i have a question on an era : i am planning on doing a 60s/70s era layout for the next layout in the future but scince i can go for 50s 60s 70s 80s 90s and 20s so would it be odd to see a BNSF ES44DC leading a dash-9 with a modern freight through a 60s era i want to create a environment that it comfortable and i like the comfortable feeling of what it looks like in the MRR displays in the walthers catolog and others i just want to get creative and have a highly detailed layout like they have but with a 60s type era :tb-smile:
Many towns and cities next to railroad tracks have buildings that have been there since the 40's, 50's, and 60's. Running a modern locomotive by a town like this would be fine. You could have automobiles from the different eras, and put those on the layout to reflect the years you are operating. When done and want to change from a 70's era operating session to a 2000's era operating session, just switch autos.
If you look at a picture of rural Pa.,you can't tell what year it is unless your looking at cars,trucks,etc. I run from steam-today.
I'm not sure I know exactly what you are trying to say, but I think you are posing the question of creating an "era neutral" layout, meaning you can run from 50's thru the 2000's. Well, I think there are a couple of things to consider... -A lot of towns and cities of all size are basically still mostly made up of industrial buildings that are 40 years old or more, and since we mostly model industrial areas on model railroads it is pretty easy to model a late 50's scene and milk 50 years of era out of it. Get some plastic tubs and have a select few era specific structures, vehicles, and details on hand and you're all set. -Railroad details are really critical, especially signals, crossing gates, etc. They will sell or ruin an era quicker than anything in my opinion. Again, keep tubs around with these items...build a quick connect method for the signals so you can have functioning signals that can be swapped quickly. My hometown looks like time froze in the 60's and 70ACe's and doublestacks look right at home, so the answer is go for it!
I would strongly caution against the idea that a given layout can be made generic enough to pass for any era between 1950 and 2000 just by changing out vehicles and a few minor details - it can't. In 50 years an awful lot of things change in the details surrounding a community that's anything more than just a very small, sleepy, crossroads. The outdoor advertising will be totally different from era to era, as well as where and how it is displayed. Many gasoline station company names change from era to era along with logos and displays, to say nothing of the posted prices. The same is true of any store window ads and their prices. The products themselves come and go. Particularly obvious to many will be how traffic signs, even highway striping and colors, altered dramatically during the 1950's, along with signs denoting highway IDs (having grown up in the 1940's and 50's, this particularly stands as a mistake for me on even many period layouts). The manner of dress of the miniature population would likewise be radically different from one era to the next. Even the way yards of private homes were planted can prove striking different, to say nothing of the materials the homes were made of. Darn few towns exist today comprised of only the buildings that existed in 1950, let alone being of the exact same style and construction method. Even along the right-of-way, you will not find that the older structures are serving the same function/businesses they did half a century ago. Few railroad stations have not been dramatically altered, or totally replaced, over the course of that many years. Yard facilities changed to an even more strikingly degree. You may think that you can get away with a layout made generic enough to cover several different eras but, in fact, a layout viewer who lived in the particular era depicted will be able to spot many anachronisms straight away and the hoped for illusion will quickly vanish in their eyes. If you're actually serious about depicting a time and place realistically, my advice is to decide on a more reasonable time span, say a decade or so. If the era is not intimately familiar to you, start by researching photos in old magazines to see what the world really looked like in that period. Doing less ensures failure. NYW&B (who models 1941)
Must agree with NYW&B on this one. Many of the structures change over the years or are replaced. Here in twon there are several buildings from 100 years ago but they hve new fronts to them. The bank here is from the 1920's but even though it is the same building it has been remodeled a couple of times and looks like it was built in the 1960's Rail equipment will be different too. It would be possible to run your GE C44-9's on a layout with older buildings but I recommend makeng duplicate structures for a given time period. You can change the building by exchanging it for the same one in a different time. Vehicles too would need to change. If you are in the 1950's there wont be any Ford Mustang Fastbacks yet.
ok all we have is old buildings for the layout and the two problems is the cars we need to get some sudebakers and old fords i need more poles with insulators and 10 crossarms because i got a book of Wilkes-Barre in the 60s man there were only insulator poles along side of roads if you take a look at downtown wilkes barre you will notice that all the buildings are from the 50s 60s and below so other than that i am all set
There're so many differences. Think of a woman with child, a buggy. Which type of buggy was in 1970 up to date? Nutpickers! :angel: :angel: Wolfgang
I agree, it depends on how accurate you want it to be. Ultimately, it's up to you to decide what you want to run and what structures/details you want on your layout! I'm all for historical accuracy to a degree-- But the level of fun-ness of the hobby decreases as the level of analism increases. To be concerned about what color the paint on the roads were, or the color of U.S. postal service mailboxes is going a bit far unless I'm getting paid to reproduce an era to that level.
Wow, I guess the whole "model railroading is fun" mantra just got blasted out of the water! I think--if someone is asking this question in the first place--then by nature they can't be THAT "serious about depicting a time and place realistically", no? And FAILURE? Something tells me a good modeler can create a generic-enough scene that "60's-70's" would be very close and other era's (at least 50's to 2000) would be at least acceptable to the point of not being called a FAILURE. I belonged to a club once that did exactly that, and I see clubs all over acheiving a high level of believability across eras. I don't recall once feeling like a set of Dash 9's looked so out of place that I even thought about it, at all....same with the late steam the guys would run. Together? Yeah, that made me pause but geez, never thought of our layout presentation as FAILURE because of it. And by the way, I model a pretty specific time frame, too. (within about a 3-4 year span) I completely understand your angle. I would probably never attempt it because there would be things I wouldn't be happy with. (although quite honestly, about the only thing that REALLY dates the prototype I model is signals and the removal of telegraph/telephone poles, both done in the early 90's) But I also get that some people don't care that much about it and just want to run a lot of different eras and locales. More power to 'em. The key, as the original poster declared, is "get creative". :we2-idea:
I must agree with Doug on this one. Also, how picky are you wanting to get with how buildings look? When I was in Cordele, GA working last year, I shot modern CSX diesels passing such anachronisms as a painted-on CocaCola sign on a brick wall of a downtown store. It's not a bad idea to do a little research to get a general idea of how things looked in the era you're modeling, but don't think you've failed miserably if you don't nail it exactly. As has been described here, structures built in one year can still be seen for quite a while, barring fire or other natural catastrophe. I for one model the Frisco in the late 1970s, but still have older diesels (44-tonners, RS1s) in the black & yellow that were long gone by then. On my present N scale layout, I'm trying to stay true to the decade of the 1970s, and not have such out-or-era items as cars made in 1980 or later, rolling stock lettered for railroads that would not exist for years yet, etc. The nice thing about this hobby is that you can get as specific in your modeling as you like, or be as diverse as possible. It's YOUR railroad.
I reread NYW&B's post again. He has some valid points, but after reading this sentence: I wanted to say that would be quite extreme modeling in HO scale. I mean, it's a model railroad, not a movie. That's the first time EVER that I've heard or read about precisely replicating clothing styles on 1:87 figures. I can only imagine accomplishing period dress N scale. Now, O scale might be a different story, but still challenging nonetheless...
I like this idea -- having multiple buildings, representing different eras -- for the same location on your layout. I have a book called "Kansas City, Then and Now" that shows pictures on facing pages of the same location as it looked, for example, in the 1940s and the same scene as it looked in the 1980s. Some of the pictures look almost unchanged except for details like cars on the streets, traffic signals, etc. In other pictures it's hard to believe it's the same location, so much has changed. If I was going to implement this idea, I'd do research on how buildings "evolve" -- change uses, reconstruction, improvements, new fronts, windows, etc. -- so they are still recognizable from one "era" to another, but updated to fit into progressively more modern periods.
There was an article a while back in one of the popular magazines that covered this topic. I try to model accurate period dress styles on my layout to a certain extent. I model the late 40s/early 50s and just for example you wouldn't see mini skirts in that time frame. I've seen a few layouts that can successfully pull off the changing of eras though and it is amazing what simple changes can do. I just stick with the era I model simply because that is what I like.
Challenger, your age betrays your lack of familiarity with just how dramatically the style of everyday dress altered in America in the years between 1950 and 2000. Anyone who's lived through those decades as an adult will recognize period inaccuracies in the general dress of miniature figures immediately. In my experience, generic-era layouts very often are rather toylike in appearance and lacking in any real character. Look at so many of those depicted in weekend photo threads on various forums - bland and indecisive of era as they can be. In contrast, consider just about any of the really well known, or famous, layouts down through the years and you'll see that what makes them great is absolute accuracy of period detail. Likewise, virtually none attempts to span a wide range of eras. Admittedly, most hobbyists lack the discipline (often the talent) necessary to create an accurately and correctly detailed layout, many invoking "modeling is supposed to be fun" or "it's my railroad" as the lame excuse. Believe me, the serious/accurate modeler gets more fun and greater pleasure out of having someone of the era represented on the layout visit the train room, spot a particular scene, a structure, or a group of correctly detailed figures and exclaim, "My God, that's just how I remember it!" One may twist the rules anyway they wish as a hobbyist but then you can't expect to get a sense of reality, or believability, for your layout by inaccurate modeling. NYW&B
Some good points again, however I'm not as young and out of tune as my age indicates. 37 is not young. I've been around long enough to note subtle changes in style and dress during my life and in historical images. I don't want this thread to become a study on fashion, but I do want to mention that I can tell when a mini-skirt or even a two-piece bathing suit is not accurate for a 50s railroad. What this really all comes down to, (like most MRR threads) are there are those who are hyper-interested in every minute detail vs. those who feel "close enough" works just fine. I actually prefer to find intentionally placed anachronisms in model railroads that I visit. It shows that the modeler has a sense of humor and doesn't take himself too seriously. I'll second the question, "what are the 'rules'"?
i want to make it as real as possibal but with a little toying around like bieng accurate like what colour the mailboxes are instead of US postal blue why not make it conrail blue its worth a neat try i want to model the NORFOLK AND WESTERN rail way and the SOUTHERN but that seems too ot of my reach so i might go with conrail scince we have more of those than southern and NW you know what i have no clue what i am going to model all i know is it is going to be 50s or 60s
How about this - if you have a signal (interlocking) tower, make it removable so that in the "future", the location of the tower becomes a parking lot. You could have two of the same building - one in good shape and open for business, and one that has boarded up windows and in need of paint. A gas station might have a brand name sign like Sinclair in front of it - remove the sign and make the "former" gas station into a private owned muffler shop - and of course change the cars that might be parked at the business.
Since when is "modeling is supposed to be fun" considered a lame excuse? ANd in what holy writ has it been declared that extreme adherence to accuracy is the One True Path to hobby enjoyment? Now I model the mid-to-late 1970s, and try to keep things in that era as much as possible, but when I was doing HO I had no problem of running my Frisco Russian Decapod once in a while, or have an RS1 switch out the yard (btw, Frisco got rid of its RS1s by 1970). Shoot, I even have a 44-tonnerin the yellow & black, knowing full well that by the time my era came around, it was already gone in real life. You seem to forget that there are several different ways to enjoy ourselves on this hobby. They range from the what-did-the-world-look-like-on-August-21,-1965 to "whatever turns you on", with varying degrees in between. I try to stay as close to the era I model as I can, not running anything after, say, 1980, and now on my N scale layout nothing earlier than the mid-1970s. I'm happy with my operating (no more involved than a switch list- I save excess paperwork for the bathroom). and things run smooth. In short, I have fun. Remember fun? That's what we're supposed to find in the hobby of model railroading. Your way is not the only way,or is it the only right way. Personally, I have to be extremely detail-oriented in my line of work, and it's enough where I don't care to carry that over into my everyday life. Model railroading is SUPPOSED to be fun. This is a HOBBY, after all, not a JOB.
