Decal Glue

I'm having some difficulty getting my custom made decals sticking to my latest creation. These decals were printed on Kaydee clear decal paper. I sprayed the decal film with dull coat before as well as after printing. When I applied the decals to the car side they seemed to go on fine but after they dried they completly lifted off the car side. I tried micro-sol as well as micro-set with the same result. It appears to me that the dull coat has made the decal film too stiff to settle down onto the model surface.
Do any of you have a recommendation on what kind of glue to use to get these decals to stick?

Brian

 

What kind of paint is on the model? If it's bare plastic, decals won't stick. You need a glossy painted surface.

 

I never sprayed dullcoat before printing the decals, but its been awhile. Is that standard practice with that paper?

 

Spraying Dullcote or special decal spray on home-printed decals is necessary because the film used on many types of decal paper is pretty fragile and will go to pieces - dozens of pieces - when handled for application. That's what happened to me the first time I used home-printed decals. They're way not like Microscale or other commercial decals, which you can handle just about every which way without them breaking up.

In my experience, as others have mentioned, a clean, glossy surface is needed for the decal to stick properly. Using a setting solution might help the decal to stick.

 

Thanks for the replies guys. Yah the model has a glossy paint job. There are some small ridges that the decal has to flow over but nothing absurdly huge. Using Micro-sol and Micro-set didn't seem to help at all as it has with other decals I've applied.
My first attempt at printing my own decals ended up in failure due to the fact I didn't pre-seal as well as post-seal the decal film. If you don't do these steps I have found when you soak your decal to free it from the paper the water gets to the printer ink and melts it. This time the ink seems to be perfectly sealed but the decal is much stiffer than normal preventing it from snuggling down onto the surface. Since I will be dull coating this car after I get the decals to stick (if I get the decals to stick) I was wondering if a pre-spray of dull coat on the area I want the decal to go then quickly applying the decal while the dullcoat is still wet thereby using the dullcoat as a sort of glue? I can't think of any other type of glue that would dry perfectly clear and without making a huge mess if I got a bit of extra oozing out from underneath the decal.

Brian

 

Micro Sol won't work because it's applied on top of the decal, and since it's been sealed, it won't go through.

I'm surprised that Micro Set doesn't work - that's applied to the model before decal application. Maybe it's the difference in the decal film itself? What does the manufacturer say about it? I'd be on the horn with them real fast to find out what's going on.

 

Per your advice I called both Kaydee (the decal film manufacturer) and Micro Scale today to see what may be done with my decal problem. Kaydee told me that the decal film I'm using is only made for laser printers, not inkjet (wished they would have said that on the packaging). As such, they don't recommend using a pre or post sealant of their decal film. The Kaydee rep recommended calling Micro Scale to see if they have some sort of decal cement I could use. Unfortunately, the rep. at Micro Scale didn't have much in the way of dedicated product for this problem either.

I decided to do some experimenting. My original set of decals is essentially ruined after futzing with them so much so they became guinea pigs. First I tried a thin coat of Modpodge as a fixative. It does seem to hold down the decal but it leaves a haze on the piece of styrene I was using as a simulated car side. A shot of dullcoat did not make that disappear. Next in line was a thin coat of white glue. That ended up way too thick. Lastly I tried my idea mentioned earlier, a shot of dullcoat as a glue. Well I can say that does in fact work however (man, there always has to be a "however") it gives you about 3 seconds to place the decal before it melts. It sticks real good. Too good to remove if you screw it up. Not willing to risk losing all the work I've done up to this point if I don't get it right in 3 seconds. I haven't heard of a water based dullcoat product but if there is one that may very well be the ticket to fixing my issue. Has anybody heard of such a product??

So for now I'm back to the drawing board again. I've made up another set of decals. This time I didn't pre-treat the film before printing. I will still have to post-treat it in order to keep the ink from melting when I wet it though. Hopefully this set will be thinner and less susceptible to pulling off of the side of the car as they dry.

Further updates as they develop......

Brian

 

Success!! After the second iteration of decal production I seem to have found a successful formula. As it turns out I didn't need a pre-treat of the decal film. The film itself protects the inkjet ink from deterioration from the water bath. As such even with the top coat the decal is limber enough to settle onto the car surface. I pre wetted the car surface with Microsol in order to give the decal the best chances of conforming to the surface. After 30 minutes of dry time I hit it with 2 coats of dullcoat to seal the decals. I am happy with the results.

This project was originally documented in:
http://www.trainboard.com/highball/index.php?threads/paint-stripper-for-clear-plastic.89398/

You can follow the build in a short thread I will post in:
http://www.trainboard.com/highball/index.php?threads/n-scale-whats-on-your-workbench.45048/

Thanks again for your help.

Brian

 

I didn't but that's a good idea. Must put that on my to do list.

Brian