I recently bought a Rivarossi Clinchfield Challenger at a hobby show. I would like to make it as accurate as possible. It already has the single smokestack. A friend told me that Clinchfield never used the centipede tender, and if they did, were the letters in white or yellow? If this model is very inacurate, then I may model the borrowed U.P. Challenger that was made up to a Clinchfield engine. Any suggestions are always appreciated.
First off, THANKS Chuck! I sure appreciate it... As to Steve's questions, The Clinchfield Challengers were dang close to the UP design as delivered to UP, being thats were Clinchfield got them. However Clinchfield had changed the stack from a double to a single. Thats correct. As for the centapede tender, THEY DID USE THEM! So thats accurate! As for the white to yellow or "Dulux Gold" lettering it was white! Rivarossi, in the early years went by black and white pictures, which lead them to think (they didn't know any better being Italian) that some roads had yellow lettering to some having white lettering. So this lead them to make B&O loco's and others to have white lettering.... BUT as time progressed and they had extended their research on building these loco's they had found their own mistakes and corrected them by the means of color pictures and by 1980 all their factory misprinted white lettering that was to be yellow was corrected! But being you have a Riv Challenger under Clinchfield livery, I know for a fact it has white lettering, if its old or if its new! They never made any misprinted Challengers that I'm aware of with the wrong color lettering... However I do know that they had a tendency to paint Big Boys all black, and I think even some UP Challengers by Rivarossi was made black from using pictures of loco's with heavy weathering in real life service and they didn't realize that the loco was just dirty and all from road ware and grime ect... As for differences in looks to the UP Challenger to the Clinchfield Challenger, Their wasn't to much different by the naked or uneducated eye. The biggest difference was the smoke box and stack. UP kept them as delivered by ALCO with double stacks, where Clinchfield had taken out the double stack and used a single stack. Thender were kept the same as the UP style "Centapede" and they also used white lettering. I'll look around for some Clinchfield Challenger pictures online and post the link for you to view for references to your Rivarossi model.... By the way, I'm John Patton that locomotive2 dirrected you too... [ 27 June 2002, 07:19: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]
I will agree that the six Clinchfield Challengers were originally a Union Pacific design. However the Clinchfield Challengers were originally Rio Grande #3800-3805. They were built by Alco in 1943, leased by the Rio Grande from the Defense Plant Corporation and sold to Clinchfield in 1947.
Thanks for the help. Since I model mostly east of the Mississippi, I was able to get a 4-6-6-4 wheel arrangement in an eastern line. The locomotive itself is an excellent runner. Clinchfield didn't have the smoke lifters (elephant ears) did they? Also was the smokebox and firebox black? I would be modeling a museum piece on my layout. This means a very clean prototype. What I need now is to find a line where Big Boys operated east of the Mississippi. Don't think Im in much luck there. BTW- a book I found said that Big Boy 4012 at Steamtown is closest to operational condition of the eight saved. Is this true?
It may be possible that it is more near a resto project than others, but there was a project to restore the one in Dallas and a lot of money sent in for this project which never came to light. The great majority of the money was never recouped and A LOT of people were pissed to say the least. The fact of the matter is, we will more than likely never see a Big Boy run in our lifetimes. I really don't think U.P. is going to let something that big run on their rails, and there are only one or maybe two places to turn one of those Big Boys. It just one of those things we'll only dream about. Jeff
Steve, No the Clinchfield Challengers didn't have Elephant Ears, nor Graphite on their smoke box that I can relate to. I'm still looking for information, and pictures to post to help in aid to your modeling project... On the UP Big Boys, and on the eatern side of the Mississippi I think your out of real estate!
John Have you seen the UP Big Boy Film Collection of the 25 Big Boys, #4000 thru 4024. It's a collection of 35mm film of the big boys in action from Wasatch Mountains, Sherman Hill and in Cheyenne Wyoming. Pentrex transferred it onto Video. Time frames, 1943 thru 1959,Color-Black & White with stero sound and Narration.
No Chuck I haven't! I haven't got into alot of train movies yet. I'm still hunting down leaflet books and actual books themselves... I do plan to get into the movies tho, once I've got all the information on paper first and all.. I'm building a railroad related Library as of now, although I got plenty of the books on the B&O, I still have many to go for the steam age.. and then I'm going to get into a library of video's
Good morning John. Its taken me 24 hours to get connected to train board to respond. You have been started in steam videos. Mailed you via 4th class one Big Boy Collection. For all you do, it's on the house. You have hands on experience & knowledge of steam locos and thanks for sharing that wisdom with modelers.
This ummm loading issue with trainboard seems to be a problem! For everyone but myself. I have no trouble loading TB... HMMMM Anyway Chuck, THANKS! I'll be looking for them in the mail!
Chuck, Got the video in the mail today, watched it about half way through and i'm thrilled! Gotta love those articulateds! And all Big Boys to boot with alittle Challenger footage! THANKS! I guess I have another library to begin building! I started a book library back in the late 1980's like 87' through 89', and I'm still building that. And then in 1995 or 96' I began a photoachive, that I'm again still building, and now in 2002, I've began the video library.... This is getting more and more fun by the second! And I'm lovin' every minute! THANKS again Chuck...
John, Go to www.pentrex.com and sign up for their catalog. They are a major player, lots of shots from a chopper and top quality. Also do lots of steam excursions. They will be on location in August at the NRHS convention. Santa Fe 3751 will be the star player on a run from LA to Williams AZ, and then from Williams to the Grand Canyon. Pentrex crews will cover the entire trip. I will buy this video. Once you get serious on selections, I can pre-screen for you since I have about 30 of their releases.
Chuck, I'm going to see whats all listen in their site... alot of B&O stuff for as always and anyother interesting movie that i see in the days of steam!
Chuck, THANKS once again!!! I got another video in the mail. watched it through. I LOVE the B&O.. you picked a good one to record and send me. Now to get B&O's Odssey 2!! To add to the first volume! THANKS a bunch man!!!!!! [ 15 July 2002, 02:07: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]
