American Z Line Issue with Amtrak Lightweight Passenger Cars

drken Apr 14, 2022

  1. drken

    drken TrainBoard Member

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    I've been test running all my locos and cars in anticipation of making a new layout and I've been having issues with AZLs Amtrak Lightweight cars (Amfleet II) derailing trying to go through 220mm curves. Actually, I've had that issue with all of AZLs lightweight passenger cars (heavyweights run great, got to get more of them), but the Amtrak ones seem to have the most problems. I'm considering replacing the trucks with Full Throttle ones, but would like for that to be a last resort. Mostly because I'm not even sure they'll fit and it would be pricey at $10/truck. I don't have any >220mm curves to test them, but 220mm seems like it should be a fairly safe radius. Has anybody else had issues with these cars?
     
  2. Kurt Moose

    Kurt Moose TrainBoard Member

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    I think others have had the same issues? Try going to the AZL Forum, and searching for this, I think I remember seeing a thread about it....
     
  3. rray

    rray Staff Member

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    I have not had the opportunity to run any of my AZL passenger cars yet, but I only have 245mm and 270mm radius turns, because the trucks can only swivel so much, limited by the car's body. Also, the "Swingover", where long cars on a curve actually swing over the inside of the turns. On the tighter radius turns, the long cars swing over parallel inside tracks. Then wider cars on the inside track, hit the middle of long cars on the outside track. We discovered this issue when we were building Z-Bend Track modules, and designated 245mm and 270mm radius turns on end modules as the minimum radius so people could run passenger trains.

    That said, it may be possible to modify your cars for the trucks to swing more, by grinding away at some plastic underneath the trucks that restrict the truck's swing.
     
    tiestvangool likes this.
  4. Doug A.

    Doug A. TrainBoard Supporter

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    One note....the Amfleet II trucks are an "inside bearing" prototype, and as such cannot be (easily) replaced by other brands if you want to maintain the prototypical look.

    Part of the issue with those trucks is they drag pretty badly, which might be contributing to the issue you are having. ("these trucks" referring generically to micro-scale versions of the inside-bearing trucks, which as you can imagine don't actually have bearings. The same issue exists in the N versions and maybe even HO, and with multiple manufacturers...so it's not solely an AZL issue.) There are things that can be done to help with that although I don't know the specifics of the Z version....in N there were some well-documented hacks. (quite literally hacks, in some cases! :D ). I believe it has been discussed on the AZL forum and maybe even here too.

    Good luck. Those are sweet looking cars so hopefully you can find a fix.

    EDIT: Just noticed you also have the problem with standard lightweight cars, so those could possibly accept other more standard/traditional trucks, possibly.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2022
  5. SJ Z-man

    SJ Z-man TrainBoard Member

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    You did not say ‘where’ they derailed and always, mostly, sometimes (there or here).
    Where? Turnouts (switches), Transitions (straight-to-curve and vice versa)? Crossovers (that no-no ‘S’). Grade transitions?
    Only the car following the loco?

    Can you easily look at track level (and direct above) to watch the coupler movement, looking for side-to-side limits (like strains/ladders) or, wheel not tracking and such?
     
  6. drken

    drken TrainBoard Member

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    They derail right at the transition to the curve. I haven't tried them through switches yet.
     
  7. SJ Z-man

    SJ Z-man TrainBoard Member

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    Sorry for delay, did not see your reply in the ’unred’.

    That would be typical of longer cars (and fixed Pilot couplers on reverse run diesel passenger loco). You should see better running with the turnout as the radius is 490mm, creating a ‘Transition’ between straight and 195/220 radius (like prototype).

    The turnout will some up/down ‘transitions’, creating some possible uncoupling/derails, less likely on märklin than MTL and especially Rokuhan (quite rough).

    if you are running a typical ‘starter set oval’ and it’s not already nailed down and scenic’d, you can place the 8591 490mm at the end of each straight and use a combination of curves to run much better. The oval would now be several inches longer and wider tho.
     

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