I'm working on my third HCD layout. I'd like to make a few comments on why. First, I live in a small one bedroom apartment. I don't have the room to build a full sized layout in the space I have in my bedroom. Also, because I live in an apartment, it's not like I have or can use power woodworking tools to build bench work. My HCD layout has folding banquet table legs so that I can move it aside if I need the room or for when I move, it'll fit in either a car or a small moving truck. That mean that I don't have to destroy my layout when I move. One of the other things is that I model the California Central Valley which is basically flat, so I don't need gorges and mountains and whatnot. Yes, those would be nice, but I don't have the room and I'd like to keep my layout operationally interesting. If you'd like to see one of inspirations for me, Pachyderm217 has (or had) a sweet N&W layout based on three HCDs. Campp also had a really nice HDC that I use for inspiration on how I'd like for mine to look. It's all about what you have room for, what your skills are and what it is you're modeling. You do what makes you happy, not what others think you should be doing.
Well I'm pretty low tech. Layout sits on two very large 80's style tower speakers in the front, and a small bookshelf and a stool in the rear...The speakers each have a 1.5 piece of foam on top of them , and the stool has a coffee container on it . Yep, its kind of odd but it works and is level. If I need to move it to work on the rear ( only happened 1 time so far ) all I need to do is disconnect two wires , grab another person and lift it off.....Mike
And you get to listen to your favorite tunes as well. Is that your power pack on the stool or is that one of those stand alone railroad sound systems?
Main negative of a HCD layout: You're stuck with small radius curves. With a limited HCD width, there's a tendency to default to 9 3/4" or 11" radius curves. If you're modeling a narrow gauge, trolley or shortline operation that might be fine but if you want to run things like Superliners, auto racks, Big Boys or DDA40Xs, you're out of luck, or at best you'll have to settle for really bad overhang.
There's not much limitation with an HCD, other than tight curves. I built mine with a pair of 2" sheets of foam atop the door, then laid cork and track. The scenery height difference is almost 4" below track level and 16" over track level. Mine is likely a lot heavier than most since I have so much vertical scenery, rock formations and such, but most HCD layouts would be light. I shipped it from Montana to Germany in 2010, in its own custom built crate. This layout can go nearly anywhere I move. I added hardware store folding legs under it, mounted on a slice of 1/2" waferboard, so it is self-contained. The vertical elevation is apparent here: Some below track level cut and fill:
HCD's are to N scale as the 4x8 sheet of plywood is to HO. Those small radii curves are the albatros around N scale's neck. By small curves I mean anything under 16 inch radius. Sixteen inch radius (centerline) curves means you need a 36inch door. Most interior doorways (modern construction) are 30 inches. Older construction are narrower. If you add in the the thickness of the door when opened that opening drops is reduced by another 2 inches. Now add a 90 degree turn and things get real interesting. HCD's are bulky with no easy way to handle them if they have to be moved. In short they have too many limitations to be promulgated as THE way to go. We got to break out of this minimalist attitude (9 3/4 inch curves) that we see all the time in N scale. The most asked question in N scale is how small of a radius curve can I use.
Nothing that you said precludes you from making open grid modules. I make my modules with out the use of power tools with the exception of a battery operated drill. All saw cuts are made at the lumber store. Essentially I come home with a module kit. In addition, you could probably make better use of the available space you have by using a sectional dogbone shaped layout. That is what happened to one of our club members who wanted a home layout but he lived in an apartment. He ended up doing the modules rather than the HCD and gained about 40% of usable layout
That is 100% opinion and / or generalization and / or personal experience with hyperbole thrown in. None of it is 100% accurate and an intelligent person can easily overcome anything you mention. Yes, I realize you are frequently pushing for higher standards and that is a very important endeavor. Still, guess what? They are just not for everyone. A Bachman MDT switcher with a short string of Trainman cars hooked by Rapido couplers running on Kato track all built on a flat painted 2'x4' board works for some people. And when it happens the Earth does not stop spinning. Yes, really. In my earlier posts I have refuted your claims so while I encourage you to continue to push your agendas I would like to see you admit you are generalizing. Vitriolic hyperbole just turns people off, well, in my opinion and based on my observation. As always, I wish you the best.
Well, I have to say you certainly see things very black-and-white. While I agree that 9-3/4" curves should be an extreme last resort, shooting all the way to 16" as a minimum is throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water. Even jumping to 11" makes light years of difference, and going to 13" will handle dang near any locomotive or rolling stock ever made. Does it look great? Not necessarily, but I think at some point folks that are utilizing HCD's "get it" that things aren't gonna be perfect and are willing to make a few concessions to have a layout. And as you allude to....much bigger radii and it makes the concept of the HCD more complicated. I think the HCD is a solid idea, (no pun intended) especially for someone just getting started...although certainly not limited to that, as we've seen over and over from some big names on the forums like Hemi and Dave Vollmer. I must say, I'm having decent luck (so far) with an "all foam" construction for a tabletop-style setup. I laminated 2" and 1" together and it seems to hold its shape extremely well. In my instance it spans up to 2-3ft without incident, although in fairness I'm not doing drastic scenery above and have only dipped down into the 1" top sheet for below grade features (creeks, etc) I would be nervous to go further than that at the expense of strength, especially across the entire cross-section. At any rate, perhaps another option for those contemplating a small layout. I think it would REALLY work good for a smallish "4x8-equiv" layout. (say, 30"x58") I cut cavities into the 2" bottom piece to house wiring and other electronics....it would be very easy to build a self-contained, lightweight, portable layout that way methinks.
I cannot fathom the need to villify either an HCD, or the four by eight. Both are rock solid, time proven choices. And, I am not sure how people are having so much trouble getting an HCD through a doorway. The common standard door is 29&3/4 inches by 80 inches. (Which easily accomodates 13 inch radius in N scale.) Moving it through a door opening, even with scenery, and turning 90 degrees for such as a hallway, is not a difficult task. Given the properly finished opening for such door is 80&1/2 inches, the door slides through completely vertical. Yes, I know some doorways are different, even so, the door only needs to be leaned to one side and it slips right through. Just as a test, minutes ago, I've popped the hinge pins off the door of this room. It is an HCD in a more expensive style, somewhat heavier than what I would buy for a layout, as it has an additional veneer on both sides. Even with my wrecked body, moving the door out, turning 90 degrees and walking down the hallway to our living room did not even require ten seconds.
I'm using Kato Unitrack. I believe it's 12 3/8" radius. I could go sharper, but I have a Kato California Zephyr that I'd like to be able to run without it looking too ridiculous.
I am going to use a 36" wide HCD and a Kato V11 double track set on it for the mainline. The outside track has a radius of 16 3/8", the inside radius is 15" and it will fit on the door. Granted, there is not a lot of room on either side but it will work. With those radii, nearly all locos will be no problem to run and the majority of cars will look OK. I plan on attaching everything to the layout and when it needs to be portable, I will glue and screw two handles to the back edge and will be able to just lift it up sideways and go. The tallest height of any point on the layout will be about 12" so it won't be a problem to go through a doorway. I was think of just gluing 1/2" sheet cork to the door directly rather than use foam; has anyone else done that? I want to minimize the sound resonating and don't need the bulk of the foam as my layout will be flat.
I agree Ken....HCD's are fairly simply to get through a doorway and even down a hallway. AND...thats with track & scenery attached. Unless of course...you have 40 inch high mountains...then it could get interesting...lol.
A while back when Model Railroader built the Virginian Project Railroad they showed how to make removable tall scenery for having to get a tall layout through tight spaces. I thought it was a good idea. They used PVC, I think, and made a pegs and holes in the scenery to make it removable.
Hmmm, I was thinking of doing atleast 13. I can make compromises like not running passenger trains on layout, I was hoping to do mostly freight anyways seeing as how I can probably get more out of the layout if I do run freights only. Guys the biggest loco's to probably grace the layout would be my C424's, maybe a GS4 or E unit. I've no need for DD40's, modern power, or modern railcars, so those won't be issues(in my case). the most modern I may end up going are some GP38's(BN ones, that the SP&S ordered pre merger).
I use the Kato double track on mine, I think the min radius in 15 3/8 " and the outside is 16". I did make the layout 38" wide though. 80' passenger cars look OK on the curves, but I really wouldn't want to go any smaller on the curves. I think the GS4 will do 11" curves, but would look pretty bad. 13" will probably be OK......
