Have been looking at a couple of things about handlaying track and turnouts (I downloaded a turnout calculator). How hard is it really? And where would you buy supplies to hand build, especially turnouts (frogs etc)? I wouldn't mind having a go at it, kinda like getting into the "true" spirit - especially if it may be more cost effective in the long run Any and all thoughts and info welcome Cheers Bruce
The main supplier for handlaying track is Micro Engineering. They offer rail in several sizes as well as weathered and unweathered. They also sell spikes and ties. You will also need something for the throwbar. I use PC board cut in strips. You can buy pre-cut PCB ties from Clover House (no website). If you are going to go to the trouble of building your own turnouts you might as well make your own frogs. Instead of a separate piece, I make my frogs as a continuation of the rails. It isn't really that hard to make your own turnouts but it does take practice and time. I build mine at my workbench on a template I made using a CAD program. I have stardard turnouts or I can make one to fit a specific location. It takes me about 2 hours to make a turnout but that doesn't include some of the prep work. It costs about $2.00 USD in supplies. You will need to glue ties down and let them dry. Then you will have to sand all the ties level. Then you have to stain the tops again. If you want any more information I will provide it but start with this. David
Not that difficult at all. I handlay in N, and even though I did not use my first 2 turnouts, my 3rd and subsequent ones are being used. Not sure what scale you are in, but you don't need much in the way of supplies: Ties, rail, gauges (wheelsets will work), files, soldering supplies, tweezers, and you are pretty much good to go. If you plan to spike rails, you will need spikes and a way to drive them. Just take your time, I do not use formal templates anylonger, but recommend them for at least the first couple of attempts. One hint on the filing rails is to make sure that the filed area is vertically true, and that the top of the rails join smoothly. My first couple attempts did not allow the tops of the rails to join cleanly, as the bottom of the rails were wider. Go for it, and have some fun. There are a ton of resources on line, try some searches.
Bruce - I don't know if anyone has formally welcomed you to Trainboard yet .. but I'd like to welcome you again anyway. Glad to have you aboard mate. I began to hand lay code 100 rail for my HO layout many years ago. I found a book titled, "Trackwork Handbook" by Paul Mallery, published in 1977 that I have found extremely helpful. I don't know if it is still in print, but I'm sure there are other publications that are similar. I like Mallerys' book because it clearly illustrates how to build any rail feature that you can imagine, and provides several different templates. I think you will be surprised how easy, (and fun) it is to hand lay your rails. I recommend you start with a large rail such as code 100 just to get your feet wet, because smaller rail is more difficult to handle. I now hand lay code 70 and code 55 rail and turnouts, including dual guage. If you install hand throws for your turnouts you can keep the costs way down. Adding motors to your turnouts will obviously drive the costs up .. but you would have probably spent that money on commercial turnouts anyway. I have found it much more convenient to use hot glue as opposed to spikes to lay the rails. With smaller rail, there was always a problem with wheel flanges bouncing over a spike head that was not set down all the way, or because it had worked its way up. Another problem was that sometimes spikes would work themselves loose and be attracted to the electric motor of the locomotive and jam things up. Other advantages of using hot glue is you can not destroy ties like you can when the nose of your long nose pliers (used for driving the spike home) slips off the spike and punches a hole through tie(s) and roadbed; and, you can make easy adjustments to rail gauge and turnouts simply by slightly heating up the rail with a soldering iron and move it to where you want it. I recommend that you get yourself at least two, (but four are better) three point rail gauges. They are available in any gauge and any rail size you want to work with. You can't go wrong by having a NMRA track gauge handy too. Let us know how you come along with it.
like already said, it's not difficult at all, takes a little practice, but after a few turnouts you will be able to build a complete turnout in a couple of hours or so. I use Micro Engineering C40 rail and ME ties and Clover House (http://www.cloverhouse.com/) pc ties, this is N scale, so yes, try it, I'm sure you will like it.
Thanks guys. Sounds like it might be something I could do Just one more question. Are there any other gauges required aside from the NMRA gauge? Edit: Doh! I just re-read Bill's post about the gauges - my excuse : my kids hassling me! /Edit Oh, and how about the MicroEngineering stuff - do they have a website? (Oops, that was 2 questions....hmmm).... Now, any Aussies out there hand laying? Where do you grab your stuff from downunder? (Oh no! - 4 questions!!) BTW, I am getting back into RR in N-Scale. Cheers Bruce [ 26. November 2003, 23:07: Message edited by: racedirector ]
Micro Engineering Code 40 and 55 weathered and unweathered rail should be available from the Model Railroad Craftman in Blacktown, Bruce. Gary keeps the HO rail in stock and I have seen the N there as well. Call ahead unless you're making the trip anyway. 4/47 Bedford Rd, Blacktown - just off Sunnyholt Rd. 9831 8217.
Well, I am going to do it. Will grab the supplies next week (the ties need to be brought in) and take a stab at building some test track and a couple of turnouts. Turnouts will be the big test so my immediate task is to find info on hand laying them, building frogs etc etc. If I arm myself with enough info I should be OK. Thanks guys. Cheers Bruce
check out Yahoo! groups: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/handlaidtrack/ for a little help. Clover house has a lot of handlaying goodies as mentioned before. There is also a B & K Co. (?) making some N-Scale turnout kits, frogs and other assorted stuff. I can't remember if they have a website. By the way, what is the main scale we are talking about here? I'm in N-Scale and am looking into doing a lot more handlaying track work. If the manufacturers aren't gonna take the hint and produce some #10.#11, or #12 turnouts, I guess I will have to build them myself!
jkristia I had a look at your hand laying work - very nice! A couple of questions: Where did you get the template for the crossover - I have only seen turnouts and double slips on my travels. I downloaded a spreadsheet that allows turnout design but that hasn't got crossovers either. And.....by the looks of it you did everything in-place - track, turnouts, crossing etc from "continous"rail. Is that correct or did you build your turnouts and things on the bench beforehand? I am really itching to get on with a test piece but not all the supplies are avalble at the moment Cheers Bruce [ 28. November 2003, 12:15: Message edited by: racedirector ]
Thanks Mark Checking out the yahoo group now. We are talking about N scale. I am looking at doing this in code 55 rail in the beginning. Really looking forward to it! Cheers Bruce
Bruce, I handlayed over 40 H0 switches with my own frogs. The begin was a little bit tricky but today its an easy job and I have a lot of fun with. If you`re interested for more information and hints check John H. Wright`s website Good luck with your own project Stefan Railfan`s Homepage My Railimages gallery
Bruce, A couple of other sites I found to be quite helpful are the following: http://www.pcrailroad.org/ in the how to articles there is a pretty good outline of laying turnouts. http://www.wic.net/trainworx/ I get most of my supplies here--all ties both pc and wood and some guages. http://www.railwayeng.com/ found the QandA quite helpful http://sdsons.org/Club%20Documents/turnouts.html another good how to section also has some good templates, but they need to be enlarged somewhat to print--off hand, I forget what the exact ratio is for n, but recall it to be about 30-35% larger One other thing--I greatly prefer working with the unweathered ME rail. The weathered stuff does not take solder well at all. Once I lay the track, I simply paint it anyway. nodima
While I wait for my track gauges to arrive, I have a couple more questions.....and these 2 sort of run into each other. I was thinking about my hidden staging. Now some would say use commercial track and others would say hand laid due to better performance. I have planned to hand lay staging as well as 1. the cost of turnouts is reduced and 2. reliablility would probably increase. Any thoughts on this? And.....in general opionion what is better, Code 40 or Code 55? If, say, I was to hand lay staging turnouts but use flex track inbetween, which would be better. And my final question. After some planned practice of hand laying track, I thought that continous laying would be better than "sectional". I mean, including turnouts and crossings and not building them on the bench first. Can anyone comment on the pros and cons of this? Cheers Bruce
And my final question. After some planned practice of hand laying track, I thought that continous laying would be better than "sectional". I mean, including turnouts and crossings and not building them on the bench first. Can anyone comment on the pros and cons of this? Bruce - as long as you 'map out' the locations of turnouts and crossings, continuous hand laying makes more sense because you can "fuzz" track positions into alignment easier than you can with bench constructed units. As to your first questions, I would think it's just a matter of what you would personally prefer. There's no right or wrong there. I would still strongly recommend that you make a couple of HO or larger turnouts using heavier rail before attempting to build units out of code 40 or 55 rail. It would give you a better grip on what needs to be done, and how to do it. Small rail is really tricky to work with .. and we would hate to see you get discouraged because things are not going together the way you might want them to. What do you other guys think about that? Am I way off base here?
Hi Bruce, Tried to get to this over the weekend, but I was too busy altering some turnouts. IMHO, continuous laying can result in a better flow of trackwork, but there is more to consider when planning the trackwork and tie patterns/placement. Over the weekend, I wired a new engine service area. This is an area where I used continuous rail through as many turnouts as possible. I found that I was not careful enough in placing my pc board ties, and had some issues with rails shifting when gaps were cut, as I did not place pc ties in all the right places. Concerning staging and hidden TO's in general, make sure they are overbuilt and PERFECT before hiding them. It would be a shame to have a joint come unsoldered on a hidden section of track. You might make your visible TO's first, and once you have a few under your belt, then build the staging TO's. Not sure what you are using as criteria to define "better" in terms of rail size, but I find c40 is more finicky to work with than c55, but others may disagree. Either way, it should not matter if you join up with commercial flex track if the commercial track is of the same size and shape. For example, Peco c55 as you probably know is actually c80 rail buried in the ties. Bills point about laying an HO gauge T/O as a start makes some sense. You may be able to get by with simply creating one or two practice TO's at the bench, before trying to lay them in place. However, some of the techniques that work well with c 40 and c55 do not work as well in some of the larger rail sizes. Points especially. The real beauty is that your second TO will be 100 times better than your first, and the third even better still. Just have fun, and take your time. Kirk
The trouble you would have laying an HO turnout first is that you will need to get an HO NMRA gauge that you will only use for these test turnouts. The most important tool you will need for handlaying track and turnouts is a NMRA gauge. And they are not that cheap, so to buy one for a few test turnouts might be a needless expense for tight hobby dollars. You will struggle with the first few turnouts, but they do get better. I would get yourself the N scale gauge and do some test N scale turnouts. If you have trouble doing the N scale turnout, then maybe try an HO to see if you can find out what your doing wrong.
Thanks again guys While I think that the HO route might be a good idea, there are the costs to be looked at as highlighted by Coaltrain. I have a couple of sets of gauges coming from raliwayeng.com (code 40 and 55 N-scale) that will be used in conjunction with the NMRA N scale gauge. I plan to build a test track on the bench that will include mainline track, branchline track (tie spacing difference), turnouts and crossovers - basically everything I will encounter when building my layout. Whether any of this makes it onto the layout itself is another question but at least I will be able to make as many mistakes as I like without screwing up my real track. This is going to be a big adventure for me so I am looking forward to it!! Cheers Bruce
Me again! What do you guys use for turnout templates? I have the turnout calculator spreadsheet but was wondering if there are any downloadable templates out there. If not I will have to master entering the calculator dimensions into CAD.... Cheers Bruce
