Yes, and we will keep on seeing these posts. Whether some folks like it, or not. The obvious problem is lack of information from manufacturers. If they would just stop by, now and then, to at least give us a best guesstimate at the time, such a gesture would go a long way. Until that day, we live in their silence and are left to wonder. Which creates and perpetuates the ongoing frustration being seen.
I understand why it's asked so often... I just don't get why it is asked here so often. Rather than ask the question here and generate lots of speculation, why not ask Atlas and come back here and post their reply for the benefit of others? I do agree that Atlas could be a little more transparent. They give their best guess one to one if you ask them, but they really could use a press release on their website. Perhaps a segment of their shipping report devoted to current track conditions, even if it just says "Well, we don't know for sure either, but check back here for the latest information". It would be an opportunity to pitch some products they do have... "We don't know, but we'll update our website with new info as it becomes clear. In the mean time check out the new products available right now!" and probably lighten the load on their support people and spare them from answering the same question all the time too. I believe I'll head over there and ask them about doing that!
It is asked here, most likely of venting frustration. Atlas could post, and likely that would be the very best. Yes, I know they are busy. Yet they do field plenty of questions through their CSD, daily, which eats up many an hour. Rather than getting a, (hopefully unedited, uninterpreted re-post from an intermediary, whom we must hope posed the question as needed), straight from someone such as Paul Graf- Who is a member and does on rare occasion make his presence known. There certainly is a large enough audience here, to have a significant impact.
Vadim, the Fast Tracks templates DO allow you to build hinged switch points. The template shows exactly where to cut the rail and add PCB ties. Randy
I asked the question here, quite frankly, because I could not find out an answer from Atlas. I have been able to get things going on my layout with out the need for new items until recently. As a noobie, I was looking for alternatives and I think ME track might be the answer for me. I have considered building my own turnouts, but I have serveral reservations, my eye sight is not what it use to be, and the ability to make the frogs correctly. This has lead me to consider getting a jig. The downside is cost. Right now don't have the $300 to shell out for a jig, so the information about trying to build some via the paper layout while applealing, is still a bit scary. My biggest problem is I am a perfectionist. If I don't think i can do it right, I wait, some times forever. Take for instance I need to paint my track. I have all the necessary parts - paint, airbrush, etc. but I have never done it before and afraid of making a mistake. I know that sounds dumb, which is why i ask questions here to help convince myself I am able to do it and it is ok to make a mistake.
For a variety of reasons, I have chosen to hand-lay turnouts with the Proto:87 parts that Bob referenced up-thread. I have been very pleased with the results, but I too am a perfectionist and for the life of me, I cannot make one in less than a few hours. Further, while I love the results, I don't really enjoy the process. It's just not that fun to build a few dozen turnouts, especially when there are so many other tasks on the layout- to-do list. I have committed to making the visible turnouts on my main decks by hand, but I am still weighing the options of commercial turnouts for the staging areas (which are still mostly accessible). I totally understand the perfectionist streak. In my case, I just told myself to plow ahead and if something didn't turn out the way I liked, I'd do it over. The only thing you have to lose is some time and effort (and maybe some money). The alternative is that you lose time doing nothing and have nothing to show for it. Just be willing to start over, if necessary. -Gary
Vadim, You haven't done your research. Here are the "facts" about hand-laid turnouts. Proto87 Stores turnouts have hinged closure points. There aren't any "rules" about building turnouts other than keeping NMRA standards so your trains will run through them. Having built hundreds of turnouts in several scales, my experience tells me that the weak point in any turnout is the "throwbar"...the thingy that operates the closure points. I've come to the conclusion (from three decades of experience) that simply soldering the closure points to a PCB throwbar isn't the solution. Yeah, sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. I want a solution that isn't too difficult, isn't expensive and is bomb-proof. Before I go on, building turnouts IS "fiddly"...and it takes time. If you've got a lot of a certain # of turnouts to build, the Fast Track jigs and fixtures will assist you to build them faster and the initial $200+ dollar expense can be amortized over a lot of turnouts. As Tony pointed out, one version of the "kits" is supplied with enough rail for five turnouts, but it costs ten bucks more (for a #7). Using the Fast Tracks jigs and fixtures gives you a very basic PCB turnout. There are a couple of flaws in the design as I see it, but they're easily fixed. The first fix is to use more PCB ties in the head block and frog areas, with a couple more in between those points to make the turnout more rigid. This is especially important with code 55 and code 40 rails, which are pretty flimsy. The second fix is to use Proto87 Stores closure point hinges (an inexpensive etched fret) and hinge the closure points. This will make simple soldered closure point tips much more durable, getting rid of the "fixed parallelogram" torsion produced by flexing non-hinged closure points. To make the closure points "bomb-proof", I'd use my method to hinge them too so you never have to worry about them breaking under normal use. Doing these three things will slow down your turnout construction a bit, but you'll never have to repair a turnout (under normal usage) after it's painted, weathered and ballasted. An added plus is that the points become extremely easy to switch, and should be fully adaptable to just about any switch machine or manual throw...plus, hinged points look more prototypical. I agree that if (IF) track and turnouts were available from Atlas, life would be easier for those not interested in laying their own turnouts. However, that's not the fact. The fact is, Atlas turnouts are getting difficult to come by...and, if you want to make progress on your layout, you can either just wait, or pay somebody to make your turnouts (trusting they know how) or learn to make your own. Those are your choices. Another benefit to learning how to lay your own turnouts is that your trackwork possibilities vastly expand. You're not required anymore to compromise your layout plan by being forced to use half a dozen different sizes and styles of turnouts. But, if it's too "fiddly" and time consuming for you, then you can just wait or pay somebody else to make 'em for you. Here's a photo I've posted before showing my solution to the throwbar weak point. If you're interested in how this is done, I'll be happy to write up a detailed description with more photos: Here's a photo of the Proto87 Stores hinge, which looks very prototypical is easy as pie to install: Since these are foreground turnouts and will be photographed a lot by me, I'm also using Proto87 Stores tri-planed closure points, which look and function really great but add almost ten bucks to the cost of a turnout. Functionally, a typical construction technique for making closure points will save a lot of money and work just as well as the tri-planed points. I just really like the way Andy's points look (meaning prototypical). Cheers! Bob Gilmore
Gary, I cheat. I use my 250W American Beauty Resistance Soldering Station along with my old Archer 35W iron. I tin (where applicable) with the iron, and almost all the other soldering is done with the resistance solderer, which allows me to both hold and solder simultaneously, greatly speeding up the process. I also note that if I do a turnout here, a turnout there, I can't do one in less than a couple of hours since I have to re-gather up the materials and pieces/parts, clean off my workbench, lay out my paper templates etc. However if I wait until I have several to do, I'll usually build them as a monolithic unit, and then amortize the time between three or six turnouts. That usually ends up being between 45 minutes and an hour per turnout...especially if I use the tri-planed closure points from Andy, meaning I don't have to make my own. I don't include the time in my estimations to actually install them and get them up and running with feeders, non-PCB ties, Tortoises underneath, painting, weathering, ballasting etc....just the time on the workbench getting built. That's something to include in the time estimate I suppose...the non-PCB ties, as all the ties are present on commercial turnouts, so it takes a bit longer to install hand-laid turnouts than it does to install commercial turnouts. Cheers! Bob Gilmore
The most recent schedule we have received from the factory has shipments of code 55 track starting in June (meaning a late July or early August delivery to Atlas) and continuing through the end of the year. This is subject to change for a variety of reasons, as we had started with our biggest selling track line, HO Code 100, and are progressing through the lines as it makes the process most efficient for the factory. Things may get juggled around as the new factory sets up the tooling for production and finds things that may not work with their machinery and the tooling has to be adjusted accordingly. We are in daily communication with the factories producing our products, and are working to get all of our products, track, locos, rolling stock, and accessories, back into regular production as quickly as possible. We apologize for the delay and thank you for your patience.
Randy, Thanks, but, at previous my post i mean abscene of joints at above mentioned hand-layed turnouts. I mean abscence of joints at wing rails and at throw bar, which lead to unavailability of using Atlas undertable switch machines for this turnouts. These switch machines cannot suppy enough force to switch it. These hand made kits must be modified to have these 4 joints, because there is no flat and convenient swhitch machines exists with strong force of switching. --------- Vadim
"Here's a photo I've posted before showing my solution to the throwbar weak point. If you're interested in how this is done, I'll be happy to write up a detailed description with more photos:" Does a bear go potty in the woods Mr Gilmore? Of course we would like to see more!
Ok Bob .. you have peaked my interest. What is the bare minimum of equipment and tools that I would need to make my own turnouts? Also, add my vote to see a detailed description!
Vadim, You are probably right . I do not use electric machines on my switches, I use model aircraft control rods and frog juicers.
No , much simpler and lots cheaper.. like these....http://www.handlaidtrack.com/BullFrog-Manual-Turnout-Control-s/2087.htm
