I am a devoted fan and N scale modeler of the Southern Pacific in its glory years and into the sixties. I jumped at the chance to buy Kato's spectacular Morning Daylight and its beautiful GS4 when they were first offered. I also have Broadway Limited's Southern Pacific E7's and ALCo PA's for motive power, as well – the PA's in both Daylight and gray/scarlet liveries (for Sunset service). I have a considerable stable of SP steam, as well. I modified Bachmann's excellent 4-8-2 into a 4300-class oil-burner, albeit pre-skyline casing. As gorgeous a train as the Daylight is, I have encountered some of the cars jumping the tracks far more often than I would like, which optimally would be never. I have installed the amazing Kinematic couplers for realism. They're a bit of a chore to couple, but they work remarkably well and make the train look terrific, especially in the area of the full-width diaphragms. When I run that train at a show, people really take notice. My chief problem is with cars that jackknife and the usual suspects are the articulated cars, both the doubles and triples. Does anyone in N scale who runs this beautiful train have any suggestions on how to make these cars track more reliably? Some have suggested adding weight to the articulated cars near their common trucks. Has anyone done this? Has it helped? Would it help to add weight to all the cars? Any and all suggestions welcome. Now something somewhat related: Be careful running the Daylight through a reverse loop if you have lighting installed in the cars. Beyond shorting out the DCC system, I have had meltdowns that have distorted the axles on the cars and rendered them useless. Sometimes it was just the axles. Other times a distorted axle plus a partially melted truck side frame. This can also happen if you come to a stop on a turnout. That can get very hot very fast. The worst case scenario in this area resulted (twice) in a fried decoder in the GS4's tender - can't mistake that smell. Last, but perhaps still food for thought: as the Daylight literally lived up to its name in its hours of operation, I decided to remove all lighting from the coaches and the lounges and the coffee shop-kitchen-dining car, save for the red tail light and drumhead in the observation car. My reasoning was that this is one way to avoid any unnecessary electrical problems, i.e., short circuits, in running the train. As terrific as DCC running is, one short shuts down the whole system (and pisses off fellow engineers) unless you have allocated the power to districts or blocks. That may be fine for one's home layout, but it isn't often the case at an N Trak show.
Rick, It looks like you are running DCC, are you using an auto-reverser? Is your reversing loop long enough for the entire Daylight train? I can only guess that the problem is when the pickups in a car are straddling two different 'polarities'
Hi Rick, I can't help with anything DCC related, but I might be able to help with derailing cars. Check all the truck mountings. A truck should be able to float without resistance. Make sure whatever is securing the truck to the car allows the truck to move freely, not only to rotate, but also to rock side to side slightly. I found that when track is slightly out of line, i.e. not quite even from one rail to the other, a tight truck won't be able to compensate for the unevenness and will derail. Also a string of long passenger cars, especially when tightly coupled as you describe, will tend to push each other out of alignment slightly. Again a loosely secured truck can compensate for this sideways motion. Just a thought...good luck.
You do know that the whole train has to be in the reversing loop for it to actually "work flawlessly" as it is supposed to. I'm a member of two clubs (1 N, 1 HO) and HO installed a 2 foot "loop" thinking that power is the only thing that needs to be in the loop, a passenger car is just like a locomotive, most pick up from both sets of trucks. As for the articulated issue, I have the same thing happen on my kitchen car, but none of the coaches do it, and its only in one spot of the club layout. I haven't taken the truck/car apart to figure out what causes it as its only been recent that it has happened. Chris
I found the car to be most prone to derailing was the rear observation car. Fixed that by adding weight. For the articulated cars, if, when adding the lighting, you didn't get the articulated truck perfectly seated, they won't track well.
I had to add a bit of weight to the articulated cars to get them to track well. On one, I had to file a bit of the bolster hole on the truck, just a small amount and it worked wonders.
I have similar Daylight motive power and cars - great stuff! I too changed to the Kinematic couplers - a very simple but clever design and they make the cars look great. But they are more trouble some when you have some derailments, more so when I ran on my N-track club layout then on my home layout. So I opted for more reliable running and changed back to the standard Kato couplers.
Regarding your DCC short issue, my experience with a reversing loop may be relevant. I have a double mainline with a reversing loop on the inside line. I also have a cross over from the outside line to the inside line just before entering the reversing loop. If I run a passenger train like the Daylight with conducting wheels on the cars, I cannot go from the outside line through the cross over to the inside line and then into the reversing loop without causing a short. I can take a freight train through all this with no problem. Also, I have eight power districts on my home layout. Our N-track club layout also uses power districts.
Whether or not you've installed the lighting kits, I believe that the power pickups (and conductivity between trucks) remains the same. I haven't ran my daylight limited very much, but when I received it I recall that one of the articulated cars was not assembled correctly. Hard to explain, but one of the brass conductors between the car sections was over instead of under the mating section.
The only derailments of Kato passenger trains that I have experienced has been the baggage cars behind the trailing locomotive, usually a PA or E8. The trailing coupler always swings so wide on curves that the baggage car's lead truck derails. Eventually made my own fix described here: http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine...olution&highlight=kato+coupler+swing+PA+glenn
Charlie, Something is amiss in your wiring unless your reversing circuit is too short for the train. The function of a reversing circuit is to align the polarity of the reversing loop with the polarity of either the entry point or the exit point. To ensure the proper functioning and to eliminate issues, the reversing loop must be able to hold the entire train. With a balloon loop (entry and exit at the same turnout), this is pretty much a given based upon not wishing to crash into yourself but with other reversing loops designs, ones train could exceed the length of the reversing loop (as defined by the reversing circuit) but you are setting yourself up for shorts etc.
Paul, Thanks for your comment. I understand the need for the reversing loop to hold the entire train, especially with conducting wheels. And this is the case for trains running only on my inner mainline. But I needed a crossover from the outer mainline to the inner mainline at a position that enters the section of the reversing loop without sufficient length for the entire train. (I cannot locate the crossover at any other position due to other space constraints.) In this case the train is passing through three power districts with the district with the too-short reversing loop in the middle. (This is rather hard to explain without a sketch.) This arrangement is very helpful for some operating moves and works well for trains without conducting wheels, i.e. freight trains but not passenger trains. Charlie
Is there a specific way to help eliminate the flickering lights on the passenger cars when using the Kato light kit? I would think soldering the contacts in, but where is the best place to do this? I to have the kinematic couplers, but have not added diaphragms. What brand do most folks use?
Clean wheels and track. I think you can also buy new constant lighting circuit boards for each car, or add capacitors, but both take some time and/or $$$.
To John P., and of course anyone else tuned in here. Anytime you depend on track power it's a lost cause. They will flicker like light's in an electrical storm. John A. has an HO Layout up here in Big Bear Country. He operates lighted passenger cars without a flicker. He's developed a type of constant lighting for each car. They sure look good and with the marker light appropriately lit. I will see if I can find one his videos on You Tube to share here. [video=youtube;UBxiiJ6MuvI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBxiiJ6MuvI[/video] Cold up here in unbearable country, into the teens at night, how is it down in flat lander territory?
Rick, thanks for the video, those cars look real good. Did he use batteries or track power with a DIY keep alive? BTW, down here in the flat land of El Paso, Texas it is 38*, overcast with light rain and occasional snow flurries. Tomorrow is the Sun Bowl and it is supposed to be 4* and sunny. Carl
Carl, John A. participates here and I will send him a hailing message. He uses track power and a type of constant lighting circuitry. The only thing is I don't know how this would interact with DCC since it is AC on the track.
You can create a constant lighting setup fairly simply using a small rectifier and capacitors. The rectifier turns the AC into constant DC, and the capacitors store power so the lights don't flicker. I built the circuit on this forum and used an LED light strip inside the car. http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/4451 ~Wiley
Wiley, I just know that leads to wiley coyote jokes. So, I won't. When it comes to DCC.....The idea of using a bridge rectifier and capacitor sounds like the perfect answer. It sounds to me like you could set up your lighting systems with a rectifier and you could operate on Analog DC and DCC. Furthermore if you are using LED lighting which operates on Anallog DC and you use resistors in line, you are good to go. Wiley, can I link your comments to BarstowRick.com?
