I have over 2,000 new MTL cars to sell. I listed weekly on ebay no-reserve auctions in Dec thru Jan. (my ebay ID is 200*mph) as a 30 day "test run". I listed a total of 8 multi-car packs, and 13 "pairs" of cars, 1 older 1 newer from the same series, so I wouldn't have to ship single cars. Much of what I learned may be old hat to veteran ebay sellers: Comments and suggestions welcome. 1) 7 day auctions work best. Most bidding occurs in the last 5 minutes, but 7 days builds the number of bidders and watchers. 2) End auctions on a weekday evening. 8 to 9p ET worked well when selling eastern cars, 10p ET was better for western roads. 3) Low starting bids ($5 to $10) make a better auction, more bidders/watchers and promotes early bidding so someone doesn't "steal" the item. 4) If the starting bid is set too high, the auction often ends with just one bid placed as it ends. 5) "Free" shipping has little to no effect on number of bids or final price. Charge actual ship cost or a modest fixed price. Combine shipping for multiple wins. 6) Offering "Free" shipping is a loser for items selling < $30, and a complete waste of your time for items < $10 or less. 7) Net after costs (shipping, ebay & paypal fees) averaged 86% of final bid price. Here's what I found puzzling: The average high bid price was just under 30% of the Armstrong guide "values". One four pack sold for just 18% of its high auction price, while six-packs sold for 20 to 43%. 4 of the 21 lots were bought by ebayers who resell MTL cars under their same ebay ID, which says to me they are buying at "wholesale". I understand that the "high" auction values aren't repeatable, especially on ebay, but I hoped to realize 50% of those values or so. Is this unrealistic? Unlike ebay, NSC auctions are "blind-bid". You bid, but don't know what others are bidding. Does this result in lower bids than an open auction? Is NSC's 20% fee worth it?? Finally, is there a better way to sell these and realize a reasonable return ? Thanks!
While there are still many Kadee/MTcollectors out there, the market fell off a couple of decades ago, and has never recovered. Now and then there is a feeding frenzy, but in general prices are way down from highs of old days. As for NSC, these days I do not know. It has changed so much since Wick started the idea, decades ago. I cannot think of any alternatives which will significantly improve your returns. Today it seems to be hit or miss, luck of the draw.
Here is what I have learned about Ebay. There are a TON of MOOCHES on there that want a $20 item for $5 INCLUDING shipping. Ryan
200MPH, I don't know what scale you are in but I purchase a lot of N scale on Yahoo Groups N Scale Yard Sale along with the train board swap meet. Prices are fair and there is no commission to pay by the seller. Harold
Some rather obvious things, my rating is now 600 since 2000, I've been doing this for a while.... It's really easy to look up closed auctions once you are a member. If you don't think what things are selling for is rational, don't list. Those results don't lie. If you want to do it 'quick and dirty' do a Buy it Now for at or near the last closed auction amount, because that's as close as you'll get. And don't complain. That search will sometimes stun you when you find out just how many identical, factory air, same car number, same run either didn't sell or sold way below what you thought it was worth. Or you may find out you've got a real collector item that has set its own value. If you've got something really unique, that is difficult to price, or has had wild swings in closed auction values, a true auction may be your best bet. But don't count on it. Exposure helps, but if you just want to buy something and move on, auctions are a PITA. After a buyer has been burned a couple times on ridiculous shipping charges, they learn to watch. It's OK to be a little above pure postage, but not by 2X or 3X. The market is also seasonal as all get out, like it or not. My own 'wish list' can wait you out until summer, particularly on books and brass. But I can also tell you that my wish list got full retail plus when my family was shopping for me before Christmas.
My feedback is over 740 and most of it is from buying and selling N Scale. I thought your points on ending listings on weeknights was interesting, I usually found ending on Sunday night was always more advantagous. I am going to have to try the week day listings and see what happens. As Rand Gust alluded to, I buy in summer and early fall when prices seem to be lower, and sell in winter when prices seem to be higher, (more people sitting at home when it is cold outside.) If you are going to list on ebay or NSYS, I like to use the completed listings option to get an "educated" idea of what the going rate people are recently paid for the item I have in question. Much like antiques, ebay and the internet in general has crippled "collector prices" on some items...what used to be at a dealer or collectors auction "look at this one, there are few like it and very hard to find", to now all it takes is logging on and you see wow, there are 8 of them for sale and this is what everyone is paying.
In a blind auction everyone bids the maximin they are willing to pay for item, which is known in Economics as their reserve price. The person who has the highest reserve price wins the item and pays his reserve price. In an ebay style action the person who is willing to pay the most still wins the item, but he will only pay the reserve price of the second highest bidder plus the bid increment. Therefore the fee is worth it only in cases where there is a large difference between the highest reserve price and the second highest.
Wish I had you as one of my buyers! I had one jackhole last week that raked me over the coals and called me a thief in an e mail stating that $7 was WAY too much to charge for USPS small flat rate box, which cost me $5.80 to ship at the post office and not to mention what Paypal also takes. He only wanted to pay $2.25 for shipping (AND STILL WANTED IT IN 3-5 DAYS TOO!), on 2 NEW MTL Great Northern boxcars that I had priced at $16. He was getting a screaming deal at $16 and even at $2.25 shipping he still said that was too much $$$. There is one word that comes to mind with someone like this...............MOOCH! Needless to say I blocked him from my future auctions! Ryan
I model N scale and I have thousands of transactions on ebay. I agree that 7 day auctions work best. Ending on weekends has always served me better and most probably Sundays. I schedule them to end so that everyone across the country is awake. Late afternoon in Eastern time. Shipping cost is a huge factor in my experience. If you intend to make a few dollars off of shipping you are doomed. Buyers want to be treated fairly. As close to actual cost as possible, combine shipping, and package the item carefully. Skimp on packaging and you'll lose sales. I even offer refunds on shipping if I have overcharged. The best thing that I ever did was to offer a full refund plus the buyer's return shipping costs if they are unhappy with the item. I give them 7 days from receipt of the item to contact me. Because I accurately describe my items, I have never had to pay a refund. I noticed a big jump in sales when I first offered my guarantee. I accept international buyers and have never had an issue. I charge actual shipping for foreign orders. I have a lot of sales so my transaction number is high and they are 100% positive. What this all amounts to is good planning and a good reputation. I get multiple return customers and I now sell twice as much outside of ebay than through it. Even a good reputation won't make some things sell though. As others have said, look at the selling prices of similar items. Unfortunately MTL cars are the biggest bust for me unless they truly are rare. They are priced so high to begin with that there is no room to make any money. I buy MTL cars on ebay because I know I can get them cheaper there than anywhere. I do all of this just to fund my hobby! The boss says I can spend what I make. On the flip-side, I have had things sell on ebay for crazy amounts of money. A Walthers Russell snowplow in factory paint for $120.00. A Life Like FA+B (new releases) custom painted in VIA foobie for $375.00. One of those resin Jordan snowplows from a kit in Canadian Pacific for $315.00.
@Everyone - Thank you for this thread and sharing your expertise. It will prove helpful when I can finally get my list together.
I third it. And I think it depends on your time zone. You don't want to be later than 9pm eastern. Or earlier than probably 1pm Pacific. So, it should be later if you are eastern and earlier if you are western. I bet the results within that window do not vary all that much.
I did many a Sunday ending. I'd time mine to end after most folks had finished dinner, and could spend some time on the computer. Sunday is excellent, as many people are home, especially in the evening.
Thanks for all the great input so far. A few comments: 1) I ship at actual USPS retail cost, and I eat the paypal and ebay fees on the shipping charge. I use ebay's link to USPS to purchase postage and print labels online. You get a bit of a discount, so it becomes a break even. No buyer has complained, and I refund any overcharge on shipping... buyers are both surprised and very happy. 2) I dont accept returns on new items, unless they arrive damaged. Good photos and descriptions are a must. From what I read here, I may try a return policy and see if transaction prices go up. 3) Ending auctions in early to mid evening works well. I try to time auction ends to around 7p in the time zone of the roads I am selling... NYC & PRR cars end 3 hrs earlier than UP or SP auctions. 4) More people are at home weeknights than on weekends though; TV ratings bear this out. You can bid while you're watching The Voice with your wife. Thanks for the ideas about Yahoo, checking completed listings for price guidance, and staying "in season" (selling in winter only). K-59: I understand your comments about blind auction bidders bidding to their reserve. My concern is, in a "live" auction, buyer's often raise their reserve to win an item. The blind auction seems good for a buyer's discipline, but is it a good deal for sellers? I guess for a "live" auction to achieve the best result, we must be assured of plenty of bidders, so I watch page views, watchers and bidder counts to see what is drawing good numbers. I'd give NSC a try, but they want a minimum of 50 items from a new seller, so that may wait for next winter. Okay, I'm encouraged... I'll list a few more cars tonight and see what happens. Thanks!
One lesson I learned the hard way is that one may believe they do not accept returns...the reality is if you use PayPal as your transaction resource, PayPal allows returns with total refunds. Thus, returns are always possible simply by the buyer claiming they are not satisfied with the item for whatever reason and filing such a claim in PayPal. Plus, such seems to have an automatic way of eliminating the possibility of applying feedback to the transaction. Hence, feedback cannot be used to warn other sellers of fickle and outrageous buyers who have a change of mind for some off-the-wall reason. Peace, Gary (1263 with 100% feedback rating)
I don't think it's a good idea to list "pairs" of cars (older and newer from the same series). When I shop on eBay, I'm looking for something specific and wouldn't look twice at an auction for two cars, unless I really wanted both of them (and this would be very seldom). Bryan
More people may be home on weekdays, but they aren't on eBay. Having sold on eBay since it began, I learned very quickly that ending listings in the evenings on the weekend made for better sales. I think a lot if not most of us get more into train mode on the weekends and we have more time to peruse the internet. A week night for me is full of family and planning for the next day's events.
Until this Christmas, ive been, with few exceptions a buyer. This year i sold some O Gauge excess in another forum. I looked at ebay prices, decided what I wanted and set a price. Selling on a forum, allowed me to avoid fees (i do support that forum by buying thier magazine). It also seemed to limit buyers to people that understood the hobby. I "lost money" on every sale. Nothing I Sold "appreciated. I WAS/AM fine with that. I owned it, enjoyed it and cut my loss, by reselling, when I was done with it. Now to bring focus back to N scale. Specifically rolling stock. When I started, in the hobby, i was a hoarder. ie: i can run 20 ish holiday cars, on the n scale holiday loops, but i own about 50. I overbid on some.. fast forward. I now understand mu wants/needs and price range. If rolling stock is still in production, a few etailers are ALWAYS a better deal than ebay buy it now. If it isnt in stock, i can wait for a buy it now, that i am willing to pay, or wait. Im not going to get into that snipe junk anymore, because there will always be another one listed. To the point. You bought this stuff ad a hobbyist. It doesnt appreciate. Set up a list, here on tb. Set your prices and wait. If you are going to use ebay, you are going to get the fullebay experience... your choice, but remember, your cutting your losses, you arent going to make a living. Mythical high auction prices are dead, in large part, because we can search that "rare" car and find it elsewhere. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
Originally Posted by Bryan "I don't think it's a good idea to list "pairs" of cars (older and newer from the same series). When I shop on eBay, I'm looking for something specific and wouldn't look twice at an auction for two cars, unless I really wanted both of them (and this would be very seldom)." Bryan Ditto. As an Ntrakker and open hopper accumulator [remember one can never have enough coal hoppers] I will rarely buy a single car.
