Newbie needs help

Hi, everyone. I am new to the hobby, and have built my first track. But I am having a problem with switches. I used all Atlas track, and have problems with derailments, or the cars disconnecting from the engine when going through the switch. I am sure there is a topic on this subject somewhere, but I have not been able to find it. Can someone point out where I can get info on this.

Thanks

Doug Kaufman

 

Hi, Doug. Welcome to Trainboard.

Let's see if we can figure out what's going wrong with the switches.

First question: Are you using automatic knuckle couplers like Micro-Trains couplers or Atlas Accumate couplers (they come with all NEWER Atlas cars). Either one of these coupler types SOMETIMES causes problems when moving over switch tracks (also called turnouts)

The main reason is because the metal "trip pin" (which hangs down from the coupler) can sometimes sag too low, so it catches on the crossing rails on the turnout. If the trip pins are the correct height, then you won't have any problems. Micro-Trains makes a "coupler height gauge" which shows if your couplers are at the correct height.

Here is a picture of an Atlas covered hopper and a coupler height gauge. You can see that the coupler on the car lines up almost perfectly with the coupler on the gauge. See how much space is between the trip pin and the top of the rails? These couplers will never catch on turnouts and cause derailments:



If that is NOT what is causing your derailments, then let us know as much as you can about the track and cars that are involved in your derailments. Someone here will probably be able to help you.

 

I have been derailed many times.
It seems from your post that it happens at a turnout (switch). Is the train going in a direction that it can go two different ways when entering the switch section, or is it coming from the other direction and once through the switch has nowhere to go but onto the one track? If the latter, it might be that the points are touching the wrong track. Try throwing the switch.
Pardon me if I am being a bit simplistic, but I can not tell from the information supplied if we are way beyond that issue.

 

Is your track ballasted? Sometimes the ballast will get stuck on the plastic on the guide rails for the turnout. That will cause the wheels to raise up over the rail and derail or uncouple. Also some ballast and glue can get stuck in the switch rod (the bar that is in the bottom of switch that moves the points). If that happens the points won't be shoved up against the rails and the trucks on the cars will try to go down different paths of the turnout. Sometimes the points need to be adjusted otherwise they will do that on their own.

Most of the time that I had problems with cars uncoupling at turnouts it is from the trip pins getting snagged on something like Kisatchie said.
I hope this helps you.

 

Thanks for the responses so far. However, I don't think these are the problems. I do not believe that I have any auto coupler cars, but I will check. Also, I have not yet glued balast to the track. Is there any modifications you need to make to the turnouts to make them run well. As to the decoupling, the train is making a right hand turn when this occurs. Could there be an issue of weight, or the coupler being weak?

 

What code track and what powered and rolling stock are you using?

If large flanges and you are using Code 55 track, you will have a problem.

 

Fotheringill,

I am sorry but I don't know much about what you are talking about.

What is code 55 track?
What are flanges?

I have a nice 4-6-4 loco pulling some passenger cars. I am using all standard Atlas turnoff's.

 

Code 55 track is a lower railheight. the standard code 80 track is waaaaay off from the prototype, and code 55 is a way to make it a little more realistic. unfortunatly (this is where flanges come in) sometimes the wheels are too big to accomodate these lower rail tops.

the flange is the part of the wheel that "guides" the train around the track, its the lip of the wheel that fits inside the rail. if this is too big, as some of the atlas cars come with, when used with lower rail heads, they will cause the train to pop off of the track, or de-rail.

okay, as far as your train comming apart across a turnout, i believe the best and easiest way to do this is with the help of pictures.

first, im under the assumption that you are using the standard rapido coupler, seen here:

even a small "bobble" could cause these to come apart, it could honestly be anything. i personally have never liked these couplers, and have gotten rid of them in replacement for microtrains knuckles seen here:



if you do not want to do this.... what you need to do is watch the train go through the turnout. look and make sure that the couplers are properly aligned up and down. see if the couplers are sliding apart sideways, or over/under one another.

for the derailment, we need to know if its comming off at the frog (the thiny that looks like a "X" (kinda) or the points (the rails that move) also, what direction are you moving in, are you going toward the split? or are you going toward to bring two tracks into one.... if you need pictures of this, let me know.

hope this has helped some.
-Rob

 

Look at the underside of spare track. It will have an Atlas catalog #. Go to www.atlasrr.com and look up the track to see if it is Code 80 or 55. The difference is that you might be derailing if the wheels are Code 80 and the track is Code 55. Please do NOT get frustrated and chuck it all. Wheelsets can be easily replaced. If you purchased all of your stuff from one place, call them and ask what they sold to you.

 

Well, I am starting to learn what you guys are talking about. First, I have only 80 track and not 55. So, I don't think that is the problem. A friend had an interesting thought, that the decoupling could be caused by that the coal car's coupler being bad or weak. I am going to try that. As to derailing it only happens occasionaly, so it is hard to sit there to catch. Unfortunately, I just had a major tragedy last night while looking for this. My best engine, the 4-8-4 locked up and won't run. I think a wheel is in the wrong position because the metal things that move are no longer aligned.

Any ideas on how to fix this, or do I have to take this to the shop?

 

dktiger501, are "the metal things that move", which are called siderods, out of line on both sides of the locomotive, or only on one side. If it is on only one side, one of the drive wheels ahs come loose from the axle and must be 'requartered", not an easy task for a "newbie"

If it is on both sides, the retainer plate is too loose and the axle gear has slipped in relation to its idler. This is not hard to fix, but requires much patience.

I suspect your 4-8-4 is a Bachmann, and if so, you can return it to them for repair or replacement. See www.bachmanntrains.com

 

It is on both sides, which is why I noticed the difference. I will check to see if it is Backman. Thanks for the info.

Doug

 

Tiger-

Go slow-

I would suggest you purchase an inexpensive diesel with which to do your "test"runs.
If you have Code 80 track, and it happens only once in a while, I would like to ask a magic question- hook like couplers or knuckle like couplers?- the latter will hold better.
Next- Is the turnout secure onto the cork roadbed, or does it flop a bit up and down?
Third- is the car that is derailing a very lightweight car ? Does it weigh approximately two ounces or is it much lighter? Use a weightwatcher's scale or somesuch to see. A very light car may not hold when going through a turnout. It will not derail or uncouple every time, but only sometimes.

 

Tiger,

Careful with that steamer also. If you're comparing the siderod position on one side to the position on the opposite side you need to understand that they are not positioned exactly the same, and not 180° apart. They should be 90° apart. That is what is meant by "quartering".

Now having said that, the rod that connects the drivers, on each side seperately, should be paralellel with the rail. So if the rod pin on the first driver is at the 6 o'clock position, the other drivers in that set should also be at 6 o'clock. Then the rod pins on the opposite side would be 90° off from that. (Have I completely confussed you yet? I hope not.)

Maybe the best advise would be to take it in to your local model railroad shop and have them explain it to you. Assuming you have a nearby shop with qualified personel, and not just the average "hobby store".

I would also suggest you pick up a "beginners" book. Kalmbach Publishing (Model Railroader magazine) has "N Scale Model Railroading" and Atlas has "Introduction to N Scale Model Railroading". Both might be of some help to you.

Mike

[ 10. August 2004, 22:19: Message edited by: GimpLizard ]

 

Thanks again for everyones input. A couple of things. First, I think the decoupling was caused by the coupler on the coal car. It has a very strange spring design that lets it float up/down and left/right. It is so loose, that I could see a little jiggling through the tunout causing a problem. As to derailing, I will bet it has to do with the cars being light. I will have to get a scale for that. I thought I saw a thread about weight being .5 to .8 oz or something like that. All my track is nailed down tight, but I am still wiring all my switches (I am beginning to hate wiring).

Thanks all

Doug

 

Careful with nailing down the track, especially in N scale. Better would be to glue down the roadbed and then glue the track to roadbed. You will not be then possibly nailing down so hard that the track goes out of gauge. You will need an N gauge tool from the NMRA. It is a bit pricey, but worth it in the long run. If the tracks have been nailed down so tightly that the tie seems to bend downward, it probably means the track are out of gauge and it very well may be causing derailments.
Might I suggest you do the following? Register at railimages.com Take several close up pictures of the problem areas and post them at that site. Revive this thread and point us to the right album and someone can probably tell you in a minute if the track is the issue.
As to nailing - if all done, so be it. If not all done, I strongly suggest the glue method. The tracks will be permanent, especially after ballast poured and glued in. The tracks will not move after that. Careful of the swithcing mechanisms and not to block them.
I nailed, since that is what the book says. There are other and better ways. Just go slowly, expect mistakes and have the fortitude not to chuck it all, but rather to correct your mistakes. It is a personally rewarding expenditure of your leisure time.

 

Sorry, but it is to late. It is all nailed. I like the idea of gluing, but I don't want to play with it at this point. In general the track is runing well, except for an occasional problem with the turnout. Let me check on the car weights, and then we will go from there.

Doug