Moose Running Trains...

Moose2013 Apr 13, 2021

  1. Moose2013

    Moose2013 TrainBoard Member

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    Moose now have a new way to run trains, errr, well, locomotives any way...

    Received a DCC Concepts roller test stand set today. Tried it out, ever so briefly (dinner interruptus!), using a BLI PRR T1. Steam baby! [​IMG]

    1_DCCConceptsTestStand_20210515_153255.jpg 2_DCCConceptsTestStand_20210515_153425.jpg

    Note: Originally tried the stands on a straight section of the MT&P layout. However, the layout uses Atlas Code 55 track and as it turns out, the test stands need more vertical distance between the track ties and track rails. Thus, using Kato Code 80 Unitrack.
     
    fordy744, sidney, JMaurer1 and 11 others like this.
  2. eposte12

    eposte12 TrainBoard Supporter

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    that's way cool
     
    Moose2013 likes this.
  3. badlandnp

    badlandnp TrainBoard Member

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    Oooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!1 Now that could be a dangerous new toy! Just sit and listen to all the different sounds and watch the mesmerizing wheels and rod action.............

    This could be a very useful way to program the locos without them going anywhere, and do break in time. Hmmmmmm.
     
    Doug Gosha and Moose2013 like this.
  4. Moose2013

    Moose2013 TrainBoard Member

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    That's what Moose was tinkin' ... Still need to test this on locomotives with smaller drivers that are closer together.
    o_O
     
    badlandnp likes this.
  5. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    Very nice!

    I purchased a Yamix N scale treadmill on Amazon, and it is very well made too. It does not sit upon track for support or power, but requires a separate connection to DCC/DC. I can see the advantage of the DCC Concepts Rolling Road for those that are extremely limited in space, but have a stretch on their layout that can support a Rolling Road (assuming their trackage is not code 55).

    I've also wondered about the difference between breaking in a steamer on a treadmill, vs real track. The track (and the loco's movement over it) tie the axle rotations together, which is not the case for a treadmill with individual rollers. And then there are the burrs on the corners of the worm/wheel gear teeth that may not be broken in on a completely straight track, but need curves (ideally a figure 8 with equal curves in both directions) to break in, not to mention the physical load of dragging the locomotive itself (if not also a few cars behind it) around the track.

    I'm looking forward to using the treadmill as a programming track, since my favored TCS drop in decoders do not alternate motor direction for the current pulse responses on the programming track, and can circle the dining room table loop when reading back the decoder contents into Decoder Pro. However, speed matching locomotives cannot be performed on a treadmill...
     
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  6. ggnlars

    ggnlars TrainBoard Member

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    To me the tread mill is for initial running. Say after an upgrade or simple lubrication. For my test work, I like to run the unit for 30 minutes or so before actually running the test. That way everything is warmed up & the oil or grease that may have sagged due the gravity has been redistributed.
    I guess you guy’s are programming on the main. When I modify the CV’s on the programming track, the engine does not move, so the rollers are not necessary.
    The rollers allow me to have a unit warming up in one place while I am testing a different engine in the main test track. A real time saver.
     
    Doug Gosha likes this.
  7. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    Larry,

    Some decoders may generate the acknowledgement response current to service-mode programming commands without running the motor, and some do it by alternating directions on the motor, so the net movement from multiple command responses remains small. Others pulse the motor in the same direction after every service mode command, which slowly marches the loco down the track.

    Programming-on-the-main (operations-mode) programming commands do not elicit a response from the decoder (it would be masked by any other locomotives running anyway); there is no feedback confirming those commands.

    Some command stations do not have separate main- and programming-track outputs, and all commands, whether service- or operating-mode, go to whatever track is connected to the CS outputs.
     
  8. JMaurer1

    JMaurer1 TrainBoard Member

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    Add a moving screen for a background and you can pace the train for hours and not worry about traffic or other cars being in the way and Moose won't need to take a step.
     
    badlandnp, MK, Kurt Moose and 2 others like this.
  9. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    Bonus points if you generate a background video loop (with smoke,) in sync and speed matched, including reverse, with the locomotive, displayed on a monitor behind the locomotive...

    I see a new feature for JMRI, to go along with Virtual Sound Decoders: Virtual Scenery!
     
  10. Moose2013

    Moose2013 TrainBoard Member

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    Moose ran the aforementioned T1 on the new test stands, forwards & reverse, at moderately high and low speeds, and all went flawlessly ... Unfortunately, T1 no wanna traverse layout. Stutters and stops. Push with hoof. Stutters and stops. Push with hoof. Stutters and stops. Moose did mild cleaning of track before running, and still, T1 no play... Moose first to admit track not perfectly clean, but this is ridiculous.

    Moose no could get T1 to even traverse 1/4 of the layout without a giant helping hoof. This, after running several other BLI 2-8-2 steam locomotives around the layout with comparatively minimal or no help from giant hoof!

    Moose off to ponder how this is possible ... Maybe a martini will help?
    :confused:
     
  11. Mike C

    Mike C TrainBoard Member

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    You will probably end up taking the loco apart and cleaning all of the contact points . Also check that the pick up wires are making contact where they are supposed to .....Mike
     
  12. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    The test stand allows the wheels to rotate independently, vs the track does not. Perhaps the quartering on the drivers is not quite right.

    On the test stand, did the centers of the driver wheels stay steady, or did they wobble around (up/fore/down/aft)? Sometimes they can wobble enough to make the whole locomotive wobble side to side and/or up and down. That is also a sign that the driver quartering is not quite right.
     
  13. JMaurer1

    JMaurer1 TrainBoard Member

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    Martini's ALWAYS help...and so do Brite Boys.
     
    Moose2013 likes this.
  14. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    Just to confirm, you DRINK the Martini, and the Brite Boy is for the track!
     
    Kurt Moose likes this.
  15. sidney

    sidney TrainBoard Member

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    so one moose martini coming up or is it moosetini :ROFLMAO::D
     
  16. Moose2013

    Moose2013 TrainBoard Member

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    Finally had time to revisit the BLI T1 ... Thoroughly cleaned the wheels, a long strip of the layout track and the Kato test track. Stutters and stops on either track. Placed locomotive back on roller test stands, and ... stutters and stops. Whaaa?!
    :confused:

    Moved the test stands around to see if there was any change in the locomotives behavior, dependent upon which wheels have electrical contact to the rollers/track, as well as removing the stands under one to two drivers, fore then aft. No significant changes. Arrrg!
    :mad:

    Time for a martini, at 11:00 am... :unsure:
     
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  17. sd90ns

    sd90ns TrainBoard Member

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    Is this locomotive DCC or DCC ready?
    If so, then the motor probably gets its current via two tabs on the motor making contact with two pads on a PC Board.
    Bad contact/s between these points can cause all sorts of funky problems.
     
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  18. Moose2013

    Moose2013 TrainBoard Member

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    It's DCC Sound. Yeah, Moose will have to place this locomotive in the "Repair" box for a tear-down "some day", to find out exactly what are its issues...
     
  19. ggnlars

    ggnlars TrainBoard Member

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    Here’s the problem, you ran the engine on the rollers go a period. Say an hour. Then you took it off the rollers & put it on the track & from that moment on it stalled & stuttered. On the track, was it loco only, no external load? What power setting are you trying to run on the track? Is the track level?
    Usually the rollers degrade the engine performance slightly. There is potentially a voltage loss on the rollers with the number of soft contact points has increased. When you go back to the rollers the problem is still there. It has to be involved with the first move. I would guess that the contacts between the tender & the engine was changed in some way. I would chase this down now, so everything is fresh in your mind. These things can be frustrating. Once the problem is clarified it is obvious. Right now you can’t see “the forest for the trees”.
    Good luck with it.
     
    Moose2013 likes this.
  20. JMaurer1

    JMaurer1 TrainBoard Member

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    If that is the order you prefer, then sure!
     

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