Thoughts needed on possible track plan change on the GD&R

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the input.

Interesting you should mention that. It is something I already do since it would be really easy to use the whole layout to switch one customer.

Not sure what you mean by "I'm a little afraid you've stuck the penin out too far, and that the door won't open all the way." The door swings out of the building and away from the layout, This was noted in post #18

I was thinking that I would put one inside the loop. It might be too tight for two. I cannot get to the right side of the peninsula on the bottom right of the plan for a couple reasons:

1. There is a sky board there (that could come down).
2. There is only 12 inches max to get between the wall and the peninsula.

Thanks,

Gary

 

Thanks for the precision, I see that we have the same goals with operating a model railroad. Switching is always fun on the opposite of continuously running trains all the way round which can be quickly boring... And sorry for the typing error for my first name!

Dom

 

Whoops! Sorry, missed the "out part or something

 

Back to the drawing board or At it again

Hi all,

First let me say thanks for all the input so far.

I have not made any changes to the layout yet. Life issues got in the way which may have been a good, since I have had more time to think about any possible changes.

Still working in the bottom right of the plan I have extended the bench work, which may allow me to add the two customers back in.

Not really sure if I have the room for both customers, but neither take up much space.

So that you don't have to go back through the tread, here is the last plan that we were discussing


Thanks,

Gary

 

Hi Gary,
just a few questions:
1) why is it impossible to use the central part of your space with only a very short, though wide peninsula? With only one track at the bottom, completely different from the bewildering web of tracks on the top leg.
2) You did not drew turnouts to scale, especially on the top leg you could get less in as drawn.
3) You have a pretty short interchange track at the top, is it meant as a fiddle track?
4) With the three turns from your operating plan all doing laps over the oval, these trains will be in each others way. Do you intend to run these 3 trains at the very same time with 3 operators?
5) Why did you plan such a bewildering web in the first place?
6) with 3 turns in need of power as engine terminal seems missing. Or did I overlook it?
7)in your operating plan you do not mention the interchange. Will you run a fourth turn to bring its cars in?
Don't get me wrong, these questions are meant to understand your planning goals.
Smile
Paul

 

I also think you are trying to squeeze to much into the space you have. Way to many spurs in my opinion.

 

It seems to me this layout could benefit from hidden staging!

 

I see wiring issues with all the loop backs crossover switches. I would make it simple and get rid of those. I touched up the places I am refering to..It is your layout, this is just IMO and FYI..

 

Some GOOD questions

Hi Paul,

Let me try to answer your questions.

1) The short peninsula holds part of the city that the railroad is located in and has non railroad related structures other then one customer. The one customer is located in the green part of the images below (The different colors show different additions to the bench work). The reason the peninsula is short and stubby is, I felt I needed some more room to walk around in the room because of the corner of the desk that is partly under the blue section and mostly under the red ell on the right bottom. At one time the peninsula was about 1/2 as wide and twice as long thus the funny shape at one corner. The first image represents the bench work in 2008 before I changed it to what it is now as seen in the second image

​

2) The drawings are as close as possible that I can get with my graphics program. Sorry it was not drawn with any of the free programs like XCad etc., but I know how to use the program I have, and have tired the others and they and I cannot get it to come together for some reason. Maybe I don't have the patience needed to learn a new program.

3) The short interchange track at the top is my DCC programing track, and it has 1 or 2 cars interchanged there during an op secession, and is use as a fiddle track.

4) Only one train (turn) is out and about at a time. I am the only operator.

5) It did not start out that way in the beginning. Here is a photo of what it looked like 7 years ago. The yellow in the images above is this section of bench work. All the switches on the layout were located in what is now the top center of the layout. The layout, in 2004, was based on an article I read in MR which was based on the "Time Saver". Some of the time saver track is still in the layout.

6) In the small yard there is an engine shop. The story line is that the GD&R is made up of many short lines and this is just one of the small regional railroads. Any major engine repairs are made at one of the other divisions (read off line) of the railroad.

7) I am the only operator and as I operate at this time two, of the three turns each service the two interchanges. Below is the schematic of how I operate the railroad. All three turns leave the yard (2nd line drawing of the four) and using the Y head off to their respective customers. Turn 1 (the bottom drawing) serves one of the interchanges and an industrial district. Turn 3 (the 3rd drawing) serves the other interchange which is where most of the cars will come from and go to. Not shown in either of the images in my last post are removable fiddle/staging tracks that span the door way, That was mentioned in post #1.

​

You can see more detailed information on my operating plan at http://gdrinc.com/Railroad/my_operating_plan.html

Thanks for the questions Paul, I hope my answers help.

Regards,

Gary

 

Hi Ken,

Thanks for your input and I have to agree with you that I have crammed in a lot into a small area.
:blush:
I like switching more then running around in a loop, thus the many spurs.

Regards

Gary

 

Hi RatonMan,

Your right it can benefit with some staging tracks, which is what the far right track leads to at the top of the current ell or the proposed changes.

Current operating track plan



The first proposed changes.

​

The staging area will be visible, which is ok since I'm the only operator.

Thanks,

Gary

 

Hi Ken,

One of the spurs on the left side could go to the inside. The far right goes to future staging tracks that will span the door opening (this is the same for the current track plan). The door opens OUT of the building so there is no fear of someone slamming the door into the removable section.

Thanks,

Gary

 

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the input.

I understand the concern about wiring issues and reversing sections, they can be a nightmare. My auto reversing units have not failed me yet, other then operator error.


The only area that I'm considering changing is at the bottom of the track plan.

The top part of the track plan is from what I started in 2004 and I operate that section as an industrial district. That is seen in the operating schematic below as the bottom line.


As for the crossovers at the bottom of the plan, they are proposed changes/additions to the current track plan. Adding them in permits the turning of trains from both directions as well as adding another passing track.


The proposed changes are being considered for the following reasons among others.

• Provide more running time between customers
• When I’m letting a train just circle the layout Ell is not used. It only gets used during one of my “operating sessions.” Trains circle the layout with I have my Grandchildren visiting, Non-Model Railroaders visiting, and when I just what to see them run while I’m working of something else.
• The two switches that are involved to get to the Ell or yard are hard to reach to operate. Yes I know that I can put switch motors or long reach ground throws on them.
• It would balance the bench work visually

I have not committed to any changes at this time.

Thanks,

Gary

 

Hi Gary,
the drawing is not done beautifully, I will explain the reason behind the ideas.
A not to steep grade is added. The idea is from W. Allen McClelland.
Combine the staging or fiddle tracks with a classification yard or at least have them nearby.

I consider the fiddle track as a staging yard; trains from there are about to enter your empire.
They probably will have to be re-blocked or sorted out in the yard first.
After one of your turns is made up it is ready to hit the road.
You are doing lap-running to gain distance. When going around the oval, you finally end up on the track along the lower wall of your layout. IMHO this track would be the place for a choice. Or doing another lap or reverse the direction of your train by means of a reversing loop. Hence the way the crossover is placed.
Operationally you would not need the two reversing loops on the upper side of your layout.
Cars from other interchanges can be taken to the yard first, to be placed in the proper turn or they can leave the layout by going to the fiddle tracks.
Adding a high line along the yard seems a pretty change of scenery treatment to me. Having the possibility to create long staging (fiddle) tracks could be an asset as well.
Smile
Paul

 

Hi Paul,

You present an interesting concept that I had not thought of. I reworked it a bit. below is my latest version



I'm not a fan of hidden switches so I moved all the staging/fiddle tracks to the removable section as I was planning on doing now for a few years. Still deciding if it will be a sector plate or switches.

Thanks,

Gary

 

Anyone have a "How To" on building a sector plate?

Hi All,

Thanks for the vote for sector plate Ken. I too am leaning that way, no matter if I make changes to the layout or not.

Anyone have a "How To" on building a sector plate? If so can you point me in the right direction?

Here is the information/dimensions that I have/want to work with

• Base plate for holding the sector plate 10 X 42.25 inches
• Number of tracks 3. At one time I was thinking 5.
• Track Spacing 1.5 inches.
• Sector Plate width 6 inches.
• Tracks = about 533 scale feet each. That will be more then I need for staging and and interchanging. Most of my trains will be 1 loco and 4-6 cars. Based on an average length of 60 scale feet per unit I will have room to spare.
• All moving of the plate is to be done by hand.

Below are crude images of the 3 different positions of the Sector Plate

• The Yellow area represents the current bench work
• The Brown represents track
• Small white dot (left end) represents the pivot point
• Please ignore the saw tooth look in the top and bottom images. My graphics program did that when converting to jpegs.
• Please ignore the larger circle on the left end of each image

Anyone do a sliding plate instead of pivoting?

Any thoughts on what type of material to use for the base and plate? I'm thinking MDF

Thanks,

Gary

 

Anyone have a "How To" on building a sector plate?

azHi All,

In the effort to NOT confuse the issue, which it most likely will do, :headspin:I have started a new thread titled Anyone have a "How To" on building a sector plate? The new thread contains some new questions and information.

I'm hoping it will start/provide a general discussion on Sector Plates.

I respectfully request that anyone who wishes to answer any of my questions in post #38 above in this thread do so in the new thread.

Thanks,

Gary

 

I've been back to the drawing board. Again

Hi All,

The undecided process continues.

Yesterday before I did a short bit of ballasting in the mess in the top center, I was running a train clockwise around the layout and was wishing the loop was longer. Sometime during one of the laps I came up with the idea of not moving the yard, but having the loop run on both sides of the yard.

The following image (just the area I've been talking abouy) is the latest idea I came up with.



It still permits my point to point operations with little change to operations
Here are some of the benefits I see with this idea.

• Lets me run the loop for non railroaders (grandchildren, visitors, etc).
• Kept the original loop
• I would not have to relocate the yard.
• The two sidings are on curved switches and will give me back the two customers that were lost in the beginning of the thread
• With the yard inside the loop I can possibly access it from either track in the future. It is already wired to an auto reversing unit.

The green blob is a possible scene block with tunnel or it could be a cut.
The siding at the top right still leads to the future staging/fiddle area.

Other then the two curved switches I have all the track supplies needed to do this. I have used Peco switches exclusively on this layout and used 3 Peco Shorts in the area that I'm working with and I am thinking of replacing them with something larger since they will all be part of the main line with this change (I have a hand full of double stack cars with body mount couplers that don't like the Short Pecos). They are located at the following areas

1. In the middle of the current 180 curve on the bottom left of the layout.
   1. With this change the straight route will be used more the the diverging and this one may not have to be changed out.
2. The bottom lead for the yard in the bottom left of the layout just right of the curve as it comes off of the main.
3. The top lead for the yard as it too comes off of the main.

I will need to add a new switch in the top lead to the yard to continue to the loop.

I have a number of "Old New Stock" Snap type switches (not Atlas but a knock off) left over from my last layout in stock and may use them temporarily. All of my locos go through the Peco Shorts without any problems so I could modify the cars (lets not get into a truck mounted vs body mount fight here please) and not replace the switches.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Gary