The GS-4 Daylight Face-off... ConCor vrs Kato

Calzephyr Feb 18, 2008

  1. spnscaler

    spnscaler New Member

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    they may look like they mean business but...

    I'm still waiting for my Kato, but I went and measured my CC rods. As far as I can tell with my old eyes and scale ruler they measure about 6 inches. Not sure but I would guess that that is pretty close to proto type. I'm going to check and see if any one on the SP group knows that actual size of these rods. Judging from the photo, the Kato one's seem to be at least twice the size of the CC.

    Peter Schumann modeling SP and UP during the transition area.



     
  2. Lownen

    Lownen TrainBoard Member

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    Anyone know when the second road number GS4 is due?
     
  3. spnscaler

    spnscaler New Member

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    I understand that there is some delay since Kato is addressing the the problem of shorts when trying the plug and play decoder. The Kato web site talks about April/May so I'm guessing and May early June.

    Peter Schumann
     
  4. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    spnscaler;

    Welcome to TrainBoard!

    Boxcab E50
     
  5. HansCampbell

    HansCampbell Permanently dispatched

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    Kato did forget one thing, they forgot to paint the white-walls on the drivers. At least Con-Cor did get that right. I live near Portland, Oregon where the real locomotive is kept. So I have seen the real locomotive up close. I have even driven it. It is a very powerful engine. I have friends that are engineers, so they sometimes let me take the throttle. The passenger cars that go with this steam locomotive are very nice.
     
  6. HansCampbell

    HansCampbell Permanently dispatched

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    Yes, but the first issue will be worth a lot more money because not many of them were produced. I bought 10 of them so far. When the "fixed" version is released I plan to buy 1 of those.
     
  7. Westfalen

    Westfalen TrainBoard Member

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    You bought 10 GS4's just for their resale value as collectables? If that's you thing then go for it, we all enjoy the hobby in different ways, I don't see your logic in your valuation though. There is not a shred of difference between the 'fixed' and 'unfixed' versions except for plastic inserts behind the drivers, I have one of each and 'fixed' the 'unfixed' one with inserts I obtained from Kato.

    I can take the inserts out of my factory fixed engine and hey presto, a first run unfixed version.:tb-biggrin:
     
  8. Willyboy

    Willyboy TrainBoard Supporter

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    Could you post a prototype photo of #4449 with the white-walls? On Railpictures.net I could not see the white-walls in any of the photos. Also, I just watch a video of #4449 on Trainorders taken this past December 14th and could not see the white-walls.
    Thanks
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2008
  9. Flash Blackman

    Flash Blackman TrainBoard Member

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    Bump

    Bumping up to the current thread for other comments. Did we ever get a photo of the "white walls?"
     
  10. YoHo

    YoHo TrainBoard Supporter

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    Doyle McCormack repaints the thing from time to time. Partially so he can tell at a glance when a given photo was taken. Location of the number boards, paint scheme (as delivered versus billboard letters) White walls and little white stars are all details that have changed over the years since he's had it.

    Right now, she does not have white walls, the number boards are by the stack, she does have white stars and she's in as delivered paint. With Southern Pacific Lines on the tender. Also, top light is Gyra Bottom is constant (Don't know more specifically which models). This has also changed over the years.

    So in other words, Concor and Kato can be said to have modeled different incarnations of the 4449.
     
  11. FloridaBoy

    FloridaBoy TrainBoard Member

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    I have owned both and currently own a Kato GS4, aka dog piece of #@$#@$#@. Look, I am in N scale for 30 years and was a boxer in Kato's corner until this fragile, poorly running piece of #@$#@$# came out.

    When I owned the ConCor, it ran quietly, beautifully, and looked like a King of my Rails, even though I have a PRR pike. I love the Daylight that much. But finances were stringent, and I was coerced into selling my ConCor unit, actually for more than I paid, and regretted it. To me ConCor's recent steam their decapods and Northerns have been the most underappreciated models made in recent years. Everything I bought, although pre-tested, ran and pulled marvelously.

    Now I salivate over looking at the Kato loco and its passenger set at the LHS. So, now I am making a very decent living wage, and I purchase a Kato by default, with the false sense of confidence of hundreds of locos I own of theirs purchased over the years. It didn't even last out of the box, as the tender came apart and two missing contact pieces fell off, and since the loco picks up its juice from the tender only, it didn't run. Kato sends the parts, I repair it, and it lasts two revolutions and blows a traction tire, then Kato says to repair it myself. Thanks a bunch. I send it to Kato $45 and 6 weeks later I get it back, and I have a fatalistic view of it now, I plan to run it until it breaks again, then demote it to shelf queen. Thanks a bunch again, Kato. I am now owner of a $250+ shelf queen. Long live ConCor. I sure hope they reissue their GS4, Northerns, and Decapods. True works of art.

    AIN"T NO COMPARISON BETWEEN THE TWO.

    Ken "FloridaBoy" Willaman
     
  12. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

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    I had the exact opposite experience. My Con Cor waddled like a duck. The frame was milled incorrectly and the bearing blocks did not sit level so it leaned to one side. The details on the boiler, like some of the tiny add on valves, were very fragile and kept breaking off. I sold it a while back. My Kato has not given me a bit of problems and has many hours of NTRAK running. Just goes to show, you can get a lemon in any brand. That said, I think the Kato is a little over engineered and not as simple as the old S-2 northerns that they built for Con Cor. Those are still my favorite steam locomotives.
     
  13. fatalxsunrider43

    fatalxsunrider43 TrainBoard Member

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    Just the White walls on the ConCor are enough to make me stay away.
    The all black Drivers on the Kato look so much better. If the Concor
    was minus the White Walls, I might be tempted. Trivial but true.

    fatalxsunrider43
     
  14. JoeS

    JoeS TrainBoard Member

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    I never owned a ConCor...that said, I've owed quite a few N scale steammers from old Bachman junk, Life like mallats and berks, kato mikados, bachamn spectrums consolidations and mountains, model power moguls and americans...by far the kato GS4 is the best looking sweetest running N steammer I have. To those with bad luck I feel bad because mine is truely a treat to run and view.
     
  15. DCESharkman

    DCESharkman TrainBoard Member

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    Ordered a ConCor via Internet, arrived dead as a doornail.

    Ordered Kato's, all 4 numbers. Each one locked up when put in reverse, and will not run at all now.

    I will stay with the Mikados, never had a bad one of them.
     
  16. Calzephyr

    Calzephyr TrainBoard Supporter

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    Whew... that's terrible news on both counts... but really damning for Kato. One can understand an occasional 'lemon'... but all four Kato failures is a whole lemon grove.

    I have two numbers of the Kato GS4 and one of the ConCor GS4. They don't get much time on the track as it is and now I'm reluctant to even pull them out again to run them. I will say that the Kato units performed better than the ConCor unit in the limited times they were run. The ConCor one stalled frequently... the Kato ones didn't have stalling issues. I feel the three models look nice... but... good looks and poor performance is not a receipe for success in this business.

    Sadly... this type of news doesn't bode well for future releases by Kato. Many had hoped that the GS4 would be the precursor for more 'Kato quality' steamers in the future. I for one thought their next passenger consist might be an NYC 20th Century Limited with a Dreyfus Hudson. If they're not getting the GS4 right... a new Hudson class could continue to disappoint modelers with high expectations from Kato.

    BTW... sorry to hear about the problems you've had with the Kato products. I'm a staunch supporter of Kato products and this news is quite sobering... Kato has always been held as the model railroad industry's measure of a successful manufacturer (at least in N scale).
     

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