The way that only six locomotives ended up in three different paint schemes in one year runs something like this.... Built in red and silver.... Pulled off passenger service in 1968 - put on the Super C for a bit (particularly lead unit duty) in red and silver... 1969-1970 renumbered from 400-405 to 8000-8005 Amtrak 1971 - two repainted into the blue pinstripe (8000 and 8004) 4 never got it. June 1972 - yellowbonnet introduced - (with black trucks) and several got it early-on 1972-1973 - all six get repainted into yellowbonnet, by 1973 all six had it '???? silver truck added as with all yellowbonnets Ref: "Diesel Era" March 2002
Interesting history to this plastic model. I have done some research and I am sure the H0 scale model I saw was a U30CG. The owner just didn't know better. And it was a brass model. I hope I get to see it again so I can look more closely this time.
Yeah, its a brass model... I think I remember either Oriental or Hallmark. Extremely well done. While a lot of modelers do ATSF in the late period (up to the 1996 BNSF merger) when red and silver was "Superfleet" you have to remember that post-Amtrak in 1971, ATSF was hell-bent in obliterating that paint scheme and everything to do with their name in passenger service. The 1972 scheme was defintely part of that - wipe out the past or at least distance yourself from it. Kill the "Ship and travel" logo, "Route of the ______". Move on. Somebody at the top gave the order to agressively do it. ATSF also had real trouble with Amtrak's version of "service" using the Super Chief name and just didn't want to be associated with it - which is where the "Southwest Limited" came from on their insistence. In '72 there were only THREE bonafide surviviors of non-lease F-units still in red and silver that I've proven were out there - U30CG 8002, and FP45 5942 and 5944. That's it. And I've modelled all three. That and Amtrak leasers in the 300-class of the F's, that rapidly fell in '73 as the SDP40-F's came along as replacements. That's why the "Super Fleet" scheme was so cool after ATSF worked so hard to obliterate the red and silver colors to ancient history - it just wouldn't die. But these three survivors that evaded the paint booth for another year...wow, were they dirty! The 'degrading' of the assignments was dramatic...from getting yanked from passenger service after the derailment, then getting the Super C only to be bumped by SD45's, F45's, and the SD45-2's as they were delivered. Then getting regeared and steam generators pulled, but still lead on the Barstow-Argentine pool service (and I've seen several shots in freight at Flagstaff), finally getting bumped off that by about 1975 to end up as Kansas-Colorado pool (stay close to Argentine). Toward the end they 'appear' to have been given trailing-unit status only and had become truly unloved. I suspect that was because they didn't have AC and also had side ladders rather than steps. Shots of that era also show that the paint was coming off (with the red underneath), oil leaks, soot stains... they got traded for B36-7's in 1980. There's one great published shot of 8001 at Flagstaff in 1980 in lead, and it looks like it was freshly painted, too... so like everything else ATSF, there's always that oddball unit that didn't get word!
Excellent result, well worth the effort. My main complaint with the original Minitrix models is, and always has been, the awful scratching sound. Thus, the version with a Kato body and motor has a high appeal to me. I don't see a need for changing the shell in my case, though adding those cab ladders would be nice. Could you provide a link for them, please? I had already done the coupler conversion years ago. Thus, it would look like a less time consuming conversion. But I still have some questions. So, are there no Kato models with the correct size of the fuel tank? How did you fix the shell? Or can it simply be clipped to the Kato frame after the adjustment mentioned in post #16?
I have a minitrix U30CG that runs well with Kato's first production of the C-30-7. They pull my work train and do a good job of it. I've thought of doing the same thing that Randqust did. You can't go wrong with a Kato, chassis/mechanism. Some nice work displayed here.
I'm using Gold Medal Models 160-48 stainless steel stirrups: http://www.goldmm.com/nscale/gmnlotyp.htm They are available from a lot of dealers. Highly recommended for any unit with side doors. On my FP45's and F45's I could get the steps on the shell without messing up the truck swing clearances. On the U30CG I could do the front but not the rear, and I have some 11" curves on hidden track, so there's no easy way out. It's just in the wrong spot. But even having them on the front ladders helps.
Thanks randgust, very helpful indeed! As I live in Switzerland, I might have to place an order rather than finding them locally.
Thanks to Randgust's inspiration, I am also now halfway through placing a upgraded Minitrix U30CG shell on a Kato U30C mechanism. Will post pics if/when I get time. To answer some questions that may be of interest to anyone wishing to do this: 1) I believe the correct prototype wheelbase for the U30CG's is the same as the U30C. However, the Minitrix shell / mechanism / wheelbase is shorter (i.e. slightly compressed) compared to the prototype. If one searches for photos for the HO brass U30CGs or proto photos, and compare with the Minitrix shell, you'll notice the slight difference (but only if you know to look for it). Here's a link to Swiss brass dealer, showing the Overland Santa Fe U30CGs: http://www.trainmaster.ch/X-952.htm 2) However, even though the Minitrix shell is shorter than it should be, it is close enough and to my eye, looks good enough (i.e. how many people know *exactly* what a U30CG really looks like?!). More importantly, this shell is long enough to fit on a Kato U30C or C30-7 mechanism with some minor selective grinding on the ends of the Kato mechanism, inside of the Minitrix shell at the ends and a bit on the inside mounting tabs, inside of the Minitrix shell's front/rear pilots, and outer ends of the Kato trucks. Also, a heavy wire-cutter did the trick in doing a required angle cut on the protruding ends of the Kato mechanism (see Randgust's mechanism picture). 3) The paint is actually kind of OK, with the exceptions: a) "Santa Fe" is way too big (remove the orig with 91% isoprophyl alchohol on Qtip, then brushpaint Polyscale Silver acrylic, and apply the smaller correct "Santa Fe" from Micro-Scale 60-188 decal set - easy fix for that) b) Both the black and the yellow stripes ares way too fat... too wide to just put 60-188 decal over it. Also, the Minitrix "Santa Fe" yellow herald on the nose is too small.... and that stock decal doesn't easily come off by itself. Short of repainting, I'm working on some sort of easy solutions to these. c) The color of the Minitrix red is pretty good... but it is a different shade than Polyscale ATSF Red. I would appreciate knowing of any of you have found a real close match to the Minitrix red from any other readily available model paint. 4) The yellow plastic front and rear handrails are horrible. Best fix is to remove those and do wire handrails.... but remember that if you wish to repaint, do the handrails *after* you repaint (you won't be able to spray or easily brushpaint the nose or rear end if the handrails are already on). In meantime, painting the handrails with yellow Pactra RC Car enamel at least kills the original handrail ugly plastic shine. Remember to paint red across the horizontal anticlimber (I used Polyscale ATSF Red, which is close enough for that particular little job. 5) The windows are a gray plastic insert. Just (carefully) paint those black (or in my case, B&O Royal Blue, as that is a radio-control car trick to put 'a little bit of sky color' into a dark window). 6) The Santa Fe U28CGs and U30CGs did have full length water/fuel tanks, so as Randgust showed, some styrene grafting / putty on the stock Kato U30C fuel tank ends can fix that. 7) As far as body mounting couplers, I am thinking to use a spare Micro-Trains #1161 U30C coupler conversion kit, cut that down to fit and mount in the body using glue/ACC. If anyone's already done that, I would appreciate any hints/experiences. If/when I get some time to take a few pics, I'll post them here. Thx Randgust for inspiring all of us and letting us know it's possible.
John, if it makes you feel any better.... I never used an airbrush. Everything you see was brush-painted. Some paint - and Testors in particular - has enough enamel in it to settle out well. The final coat of dullcote puts a finish on it. So I ended up painting over the black and yellow (rather roughly, actually) with the Testors Steel, and relying on the Microscale stripes to clean up the mess in the end on the red/yellow separation. I even brush-painted the Chevy Engine Red in my case and just followed the original Trix outline, which was surprisingly close to the curve on the Microscale decals curve. I think the paint faded/shifted pretty quickly on these. The original Trix nose herald decal came right off with alcohol. It's pretty bad. My favorite coupler for this application is to take the boxes off of MT passenger car trucks - that's as short a coupler box as you'll ever see. Build up a pad of styrene for it and just glue it in the pilot. I really ought to get this thing back out and weather it to the filthy mess it was in '72. I think I find these units so interesting because they made the 'penthouse to outhouse' transistion so rapidly - maybe they stuck around longer than FM #90, but it's still obvious that ATSF rather hated them - no rebuild for you!
Here's my work so far, inspired by Randgust, to put a N scale Minitrix U30CG shell on Kato U30C mechanism, and to then update the shell's paint, handrails. Work in progress. I have got the body to fit on the shell, ground down the front of the trucks, ground out required areas inside the shell especially on the ends, painted over the too big original "Santa Fe" with the Polyscale Silver, put Micro-Scale 60-188 "Santa Fe" on, have started to paint over the too-big black and yellow stripes, Pactra RC enamel yellow on the ugly too-big handrails: Other than the things listed above, this is still the stock Minitrix paint. More to come, to fix the fuel tanks, more work with decals for the striping, body mount couplers, remove too-small nose herald and re-decal, and more. Thx again, Randgust, for the many tips. Happy Holidays, all!
Small update: acrylic Polyscale Caboose Red appears to be be a spot-on match for the shade of red on my Minitrix U30CG's warbonnet. Gives me confidence that I will try removing the too-small nose decal with 91% isoprophy alcohol, and be able to touch up any differences. Will let everyone know how that turns out. Other colors of red that I've tried are not close enough, one can clearly see the (slight but noticeable) color difference of the two following paints compared to the Minitrix warbonnet red: => Polyscale ATSF Red is darker in shade of red, and a tinge more purple-ish => Polyscale Soo Line Red is darker in shade of red (of course, one's results may vary, but I trust this helps).
Quick update (sorry, no pics yet, no time....) Body-mount couplers figured out and applied. Used a MT 1161 U30C conversion kit adapter as starting place (just because I didn't have the right styrene pieces around). Randgust suggested I use the coupler+box off MT passenger car trucks, that's super idea, as the amount of space avail is really small, and as Randgust suggested, those coupler boxes do fit, the MT 1015s would have stuck out way too far. Found out how not to super glue on the first time on the rear (coupler glued shut - bad - knocks the passenger cars off the track on curves), 2nd one (front end) done better and works/tracks well with the passenger cars. I'll take pics when I get a chance (after Xmas)... I'm going to do a 2nd U30CG with pics, so that I can document what worked, as well as apply lessons learned from this one still in process. Removed the ugly small front Santa Fe herald with 91% alcohol, touched up nose paint with brushed-on Polyscale Caboose Red. Next is apply the proper nose decal from Micro-Scale 60-188. Then do decal stripes. Finally after that, wire handrails. Happy Holidays.
Gosh, I've done it again. A day late and dollar short. That's what I get for operating a churches sounds system. Good to see John Sing, chiming in here. I'm enjoying the input. I'm with Randqust on this one. I do have a later U30CG that operates with a early Kato SD 40, long porch. Don't ask me why but they both pull well together on analog DC and are in charge of my M.O.W. aka work train. To answer your original question about what to pay. When it comes to the early types of locomotives...they aren't worth the original retail and certainly not the cost of a bidding war... May I suggest, $20.00 is perhaps tooooooo much. My two cents.
Got 2 pics to share: The Polyscale Caboose Red is surprisingly close. You can barely tell the difference where I brush-painted the front of the nose. After weathering, doubt I'll be able to see the difference. We'll see how this all turns out, definitely work in progress, great learning experience. Really want to thank Randgust for showing the way, letting me/us all know it's possible. After I finish this one, I'm going to do a 2nd U30CG, applying lessons learned the first time, and document it with pics. Next time around, I'll build up a coupler box pad using styrene... the MT 1161 U30C coupler conversion adapter is pretty pricey. Maybe with the next one, if it works out I might try using the new U30C/C30-7 DCC-ready Kato mechanism, just to see if it fits same way as this older original Kato U30C mechanism, and do a decoderized version . Probably no further work till after Xmas? By the way, anybody want buy a perfect condition Kato U30C Delaware & Hudson shell (Kato 176-175)? It has the Micro-Trains 1161 body-mount coupler adapter already installed, is road number #711. Let me know off-list. Happy Holidays.
Nice locos John and Gus!!! I've got to get mine out and finish it, I'm doing the Blue & yellow freight scheme.
OK, two more pics, decaled the nose, using Micro-Scale 60-188 decal, after applying the decal, MicroScale Micro Sol settled the decal down nicely over the Minitrix nose details. While the decal was still Micro-Sol soft, I *very carefully* poked hole in the decal for the two headlight holes: Huge improvement compared to the stock Minitrix nose herald, and I'm really pleased with the color match of the Polyscale acrylic Caboose Red, as you can see from this pic previously posted in this thread: Work continues.
