4x8 Layout Ideas?

mydartswinger Apr 10, 2011

  1. mydartswinger

    mydartswinger New Member

    3
    0
    6
    Good evening all,
    I've been constructing an HO scale layout that is a modern coal mine based in an Appalachian Mountain area served by NS. I'm at a point now (only a few trees, people, details, and new locomotives from here out.) where I'm ready to start the planning on a new layout. I considered O scale, since I really enjoy operating O scale and have the power, locomotives, and rolling stock to do so. However, knowing that I'm going to be moving within a year and not knowing the kind of space that I will have available to me at that time, I've opted to go for an N scale layout.

    With that in mind, I've selected a 4x8 size to go with. I know there are many reasons why not to go with a 4x8, and have considered other options (around the wall, shelf, surround, etc...). I don't want to get into why or why not to build a 4x8, just track plan options (I'm also aware that I should design a track plan, then design the benchwork to suit).

    I'm wanting to go with a Rocky Mountain theme this time around. Based somewhere in Colorado on a UP mainline (possibly shared with BNSF as well). I want it to be freelanced in the modern era to a point where older UP (and their fallen flag's) locomotives (SP AC-12, UP Big Boy, UP Challenger, UP GTEL, SP GS-4, etc... Though of these, only a challenger is in operation currently that I know of) can make an appearance without much detraction from the layout's theme. Broad curves (as broad as feasible) and minimal grades (1.5-2%) are my goals to allow for longer trains and bigger locomotives. I would like to have tunnels, bridges, and rivers on the layout. I'm looking for a good mix of continuous running and switching operation. My current HO layout is lacking in the switching department, and I'm looking to do more switching. As for industries, I haven't decided on that just yet. I've done coal on my HO layout, so I'm looking for something a bit different. Maybe some passenger service, maybe some intermodal, maybe dry goods, maybe produce, I'm still open for ideas on this.

    I'm considering using a modified version of Atlas's N17 (Scenic and Relaxed) for this layout, but am open to other options. I've modified the plan to include a minimum radius of 17.5" and a minimum turnout of #7 with grades of 1.5-2%. However, I'm a bit leery of using the grade like that on the right hand side of the layout due to that particular grade having a turnout in the middle of the grade. I would like to avoid that. On this particular design, moving the grade before the turnout would increase the grade to 3-4% (a grade I'm trying to avoid on this layout, as my current layout has 4% grades).

    Attached is my modified Scenic and Relaxed layout, as created in Atlas RTS (this is just an image file, if you want the actual .ral file, let me know).

    Any suggestions?

    Thanks in advance,
    Shannon
     

    Attached Files:

  2. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    Whether in HO or N...if using 4' X 8'...make sure you can walk around it...or that you have a 48 inch reach !:tb-wink:

    .
     
  3. mydartswinger

    mydartswinger New Member

    3
    0
    6
    Thanks for the reply. Believe me, I'm well aware of the reach and walkaround.
     
  4. kmcsjr

    kmcsjr TrainBoard Member

    1,702
    60
    32
    Not on post, but welcome. This time of year I miss my 1974 dart swinger. It doesn't really compare to a wife and kids and model train posting at 2 am, waiting for the dog to come in and the oldest to come home from the first aid squad..... but on a sunny day, with the windows rolled down. Sigh...
     
  5. nscaled

    nscaled TrainBoard Member

    17
    0
    10
    Go to your local HS if you have one. Every once in awhile Model Railroader proves it has some use after all. Their March and April issues I believe contained a 2-part article on 4x8 layouts. Your Local HS might still have them.

    I’m not a UP guy, Pennsy here, but I would think the area you are thinking of would be mostly long haul intermodal traffic. Not much opportunity for switching, but I'm sure the scenery would be amazing!
     
  6. David Bromage

    David Bromage TrainBoard Member

    420
    1
    16
    Best suggestion I can offer for a 4x8 in any scale is "don't". As mtntrainman says, unless you have 2' of access space all around or a 48" reach it will cause trouble. A 4x8 actually requires 8x12 of floor.

    I would strongly recommend looking at the Heart of Georgia layout, particularly the method of frame construction. This layout take up less space than a 4x8 (when you take into account access space) and even less when not actually in use and packed away. Plus it is truly portable. It will also allow longer trains, a longer run of main line and much gentler curves.

    It should not be hard to adapt the above track plan to this sort of arrangement. Unfold the folded figure 8 into a flat circuit and see what works.

    Cheers
    David
     
  7. Inkaneer

    Inkaneer TrainBoard Member

    4,325
    1,424
    77
    A 4 X 8 is not recommended. At some point in time a decision will be made to move the layout. Getting a 4X8 through a doorway or up or down stairs or around a corner is not easy. Instead I recommend a modular design with modules no wider than 2 feet or longer than 6 feet. These can be made lightweight yet strong and are relatively easy to transport. 1 x4 for the exterior frame with 1 X 2 crossbracing and 1/4 inch luan underlayment for either gussets to prevent racking [for open frame module] or as a module top. Track should be gapped at the module ends so that if the layout has to be disassembled no cutting would be required. I recommend taking a look at the Ntrak website at Main Page to view their practices. Ntrak clubs have pioneered the modular concept for 40 years now and their concepts work.
     
  8. Espeeman

    Espeeman TrainBoard Member

    1,042
    90
    33
    I agree with David and Inkaneer. My home layout is comprised of (2) 3'x5' and (4) 2'x4' modules arranged in an U-shape. I know that within a year it will go from the basement to an upstairs room prior to converting the basement into finished living space. With this configuration I can move the layout with relative ease. I can also put covers over each module to keep the scenery from being damaged. The modular N-scale club I belong to has moved the club modules from show to show many times with very little repair work necessary, even after the time the trailer broke loose and ended up in a ditch. The only module that was damaged was the one without a lid.

    Oh! and welcome to the Trainboard! :D
     
  9. purple1

    purple1 TrainBoard Member

    172
    71
    16
    Please re-think a 4x8 if you are thinking of moving. I had to give up on one that just could not be moved in time. Now I will never build one that size again. If you must do a 4x8, at least make it in two (or more) sections that can be moved easy. My next layout will be some type of modular system that can move around without a team of men.
     
  10. MC Fujiwara

    MC Fujiwara TrainBoard Member

    1,190
    66
    20
    I, too, would advocate at least a HCD (36"x80"ish) layout over 4x8, but, since you asked for plans not debate, here you go.

    nscaled is right: MR just put out a couple issues devoted to 4x8s, with a couple of them being N scale. You can see them on their trackplan data base at their website.

    Both MR and the Layout Design Journal (Winter 2001) have articles on Dan Sylvester's Rio Grande Southern 4x8, which, being HOn3, means that you'd have (a little) more room for scenery. This layout features a handy staging loop under the layout as well.

    You can take any of Mike's layout designs here and expand them to fit 4x8: most are a bit packed anyway.

    There are a bunch of groovy 3x6 designs here on Trainboard. Mark Watson came up with a groovy one to replace his Thunder Ridge modified 4x8, and Arizona Shortline came up with a couple.

    Looking at 3x6 N scale or HO 4x8 designs and then adapting to N 4x8 would give you room for the magnificent scenery you want.

    I suggest an angled, curved or s-shaped viewblock to divide the layout into scenes.
    Good luck.
     
  11. SleeperN06

    SleeperN06 TrainBoard Member

    3,386
    50
    45
    I have two 3x8 modules that are flat so I can turn them on their side to go through doors, but at 8’ long it is difficult to move them around corners. Although I have moved them myself up and down the steps, it really is a job for two people.

    The disadvantage of a flat layout is that you can’t have much in the way of bridges and mountains. You also have to have everything fastened down or removable. On the plus side, I love being able to flip it up on its side to do work on the wiring . :psmile:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 10, 2011
  12. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    Re-reading the OP post...

    I've been constructing an HO scale layout that is a modern coal mine based in an Appalachian Mountain area served by NS.

    I was originally in HO. I had a 4x8 that sat on my pool table...easy access all around. Although I still contend 4x8 can be a headache at times no matter what scale ;-)

    .
     
  13. Sierra117

    Sierra117 TrainBoard Member

    554
    1
    14
    I modified the Salt Lake Route from the Jan-June 2010 issues of Model Railroader Magazine. It was originally a 4x9, but I shortened it a bit and with a scenery break this track plan can allow for switching and such on one side with a nice scenic run on the other. I didn't break up my scenery since it will be mostly town and such, but in the future I hope to make a mostly scenery layout. The original of the track plan can be found by Google searching Salt Lake Route, or I have the modified version drawn out on the site listed in my signature.
     
  14. mydartswinger

    mydartswinger New Member

    3
    0
    6
    First of all, let me [FONT=&quot]apologize for the lengthy delay of my response. I was traveling home shortly after I originally posted and have not had a chance to get on here since then.

    Thank you for the welcomes and the responses.

    Initially I was pretty dead set on a 4x8 tabletop due to not having a dedicated train room, knowing I'm going to move in about a year, and most likely not have a dedicated train room wherever I move to. After reading your posts, doing a bit more research and thinking. I think I will go ahead and go with an N-Trak layout. Without going to in depth on the N-Track corner module standards, I'll likely use my garage (I wasn't wanting to use that space prior due to the upcoming move, and knowing that I'll likely not have a garage after the move) and use 10 2'x4' modules to create an 8'x16' surround w/duckunder that I could convert to a 4'x8' should the need arise once the move is complete, also allowing me to use the modules for either a traveling layout for a club without one, and/or to be part of an N-Trak club layout at a later time, especially if I can move where I want to move to (Colorado Spring, CO, home of the Pike's Peak 'N' Gineers N Trak module club (whom I visited on my recent trip, and part of what prompted my desire to build an N scale layout). My local club has an N scale layout, but I'm not sure what standards it uses. I'll get with our N scale "guru" today at our open house to find out more. Afterwards, I'll see what I can come up with in Atlas RTS for the modular design.

    I do like Arizona Shortline's design that was mentioned as well. If I was to have gone with that, I might would have modified it a bit to allow for a bit wider curves, at least in some spots if possible. A really cool concept.

    Sierra117,
    I like your design for your WyCo Western Ry. Definitely a design worth considering (to modify?) if I was to go back to a 4x8.

    kmcsjr,
    Yeah, I miss my old '73 as well. Being in the military isn't quite condusive to having a classic car (trying to fight for a parking space when I didn't have a garage or driveway, plus the constant maintenance just to keep it going so the MP's don't get on me for having a dead car in housing, etc...).

    BTW, if anyone's interested in what I have done in HO in 4x8, search out my channel on YouTube (same SN as here). I have 8 update vids of it at the present time (I'll be working on a 9th this weekend, as a few things have been added since my last update).

    I'm off to the club. Thanks again,
    Shannon
    [/FONT]
     

Share This Page