I'm doing a scale change and am going to attempt a small N scale table layout in the dorm I'm moving into at Cal Poly in San Luis Obispo, CA in about a week. I want to keep it very light and portable, and I really like the prospects of Woodland Scenics Subterrain products. I've seen some photos around trainboard of people who've used the inclines and trackbed etc. and I'm just wondering how satisfied they are with it. WS only make the inclines and risers 2" wide, which is a little much for N scale but It'll allow for easy sidings--but it could be obtrusive on a small layout? Is it a worthwhile product? I've also noticed Woodland Scenics sells a great variety of very specific glues for their products--are any of these worth purchasing in place of more common adhesives (I love woodglue)? I'll try to keep everybody updated if I can when and if I start the layout. Thanks for any advice
Although I haven't used these products on my layout, I have heard many people say that they are satified with them. Many of the comments focus on the ease of use aspect of the sub-terrain products. I have also heard many people state that the glues the WS repackage are just over-priced versions of regular glues available everywhere. I would go ahead and use the wood glue if you already love it. Just don't use any solvent based glues as these will eat right through the styrofoam!
having an all-foam layout base, I'm definately in favor of the WS stuff - although I did buy my glue from Home Depot you can see my in-progress pics below - the stuff is very easy to work with. I agree that the product would be a lot better selling if it came in a slighter wider (for 2 lines) and slighter narrower (for the single line). I had to improvize on some areas for that very reason.
Although I've not used those particular WS products, I've heard only good words from those who have. I'd say it's a safe bet to give them a try. Boxcab E50 [ 09. September 2003, 23:03: Message edited by: BoxcabE50 ]
and Derek, obviously the benefit you'll get is the difference in track height... In real-life operations the track is not purposly raised and lowered to make it look better but, having the flexability to do so was one of my main objectives in my first track layout - I personally dont care for only a single level of track. If you'll look close enough, you'll see I have a 1/2" layer of foam on top of my base.... this allows for a lower second level (if you plan on one) and small ups and downs and a nice 2% incline see my links below for pics and email me if you want to know more
I like your layout...Its very similar to some of the concepts I've drawn up for mine. I notice the WS inclines are articulated so they bend...Is it realistic to cut them lengthwise at all without losing structural integrity? How much can you shave of the sides? I also notice you used cork under the switches rather than Trackbed, what was your reason for that? How much foam insulation do you use for the base? Is one 2" sheet enough strength-wise...I wouldn't want a floppy layout. My layout will be roughly 30"x78" max. How big do the foam sheets come and what's the easiest way to cut it? Does a standard utility knife work...I wont have access to any power tools in the dorm room....(heh)
Cutting the inclines was solely a space issue... I would have put something (in this case a layer of 1/2" foam) on the top for the trackbed surface - like the 2" wide balsa strips on the double incline - it just wasn't wide enough alone. I did some "pressure tests" with my hand and it holds up well. Balance was another concern, but no problem. Cork was used becasue of the width of all the turnouts and such...for the main switch area. I want that area all elevated to the same level. If foam was available in that width, I would have just used that. For the other switches, I just like the convience of the atlas precut shapes As far as the base, I used 4" (2 x 2") with perpindicular alignment - it's pretty solid! The 2" by itself i would not recommend. The 1/2" layer on top was only for the little drops in elevation I wanted - but it also provided a sketch pad and flat surface to work on. I used foam vs plywood so riverbeds and such wouldn't mean cutting plywood... only a sharp knife. The 2" sheets come 4x8 with lengthwise perferations - the 1/2" was 4x8 too with no perferations (nice flat surface to work with, also a helpful giant pin cushion when I pinned and repinned and repinned the track until I was happy). I'll add some pics in a few minutes to show you base construction.
ok here's the pics... the under side (you can see the perferations - you can snap them or utility knife will work too) and the levels...which I hope give the layout just a little more interesting touch
and closer where I split the inclines... and [ 10. September 2003, 01:55: Message edited by: nscale_lover ]
Looks good--I think I'll follow your lead. For N scale in general, is there any radius advice? I was hoping to stay above 10 inches, but I'm not familiar with the scale so I'm not sure what kind of problems that'll cause w/equipement. Do the Subterrain products have problems bending to that radius? What's next? I think, for convenience and mess consideration, that I'd use the WS plaster cloth over balled up newspaper. Wondering what you'd decided to do...(anything to do with toilet paper?!) Thanks for the tips and the very helpful pictures. I move into the dorm on Saturday and hopefully I can start scouting for supplies next week!
radius advice - as big as space will allow not sure about the scenery supplies I'll use, but I need to do something SOON, I'm having dreams about making layouts
I would like to add one suggestion: Try to add a hatch or access door for any track that is under a mountain or in a tunnel, because when the track gets dirty you will have a hard time cleaning it. I learned the hard way!
guys, any idea what the technical name for that foam is? I intend building a 6x3 HO layout using those foam risers and want to keep the weight down...a foam layout 4" thick framed by 12mm MDF would certainly be light enough.
"2inch thick rigid insulation foam" is the term that I used when calling around....1st calls were to the local hardware stores, they directed me to the 'bulk' housing supply/housing insulation businesses and they had it. Not sure what the 'technical' term was... try maybe extruded polystyrene foam blue or green in color [ 24. September 2003, 04:46: Message edited by: nscale_lover ]
The fun begins! I got my baby in the mail today... A used Atlas SP B23-7 off of ebay, not much, but she's a beauty, runs great, and my first N scale locomotive. Still can't say I prefer N over HO though... All I've got for now is a some samples of the WS foam inclines and etc. to play around with before a whole bunch of it arrives that I mail-ordered. I set up a 6' long 2% grade on the dorm floor here that I can roll cars down! Heh...Anyway I still have to figure out how to get a large-ish piece of foamboard back to the college from the Home Depot across town... Its always exciting to start from the beginning again!! Definitely the World's Greatest Hobby
<snicker> I've got images of a grown man lying on the floor rolling train carriages down a hill and across the floor with a big grin on his face..... until someone opens the door and steps on it
