Greetings, I am banging my head on N or HO so I have been reading, searching, and I went to the library and got a card so I could start reading over all those books and mags. But that is a long way off. A lot of reading. We will be moving into a new house at the end of this month and I will have at least a 10' x 10' room. I have been searching the web and reading forums, but everything I find on N v/s HO is years old. Hence the date in the title of my post. I would like to see what peoples current Pro/Con for N v/s HO are? If you were to start over today what you would go with? Posts, though years old, seem to point to HO. But when I search eBay I find significantly more N scale product. Same here on this site. Tons more N scale posts. So historically HO seems to be it, but current appears to be N. FYI - I love trains and ran them as a kid. We had a huge set up in the basement and my brother-inlaw built awesome models for it. That was HO and is since gone. So I am starting from scratch. I know this is kind of a nebulous question. But that is how it feels to me. I have some significant funds to put forth, but we are not rich by any means. This is just something we are willing to spend some money on as my boys also love trains. I am a good modeler and have good eye sight. I spent years painting 25 mm fantasy figures and modeling wooden hoardings on castle walls and such. I want to do some significant scenery. Not sure about Steam and say the 40's or so? I really like the diesels and modern. 70's on up? Looking forward to doing switching and such. That is what sounds fun to me. Ask me any questions. Thanks. Peace and Blessings
Welcome to TrainBoard!!!!!!! You have came to the right place and either way you go you will find plenty of great advise and inspirational ideas. We will also enjoy reading and seeing what you build too. :tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin: :tb-biggrin:
I took prefer to mean which one do I primarily operate and model in. As far as what I will go see at someone else's house or layout, that would be any scale. I see great things going on in Z scale up through G, 7.5-inch, and 1:1 around here.
Well I cant decide for you which scale to choose, so I'll just sound off with what I chose... Hello, my name is Mark and I'm an N scale-aholic.
Well, I suppose that if you noticed a bias of n-scale posts then you should expect the poll to kinda reflect that. I am hard-core n-scale now, having been in HO basically from birth until college and then sitting out a few years. If starting now, I still think I'd probably go for N even though Z is becoming a very attractive proposition. But for me there are still plenty of things not available in Z that would keep me from jumping from N. Heck, I could probably name 50 things that I could buy in HO right now that I want and are still missing in n-scale. I admire the Z'ers talent and creativity, but I just don't desire to create everything from scratch...at this point anyway. And that's not to mention having to abandon a decent-size n-scale collection. (not crazy-huge, but still not chump change either) I do think N is starting to take over HO slowly but surely. There are a few major hurdles, and that top 50 list of mine, but overall I think the quality, availability, variety, and overall popularity has reached a "sweet spot" that, if not already, will pull the majority of new hobbyists and fence-sitters. About the only reason I would recommend HO is if you were really determined to model small steam, and early steam where the cars were mostly 40-footers whereby you could still keep a relatively small radius but gain the benefit of heavier locos that would pull better and allow better switching performance. Outside of that, go N. Having said that, if you are interested in 60's/70's diesels, Z does kinda have that timeframe covered pretty good with Micro-Trains latest releases (Geeps) and the hodgepodge of freight cars that existed during that time. "Modern" (late 80's/90's/early 00's) can be done too, but pretty pricey when you start talking C44-9W's and coal gons that start looking more like car payments.
It's lonely in H.O. Land. Which is bizarre. I tried N Scale. Gave me headaches cause I couldn't see anything and cause I'm a butterfingers and those things are way more delicate. Costs are about the same though if you're looking used, H.O will help you. 10'x10' foot room is gonna be a compromised H.O. Layout though. I mean, you could do it and it could be awesome, but for that space, N is better. Now me, I had about that Space and went H.O. for the above reasons And, because I WILL have a larger layout one day and that layout WILL be HO for a variety of reasons and therefore, I'd rather have less track now but have every dime spent on equipment count towards that dream layout.
HO Scale here. I wanted a layout for a long time. Wanted to build models, kits, etc. When we were first married, I had no place to do either. When I finally did get the space to have a good workshop and a layout, it was the mid to late 80's. I knew my layout was going to revolve somehow around the C&O. There was never a question. When it came to scale, I liked the possibilities of N Scale and getting "bang for the buck" as far as real estate in the layout room However back then, there was so little available compared to HO in the way of kits, etc. I committed to HO and have never looked back. That would quite possibly be different if I were starting over today or just getting into the hobby today. I might consider N Scale even more than I did back then.
Thank you - Good to hear oppions of WHY your doing what you do Reading everyones posts! Thanks! We bought a new house 4 months ago. We had to rent back for 5 months for them to build their new house. 'Our' new house will be 3 stories. 2 plus fully finished basement. Was almost kind of bummed that the basement was fully finished. Was hoping for 1/2 the basement to be unfinished so I would have tons of space. It is about 3300' sq. We get to move in ~27th of Nov. So the basement is a large bedroom/office glass pained French doors. Thinking of using that room. That would be about 12'x14' or so. But then I have no Company/Visitor bedroom downstairs or office with a window. Maybe I can put my office in there and share it with the tracks... Next up is a large closet. No windows. This is the 10'x10' that I was speaking of. Either this room or the above one can be locked. Which I want to be able to do. I have young kids. They would not go in uninvited. But when we have company? I won't bet that other kids wont. The rest of the basement is kind of a U shaped wrap around. Big, but I have those young kids and who knows what will get thrown around down there... The scenery and building models will be some of the funnest part of the process for me. To start I was going HO. I did not even know about N. Then I started reading about N and liked the size of it. Then I started reading about the Pros and Cons of both HO and N. Then I started to see that a lot of those posts were from years ago. I have the Walthers Sept and Nov 07 catalogs. HO seems to have a larger representation, but I don't know if that is just because that is what Walthers tends to aim at more than N? As of this morning, I am aiming toward N scale. We went and saw a huge HO layout in St Paul, MN. Now I just wish I could find an N scale layout somewhere close to see. That is proving to be a little more difficult. Thanks Peace and Blessings
Hi, just my quick thoughts, typing this really fast here. (I'm in N scale) N scale plus: for given amount of space, longer trains, much more scenery to track ratio - you get to do 'the whole picture'. You can have significant layout and scenery that is not directly adjacent to the track and still have space for that . That's why I like N - I have small space and could do a lot in N scenically, but realistically in HO I could have done little for my interests. So it is pragmatic choice for me. Big mainline action with 4+ diesels and 50+ car trains = reasonably feasible for many in N scale. Most of diesel era forward is available. No problem doing DCC for most N locos today. Today's N usually runs pretty good. N scale minus: real proto appearance requires good tracklaying skills, ability to work with smaller objects required (could be plus or minus!) Steam is still not in wide variety compared to HO. Sound is in it's infancy. Not as many same-scale modelers as HO to share same-scale stuff with. HO plus: Sound - if you like sound (and sound is good), HO is currently much better availability than N. Widest selection compared to any scale, by far. From a macro perspective, you have a lot more fellow same-scale modelers when you're in HO than when you are in N. HO minus: takes more space, more compression... if you like either big scenery (which I do) or long loco lashups and trains (which I do)... then you'll need a lot of space (which I don't have). Big layouts in HO tend to be more 'shelf' in nature', i.e. trackside scenes = OK, but big mountain scenery or wide plains = hard to do in most peoples space avail, they prioritize on the real estate just adjacent to the track. It is interesting to me that top-notch famous HO modelers and their home layouts, a mainline freight on many of those HO home layouts is often 20-25 cars. Big mainline action with 4+ diesels justified due to 50+ car trains = not really possible in HO unless you are in position to have a much larger amount of space than many of us have. That's my quick thoughts. To each his own!
I would recommend N Scale if HO and N are your only choices. If you like superdetailing locos and rolling stock, then HO is the best choice. Also, you can find HO anywhere. N Scale has gotten very popular in the past 10 years, and you can find just about anything you need. It also has a great scenery to track ratio, and in a 10' x 10' room, you can pack a great deal of layout in N. I switched from N to Z almost 5 years ago, after being in N for 20ish years. Started in HO as far as layout building goes. I have a layout's worth of HO and a layout's worth of N in the attic. I found the fun that was lost with N, in Z, where everyone is forced to get down and do their own modeling. It's heck of expensive, there's nothing available, and it offers the best scenery to track ratio of any of the scales. I would choose Z Scale for a 10' x 10' room because you will be able to pack a great deal or model railroading in a very small space. Most train shops can get MTL and ALZ stuff for you, and ebay has lots of stuff too. If your benchwork is only 18" to 24" deep, you can easily access any portion of the layout, and still pack great vista's in there. Try that with HO. If HO is your choice, build a Timesaver switching layout and at least 1 big loop to sit back and just run trains.
Mac, I'm in HO myself (though I've been through #1, N and Z in my time), but most of what you say near the end of your original post makes me think N would be right for you. The only 'maybe' I see is "Looking forward to doing switching and such. That is what sounds fun to me" which might be better in HO. (I'll get shouted at I'm sure ). You should do some research on this and try and test it on some existing layouts - maybe ask someone at a train show.
With your layout size and your idea for scenery I would go with N scale. I've switched from N to H0 in 1980. That time N scale engines did not run as well as H0. But today you can switch with N scale engines as well as with H0. Wolfgang
Macattack1, welcome to the boards! I voted for N scale as that is what I am planning on with my space I have. I have roughly a 13'x6' room and I chose N because you can do a lot more with N in a space like that (among other parameters, you'll see below). You can do quite a bit with HO, but with what I want to do, I am going N (unless some divine intervention happens and I change my mind). You have to do what is best for you. There is quite a bit available in N scale, with a lot more on the way. It really is purely personal preference. Enjoy the hobby, do not fret over much. The toughest part is deciding what to model. I have seen some real good advice: What timeframe are you looking to model? A particular road? Once you decide on them, then pick the scale. Remember to have a good time! By the way, once I get my N scale up and running, I may do an HO switching layout on a shelf above the N layout. Why not?
I have a very sort of NOT finished basement room that is roughly 12' wide by about 16' long. The door frame is pushed into the side of this space right about in the middle, and I am not interested in having a train room with no door/lock on it. Also, I want to maintain access to the main drain line cleanout coming out of the house just in case, perish the thought, I ever need to snake it. I also want to avoid putting anything sensitive directly beneath where my bathroom sink is since the plumbing there has a way of popping apart every six months, resulting in icky drain water raining down through the floor/ceiling. (Maybe I should just fix the dang plumbing and get rid of that cheesy plastic compression fit garbage.) Anyway, back to the question, I am an N-scaler, decided on in part because of the amount of layout I can squeeze into my space and because I have found an N scale club with people I can get along with and it's handy to be able to share ideas and information, trade equipment, and so on. I am also charmed with the N scale gear and I am not sure I could go much smaller (e.g., Z scale) and still see anything. Of course, I am also thinking of doing some On3 or On30 some day simply because the variety of logging stuff and rolling stock is wider than Nn3. Adam
Any that has D&H Products I have to say for me as a D&H collector that it's more of what scales have what I'm looking for and not just a handful of items. This is why today my collection is heavy in both N & HO with several O and just one Z so far. I could run a very nice large sized N, HO, or O layout with my collection becuase I have access to what I'm looking for. So, pick the scale based on what works best for you based on several parameters including but not limited to: Space, Era, Product Availibility, $$$, and Scratch Building Skills.
I would highly recommend going to the N Scale Convention in KY next year. If you want to see some N Scale modeling, this is going to be the place. It is going to have the largest collection of N Scale moduals ever assembled in one place.
N scale, for all the reasons already noted. N has come a LONG way in the last 10 years, and with the room you've got, you could have a nice N scale layout. I have a space a little bigger than yours - you can see photos of my layout via the link below. Especially if you like doing scenery, N seems like it would be great fit for you.
