To DCC or not to DCC

rkcarguy Feb 3, 2025

  1. rkcarguy

    rkcarguy TrainBoard Member

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    I'm sure this has been asked a ton of times I apologize.
    I'm planning a new layout and have a 30+ locomotive roster of Athearn blue box's in various stages of super-detail crated up from years ago.
    I watched a DCC conversion video and it looks fairly straight forward to install a DH126 decoder into one of these. But, that's ALOT of locomotives to convert. I do keep in mind that I run a lot of my loco's in consists typical of them pulling the steep passes so probably 2 powered units would suffice and I could pull the powertrains on some of the others. However, I'm seeing more and more problems with DCC, literally every train show I've been to in the past few years has had layouts down or on the fritz for DCC problems. Slow speed performance issues, speed matching when paired, do we have to shut down and restart everything when it doesn't work right?
    Then of course there is the extra functions which are great for realistic headlights, beacons, and such.
    So, I'm torn. I don't see DCC being something one eases into(envisioning any DC stuff left on the layout by accident taking off full tilt all at the same time lol). My kids and guests that want to operate are likely going to be non-DCC control people, i.e. will do fine on a MRC pack but will be lost with a DCC control. Thoughts?
     
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  2. in2tech

    in2tech TrainBoard Member

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    Sounds like you figured it out on your own, it's DC for you, and your guest and family members. Do they have to throw Block controls? Or you throw them for them and they run the trains? What size layout? I have a very tiny layout and it's ALL DCC now, but it took a long time, and is expensive. Others will know better then me, but most decoders are $30.00 - $50.00 and does not include sound, which I don't run or have. With the DC roster you have and you are used to it, DC makes more sense, you just have to have blocks, which you already know.

    Maybe for Christmas one year get, build, buy a DCC controller, and one DCC locomotive or install DCC in a recent/new locomotive. Don't like it, sell it!

    Main thing enjoy the hobby, and you are in control. It's your railroad, as we always say here :)

    Myself, I really, really like DCC, even on a tiny layout run multiple trains, one on the inside track, one on the outside, one in the spur or yard, with one controller and NO blocks, if that is what they are still called. It's awesome :) Run each locomotive at different speeds, turn the lights on and off each one, etc... Took me a long time to get the few items I have for DCC, including a good DCC controller, but that's just me.

    Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
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  3. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    One system to think about that can do DC and DCC at the same time is DCC-EX. You can put it together in an hour for around $75 or buy a plug and play DCC-EX command station for under $150 and be running a train in a few minutes (no assembly).

    A huge plus for you is that it has two track outputs expandable to 4 (another $50) and those outputs can be connected to 2 to 4 blocks (the DIY version can have 8 blocks). You can run a DC or DCC loco in any block at any time. You could run all of the blocks as DC right now and run the locos with a phone throttle or a wifi commercial throttle like a TCS-UWT-50 or 100.

    If you buy or convert at DC loco to DCC you can run it in a block that has been switched to DCC with your throttle and with the same throttle be running a DC loco in another block that was turned to DC with the same throttle.

    If the above is as clear as mud ask some questions.

    ....and yes even wired vs. drop-in decoder installs aren't all that hard....

    https://1fatgmc.com/RailRoad/Decoder-1/Decoders-Index.html

    Sumner
     
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  4. MichaelClyde

    MichaelClyde TrainBoard Member

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    Is there a decoder site that lists compatibility? I have two older "DCC Ready" Walthers Mainline "EMD SD70ACe" HO locos but unsure what would work best.

    (ps: found this on fleabay: "TCS 1790 WDK-WAL-3 Complete Sound Conversion Kit : Walthers Mainline SD70ACe HO")

    Opinions? Walthers shows ESU "Out of Stock Availability: Discontinued" but FOUND 2 at "tonystrains"?
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
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  5. Hoss

    Hoss TrainBoard Member

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    @Sumner introduced me to DCC-EX and that's the way I plan to go on the layout I'm about to build, but I'm starting from scratch. If I were in your shoes I'd probably be torn as well. Depending on your locos, converting to DCC could be really easy or it could be a lot of work. If drop in decoders are available for your locos it would be pretty easy, I think. Not cheap though.
     
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  6. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Shane some are not that bad or expensive. I have bought almost all non-DCC equipped locos in the $30-$70 range used (some more rare ones were more). I've converted a lot with $16 decoders (now $19). They of course aren't sound but run an engine and control the head and rear lights just fine. Once I've done a few I can do it in less than an hour in most locos. Drop-in non sound are in the $30-$40 range for a decent decoder.

    Sound can be a different story. The price is about $100-$110 for a very good ESU sound decoder, about what the difference is to buy a loco with sound vs. no sound. The install can get more complicated with sound. The decoders are a little larger and then you have to find space for the speaker. Some newer locos have that space as the model was designed for sound or no sound.

    But older locos can require creating that space which involves more work. I have two mills but rarely use them for that as a Dremel type tool can work fine along with some saw and file work.

    HO with much more room than N are going to be quite a bit easier to do non-drop-in decoder installs.

    Sumner
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
  7. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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  8. MichaelClyde

    MichaelClyde TrainBoard Member

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    Sumner Thanks!

    If my Mainline shows "DCC Ready" do I need the TCS 1790 WDK-WAL-3 motherboard or just the TCS EU821 8 Function HO Plug-and-Play Decoder? Or is it the TCS motherboard enables sound?

    Sorry ALL CONFUSING! (I also see: TCS 1527 WOW121 Diesel Sound Decoder)

    Am READING your install link so, in other words, would you recommend all 3? The keep-alive motherboard, the decoder and sound (if desired)?
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
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  9. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Wish I could help with that but know nothing about those products. Maybe check with TCS and/or Walthers?

    Sumner
     
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  10. rkcarguy

    rkcarguy TrainBoard Member

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    The Athearn BB's seem to have plenty of room for a digitrax, the 2 switchers may be a squeeze won't know unless I get a decoder and try.
    I'm going to block the layout for a signal system anyway, so it won't be until I'm getting ready to wire everything that I'll need to decide. None of mine are DCC ready, some of them like my SD9 and SW1200 are from the 80's.
    I was not looking at sounds, just the basic operations and lights, yellow strobe would be nice on a few....
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
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  11. rkcarguy

    rkcarguy TrainBoard Member

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    This was the video I found on the Athearn BB DCC conversion. I've already done the lighting portion and number boards on most of mine to get rid of the "fire in the cab" look.
     
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  12. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Lot of room in those, I'm jealous ;). Most basic, cheapest decoders have two function outputs for forward and rear light. If you don't run one of those then it could be setup for a different light. Usually though for a few dollars more you can find a decoder with 3 to 5 or more total functions for lights or something else (not sound). The main thing to look for is the amp output rating good for the scale you are running.

    Sumner
     
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  13. rkcarguy

    rkcarguy TrainBoard Member

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    Probably my most busy locomotives would be my SP's with the mars lights, also have a pair of -9's with ditch lights. A lot of the espee photos on these units show that lights were not directional, so wouldn't feel bad if they were all on one function. For mars light or strobe, does the decoder make the blinking happen or does each unit need a flasher unit?
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2025
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  14. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Generally the decoder will do that and when you look at decoders they should give some idea of what light functions they can do.

    You are going to have to program the decoder though so it knows what to do. Forward and rear lights are usually an exception to that and usually come programed. The easiest way to program is with DecoderPro a subset of JMRI (runs on a computer). It can be confusing at first but you soon get the hang of it.

    Sumner
     
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  15. rkcarguy

    rkcarguy TrainBoard Member

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    Good to know thanks! One less piece to squeeze under the cover.
     
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  16. MichaelClyde

    MichaelClyde TrainBoard Member

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    Ahhh I finally bit the DCC bullet!
    Sumner upon following your link(s) and "Testing NMRA-Compatible 8-Pin Connector(s)" on my 2 so called "DCC Ready" Walthers Mainline locos - which were bought "second-hand" - they FAILED to pass thus have given up short of totally replacing the motherboards as well?

    The install tutorial shows a different original motherboard (DC only?) than what I currently have my solder skills not being the greatest.

    For the price & effort of a TCS WDK-WAL-3 kit I purchased this instead! (Equipped with ESU Sound
    [​IMG]

    Thanks for using PayPal Credit for
    your purchase on Feb 04, 2025.

    With this purchase, you'll enjoy
    No Interest if paid in full in 6 months.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2025
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  17. MichaelClyde

    MichaelClyde TrainBoard Member

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    Found an excellent YT channel (@driverdtrains) demonstrating MEGA board assembly, programming and optional LCD 4X20 display for creating custom messaging. I suspect more information is forthcoming. Been following Sumner's posts understand that dcc-ex can do automation, signals and lighting as well?

    Still in the theoretical phase deliveries yet to arrive!



    (OMG have I mentioned the 4-lane AFX racing car track that my HO train layout encircles as well?)
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2025 at 2:00 AM

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