Have you ever thought about the possibility that N scale needs its own forums and specialized online retailers, just because it is such a small market? For HO modellers it is much easier to meet other HO modellers, to buy modeltrains at the lhs, to find fine examples in the magazines, just because there are larger numbers of HO modellers. The fact that there are more N scalers and N scale retailers active on the internet, does not mean that N scale is larger than HO. I think that the internet is more a necessity. But why all this complaining and conspiracy theories? There are so many fine products available in N scale! And yes, the pre-ordering systeem is not always handy: product A comes in June, product B in August and product C in December, but I have to order them together to make it economical to get those items from the USA to the Netherlands. So I have the risk of missing one of those models, or the retailer must be so friendly to hold up my orders till the package is complete. But on the other hand: 10 years ago, I wouldn't have B&O wagontops, WOT baggage cars, or a Bachmann 44tonner. I think that N scalers must do more about promoting their scale and showing what is possible in this tiny scale. That will draw more new modellers, and then the manufacturers will make more models.
Sure have. And if that were true, then by definition G scale would have a larger market than N, because it also is lacking in specialized online retailers which assumes its popularity. In fact, by N Scale having the largest online presence in the form of fora and retailers, this train of reason would state that N Scale is least popular scale! I dont think the those dots connect. I maintain that the degree of online representation of N Scale compared to HO remains relative to the overall popularity of these scales. Of course having an online store will broaden one's market! But if profit is the name of the game, and if HO scale was the most popular scale, why then do most online retailers deal in N? Wouldn't the HO Scale online retailer be the most profitable venue? And shouldn't the proportion of HO Scale online retailers then be greater than that of N? One could argue that the popularity of N scale over HO has caused the need to move sales online because there is so much more of a demand! When was the last REAL market study? And who was it conducted by? I'm not complaining or conspiring, and I agree there are several fine N Scale products.
Expanding on Thieu's statement. Initially, N scale was very hard to find in the LHS. Because of this many went searching elsewhere. At first it was mail order magazine adds. As the internet grew in popularity, the mail order went online. The HO guys still had their fully stocked LHS so they really had no need to look elsewhere. There were/are plenty of HO clubs and friends to bounce idea's off of. N scale guys often talk of nobody in the area to run with or bounce idea's off of so they turn to the internet to find peers to share info with. I never have understood the persacution complex that some N scalers have. The NMRA is not the evil empire, the man (manufactures) isn't conspiring to keep N scale in the shadows. Model Railroader publishes more N scale articles than people tend to admit and the only thing keeping more articles out of MR is a lack of submissions by N scalers. Enjoy what you have and and model what you don't.
Because the G, S and other obscure scales are even smaller than N scale and they don't have enough market share to support more than one or two retailers. Also part of this is narrow mindedness. As N scalers, we know what retailer / e-tailers to shop at. I couldn't tell you what the best shop is for G scale but I'm sure a G scaler could. By the same token, the G scaler probably couldn't tell you where to buy N scale.
Two factors kicked off the growth of N scale, both happened in the 1970s. First was NTrak, and it's socializing. Second came TWO discount sellers. Pete P on the east coast and Lee Elder on the west coast. Others followed. Were you active (I mean really active) in N scale thirty years ago? If so, you missed it, somehow. This occurred in the very early 1980s, when there happened some very unwelcome intrusions. I was there. I saw and even participated in some of the heated exchanges and so on. Since then have carried foward the feelings generated. Boxcab E50
I have one pre order outstanding. It's been since 2005. I don't know if the PCM/BLI M1's will ever see the light of day but since preordering those two M1's I have since moved to another address. I have cut back on my purchases also. I came to the conclusion that I have more stuff than I imagined and that was before I packed for the move. After packing I realize even my wildest estimate was very conservative. I run Ntrak and long trains is the name of the game but I find that every setup we do I take the same locomotives and the same cars and most of my stuff sits at home. Guys in the club even ask me if I have any other trains as they are tired of seeing the same old, same old. So no more preordering for me. In fact I doubt I will purchase stuff like I used to. Most of the stuff being made now is too modern for me and the pricing is mind boggling.
I was as active as a 15 year old with no car could be in the 80's. I can understand a chip on your shoulder but many of the posters carrying on the chip weren't even born in the early 80's. Something I tell my 7 year old son seems to apply here, sometimes you have to be the better person and end the fight. Perpetuating a grudge when there is no justification at present does nobody any good.
I'm talking 1980-1981. It was resolved. But some of us recall what was a completely unnecessary circumstance. There are some people carrying a grudge. For those more recent, I know a reason why that I have heard from more than a hand full. But that's getting way aside from this topic. Right now I have more pre-orders in place then ever before. Because I have managed to scrape up some money, somehow. And because I am sick and tired of the struggle to to catch up, which too many view VERY simplistically. If manufacturers believe that limiting profits by limiting the amount they sell is good business, so be it. I'm not interested in hearing about cash flow, etc, etc. I am a retired (disabled) business professional and former (successful) hobby shop owner. I know the ropes. Run your shop as you feel is profitable. When I walk in and it's not on a shelf, I can't buy it. How much money do you make off a no-sale? Do you expect me to return? You do? Really? Boxcab E50
Hi Pete I can understand your frustration with pre-orders. As a dealer we get frustrated as well. Alot of items that were suppose to be in last fall for the holiday never even made it to our distributors loading docks until January or Febuary. A huge part of this is that alot of the good train companies in all scales come from China. With all the political garbage that is going on with fair trade China has been taken its sweet time with getting stuff out the door. The only company that has been pretty much on time with its item is KATO. Its amazing that after what they have gone through with the earthquake and such they still get their product out. I brought up the question with MTH when they listed on their facebook page a picture of Mike Wolf in China with the dyes for making trains how come these items cant be made here. I was told it is to cost worthy and they would go out of business. So then I post another question to them. I said ok if thats the case how come you (MTH) have the worst discounts of all the train companies that come out of china. They had no answer. I feel its going to get worse than better as we rely more and more on China for out goods.
I can’t speak for locomotives and rolling stock but when it comes to structure, detail and vehicle kits every manufacturer of said items I have ever conversed with tells the same story. They sell 10 HO kits for every N, assuming they offer both. Some of these small companies have even gone so far as to tell me they won’t bother with N-Scale anymore because it costs as much to bring the N-Scale kit to market as an HO version and almost as much to produce it, yet they can recover the HO costs in a year while they may never recover the costs for the N-Scale version of said kit, at least not from sales of N-Scale kits. In other words; they make their profits selling HO and offer the N-version as a labor of love. What does this say about those of us in this hobby? Are locomotives and rolling stock the only thing the majority of N-Scalers are interested in? Are N-Scalers paying vast sums to get the bestest and mostest in locomotives and rolling stock, then filling the cities and industries with “Reddy Built” buildings? From many of the photos I’ve seen on this site I’d have to answer no to the above; but the sales figures don’t lie so; what the heck is going on? If we are 25% or 30% of the hobby; then shouldn’t we be buying at least 25% to 33% of the kits offered as opposed to only 10%? Currently I am not buying anything, my last locomotives were the California Northern Gp15s; and how long ago were they announced/released? My last structure kits was a tiny two car garage produce by GC Laser. I cancelled a couple of pre-reserved rolling stock items and the only thing that interests me currently is the possibility that Micro-Trains will produce the remaining “FarmRail” covered hoppers and Atlas might produce the remaining Western Pacific U-Boat.
