Digitrax DN163K1C vs NCE N14K1

french_guy Feb 17, 2021

  1. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    I placed an order to an online store for 2 Digitrax decoder DN163K1C for my Kato U30C and U23C
    The store just told me they are out of stock, but can send instead 2 x NCE N14K1
    I know one could want to have all NCE or all Digitrax.....but other than that, are they technically at the same level?
    I've read Digitrax can be complex to program.....what about NCE though?
    What about the warranty? Is NCE "1 year warranty no question asked"?
    Simply put, should I wait and stick with Digitrax, or I can pull the trigger on the NCE decoders, they are just as good?

    Thanks
     
  2. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    I use mostly Digitrax and TCS decoders but I have one or two NCE ones. If you stay within the basics; min, mid, max speed or speed table, etc., you will not notice any difference. Consisting won't be a problem. As a matter of fact, I have forgotten which locos I have installed the NCEs in.

    Now if you do oddball nuance stuff then you should check the specific decoder to see if it has that feature. For example, I know TCS has better lighting controls/options. So if you are a lighting guy I would recommend using TCS decoders. You can do sorts of lighting options depending on what the loco is doing.

    Warranty wise they are all similar.
     
  3. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    I've read several times about TCS having better motor control, but never paid attention to the lighting abilities.....however they are more expensive
    So I was looking for cheaper decoders such as Digitrax ....or NCE
    I may decide for NCE then (for my GE U30C and GE U23C) and maybe try later a TCS for another engine....
     
  4. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    I've heard that too but in real life I don't notice it when I run my trains that have Digitrax decoders. I guess like anything in this hobby it depends on how picky you are and where you fight your battles. Maybe for someone who has a switching layout they will notice the different in motor control.

    Yes, TCS is usually $10 more per decoder. I don't know the reason why but it adds up if you have a lot of locos to install a decoder in.

    For lighting, here's an example of why I went with TCS. I had to put a decoder in the loco of the Kato Operation North Pole set. TCS has a decoder for the F40PH where if you run cab forward (e.g., loco running reverse), the headlights automatically turns off (like all decoders) but the rear running red lights turn on. No soldering needed, no addition of extra LEDs, etc. That decoder has everything built to match the light pipe of that decoder. It's really plug and play. I looked at the Digitrax decoder and you need all kinds of additional work to make that happen.
     
  5. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    So would it be correct to say that for what I want to do, going Digitrax or NCE is a moot point since I'm not looking for specific lighting nor "superior" motor control? And both decoders I'm considering will do the basic tasks just fine?
     
  6. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    That is how I feel about it. I've converted a lot of DC loco's and have lots to go so the majority have Digitrax in them to save a buck and I'm not picky about what they do. At some point I might have a couple that becomes important, then I'll be pickier. I don't have any sound decoder installs but might have a few at some point. Then I'd probably go ESU based on what I've read here and other places and I have bought a couple non-sound ESU decoders but that was mainly based on their size and a requirement to get a really small decoder into a loco. I'm hoping the Lais decoders become available since at $12 ( http://1fatgmc.com/RailRoad/Decoder-1/page-5.html ) they were also a viable option for my needs.

    If I only had 5-10 locos that needed decoders then price wouldn't be near as important to me. At my age I'll probably never run the ones I convert much at all. I'm mainly focused on getting any and all locos I can find that UP had from the late '40's to early 70's and have most now. So most of these will just sit as eye candy for me and not run that much but do want them to be able to run if needed. Again if I was younger I'd probably take a different approach on engines and decoders for them,

    Sumner
     
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  7. chadbag

    chadbag TrainBoard Member

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    TCS also supports RailCom if that is something important to you and why they may cost more. I use TCS for any of the "KATO" type light board replacements... (I run some European decoders otherwise, D&H and a little Zimo) for the RailCom capability.
     
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  8. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    What is RailCom exactly?
     
  9. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    Correct! I've never noticed the difference between the three. The most "advance" I ever do is speed match a few locos. Other than the F40PH, I just run my trains and use my throttle to adjust for speed. :)
     
  10. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    If you want the nitty gritty. Your head might explode like mine did. For me, it's not a concern as I'm not interested in it.

    https://dccwiki.com/Term:RailCom
     
  11. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    I googled it and found some info about RailCom..........I don't believe I need it nor be interested in it
    So I guess I will go with the 2 NCE decoders and who knows, maybe someday I will give TCS a try
     
  12. chadbag

    chadbag TrainBoard Member

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    RailCom is what the link above describes -- decoders reporting back to the command station status, etc. It allows your reporting blocks to report back not only that they are occupied, but by which train, for example. If you do automated running it is useful and a standard.

    Digitrax Transponding is similar though not compatible with RailCom. https://dccwiki.com/Transponding
     
  13. CSX Robert

    CSX Robert TrainBoard Member

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    The Digitrax DN163K1C has BEMF compensation while the NCE N14K1 does not. Also, while rarely needed in N-scale, the DN163K1C has six function outputs vs four for the N14K1.
     
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  14. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    What those 4 or 6 functions are used for usually? Lights only?
     
  15. CSX Robert

    CSX Robert TrainBoard Member

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    Yes, lights. I have seen N-scale locomotives that use more than four, in fact I have a Broadway Limited AC6000CW that has 5 - front and rear headlights, cab light, and two ditch lights - of course not a concern if you're not going to add a bunch of lights to your Katos.
     
  16. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    BEMF and "Torque Compensation" (or "Dither") can both be used to greatly improve very low speed operation of the locomotive.

    BEMF (Back Electro-Motive Force) senses the speed of the spinning motor by the voltage it generates while not being driven in between PWM pulses, and varies (modulates) the driven voltage (pulse width) to maintain the desired speed in accordance with the throttle setting. So BEMF is like cruise control on your car.

    Torque Compensation or Dither is a method of compensating the motor voltage with periodic spikes at very low throttle settings to overcome mechanical resistance (stickiness) at low speed/torque.

    Either works very effectively to provide the ability to creep along at very slow speeds (e.g. seconds per RR tie) when un/coupling, spotting cars, etc.

    NCE does not offer BEMF, but does have Torque Compensation (they call it Dither). Digitrax offers both (they call BEMF "Scaleable Speed Stabilization"

    TCS allows both methods, but both are on/off only. TCS also provides braking via a function button (e.g. just like sounding the horn, etc.), which then allows you to program momentum (slower rates of acceleration/deceleration, to simulate the prototypical weight of a large train), and use the brakes to slow or stop more quickly (like your car, letting off the accelerator does not stop your car, it just coasts and gradually slows). Some Digitrax decoders may offer function braking, but no NCE decoders that I know of do.

    I currently have locomotives with NCE, Digitrax, TCS and Zimo non-sound decoders. I like the TCS and Zimo decoders best.

    If you intend to consist locomotives together, it is best that they have the same decoder brand/motor control features, to make speed matching better under varying conditions (train length, grades, etc.)
     
  17. french_guy

    french_guy TrainBoard Member

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    Well, I've finally decided to wait for the Digitrax to arrive....I already have more locos equipped with Digitrax, and only 1 with NCE
    But maybe for my next one (SD70M or ES44AC), I will try a TCS, and I will be able to compare with Digitrax...
    Thank you all for your inputs
     

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