reached back in the 70's or thereabouts. Back then rolling stock came with the dreaded X2F coupler which was usually truck mounted. Most serious modelers had at that time converted to KayDee's and a grass roots movement was begun to ditch the X2F's. Some manufacturers began to offer cars without trucks and couplers leaving it up to the buyer to chose which one he would use. Maybe we are at that point in Nscale. I for one scrap my accumate couplers in favor of Micro Trains. The extended coupling distance along with the sudden uncoouplings in long trains is just not my cup of tea. So why not offer cars sans trucks and couplers? Maybe reduce the price accordingly. Are we there yet?
Leaving the choice up to the customer sounds like a good idea, but it could also run counter to the whole RTR concept. I for one would like to see a redesign and expansion of the Accumate line so MT has an equal. More choices always helps bring more into our scale.
I usually change out the trucks and couplers on all non MT rolling stock,so that would be a welcome change. I have several boxes of accumates trucks and wheel sets. They'll be used for wayside junk along some yard tracks. Stay cool and run steam..... [ April 14, 2006, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Powersteamguy1790 ]
I've told this tale before, but it bears a re-telling. When I started my current layout in 2002, I chose Atlas C55 over ME. I was unaware that ordinary MTs would not run on it until that fateful day when I tried. I probably had 100 cars at the time--plenty for the old railroad. I had converted them en masse in the mid 1990s, and remembered the boredom. I was a little miffed at MT. I thought their wheels were supposed to be the Cadillac of the hobby. It never ocurred to me that they wouldn't run on NMRA-compliant track, and had never been aware of all the issues about that track. So I faced a choice: swap out 400 wheelsets (and I believe MT bulk packs were not available) or 200 trucks. Since time was more important than money then, I bought 200 Accumate trucks. Then I bought 200 Atlas king pins, as I had thrown away all the old kingpins, and MT kingpins don't fit Accumate bolster holes. And I bought about 200 cars, either with Accumates or converted to Accumates. Then I started running long trains on my new layout. Arrgh! The Accumates would uncouple. They would drop uncoupler pins. They would mysteriously explode. I am now in the laborious process of converting back to MT! Only now I have at least 300 cars to convert--that's 1200 axles and 600 trucks. I've resorted to putting a tiny drop of ACC between the couplers of unit trains. I think this doesn't work. I am highly disappointed with Accumates.
I am letting the Accumates stay on as long as they stay in one piece. Rapido couplers, though, must go.
That's a sad story Pete...and one to which some of us can relate. Here's something to do before & during your conversion back to MT stuff and still be able to run those long unit trains: Buy some very (very) small designer rubberbands used for dental braces. They are available at many drugstores in a multitude of colors. Wrap a rubberband around the coupler pins just below the coupler knuckles. I used black and found them very hard to see when the train was moving. They keep the couplers together under any circumstance including falling over the table edge....my train looked like a Slinky as it fell to the floor because of the rubberbands holding everything together. I've also used larger rubberbands in HO and even larger ones in 2-rail O scale for ridiculously long unit trains. Never had any problems. Cam
I have a Deluxe Innovations unit train (Bethgons) equipped with Accumates. I have all kinds of trouble with it. The cars have no extra weight added or any other modifications. I can't run the train six feet before it comes uncoupled. On the other hand, my son has a set of Atlas "Bathtubs" equipped with Accumates. It runs flawlessly!!! Even in DP operation!!! It goes and goes and goes.............. I harken back to the early days of N scale. You always bought a magazine because, you'd hoped someone would have come up with a solution!!!
The first suggestion that rolling stock comes with no trucks and couplers is fine. The second part, "at a cheaper price" is the rub. If that ever became the practice I beleive you would find suppliers charging the same price they do now. They increase profits, we pay the freight. Watch what you pray for, you may get it! Doc
Inkaneer, I don't see it happening. If HO and N scales had developed concurrently, then it might have happened in N scale. But there's about 30 years difference, and the costs of manufacturing have shifted dramatically. The raw product is cheap, thanks to off-shore manufacturing; the packaging and distribution costs are soaring. Given the state of manufacturing today, and if HO were at N scale progress levels, I doubt HO would be introducing body-only kits. But HO was there when this was feasible, and HO manufacturers have been able to carry on. N scale manufacturers, 30 years later, just can't justify the expense today.
What expense? Seems to me that there would be less expense. Trucks and couplers, whether Accumates or MT's don't grow on trees. How about the assembly operation of afixing the truck to the body? Is there an expense there?
My experience has been pretty farvorable on the Accumates. They do need some twaeking, but nothing terrible. Since I do not use magnetic uncoupling, I just pull the pins, which seams to solve many of the problems. That being said, Accumates could use some improvment. The coupling distance is too far away, and they should come in some sort of casing that is less prone to blow out. Lets not forget that MTL couplers were not "fixed" untill the 90's with the reverse draft angle, a feature now appearing on Accumate trucks. What I would like to see is either an exchange or a discount program for current Accumate owners to upgrade to these improved trucks once they become available.
IMO that's not likely. There has been three generations of the Accumate already. Tens of thousands of cars have them. Retail price per pair of trucks is ~$3.85 US. To replace them all would cost a huge amount to either Atlas or Accumate or both. The largest amount of N modelers still remains not the N-Trak runners that are having the bulk of the problems but the small layout owners who run 15-20 car trains and those trains are huge on their layout. Most of the problems seem to appear in the 30+ car trains. This is an issue for us, as if we ever get time to run anything again I like prototype length trains. BTW: The truck is fine. It is the coupler and how (where) it mounts in the coupler box that is the issue. Body mounting or re-designing the coupler box is IMO a better solution.
A touch of Gel ACC on the trip pin where it enters the coupler and on the lid of the draft gear box where the tabs meet the draft gear box will keep the Accumate from "exploding". Like the MTL couplers, a little MTL "Grease-em" helps magnetic operation. I don't run trains longer than about 7 cars. My new railroad will run 20-25 car trains, still not long enough for uncoupling problems, so I have quit replacing Accumates when I buy Atlas cars and do the above instead.
Give me MT's any day. Accumates (crapumates) stink. I also have experienced repeated uncoupling issues - my layout has grades & curves, I run 25-30 car trains typically. It's a drag having to replace the trucks on an Atlas or IM car that you've just bought, but I always end up doing it out of frustration...
Wow, Great Idea about the dental rubber bands. I will go to the drugstore first thing tomorrow to find some. All my N scale trains now have MT couplers. The longest train I can pull without uncoupling is about 40 cars. I had trouble with Accumates uncoupling and just falling apart. They are so fragile.
conagher, How do you keep cars on the track while installing the bands, or after installing them? Having four kids who all had orthodontics, I'll well aware of the bands. I just need instructions for installing them. Would appreciate any step-by-step instruction.
Accumates do have one advantage in that they have 36" wheel trucks in addition to 33" wheel trucks. It's a shame they can't/won't make Accumates with a closer coupling distance, and that will reliably stay coupled, and not come apart. That shouldn't be hard to get right, and is essential if they are ever going to truly challenge MT as an alternative. Micro-trains has a wonderful opportunity to close the door on Accumates if they would make a 36" wheel truck. It has always surprised me that they have not created and released one.
It's so much easier to use MT couplers. Now we're going to use designers bands from orthodontics to keep accumates from exploding. In the good old days the orthodontic bands were light tan. Stay cool and run steam......
Ideally, the next best solution will be is for makers to fit MT trucks & couplers for their RTR rolling stock, what Red Caboose and IM have recently done. I know this is wishful thinking, imagine what reduction of eye strain and savings etc. will be if MT couplers were made to be the standard for the hobby? IM have gone this direction for their engines and even some of Athearn too. Deluxe innovations new maxi stacks also come with body mounted MT's so, hope more makers will follow suit. Cheers, http://cliffordconceicao3310.fotopic.net/c328807.html
