FVM: NS and BNSF Gevo are here!

why are U.P. details or BNSF more important then the NS?
why build a correct loco for one and not the other...
kato did the same thing with there NS c44-9w

i'll pass on these and wait to see how atlas did with there
NS cw's

 

Mark - the Atlas C40-8W's are ex-Conrail - and should be right, since they got the Conrail locos right - at least for the numbers they did!

Some of us have no interest in kitbashing otherwise really nice models - which the FVM GEVO's certainly are. I don't think it makes sense to question why anyone would cut it apart - the question on the table is why Kato (although they seem to have gotten better) - and FVM get it wrong for NS - and also CSX for that matter.

It will be interesting to see if Kato gets the CSX ES44AC's correct. They do seem to be doing multiple body styles - BUT - they did not make minor changes that "could" have been there for some of the UP and the CSX SD70ACE's.

Personally, I don't mind any of this, but I do think that by complaining, we increase the chances that next time they get it right!

 

Quote: Some of us have no interest in kitbashing otherwise really nice models - which the FVM GEVO's certainly are. I don't think it makes sense to question why anyone would cut it apart - the question on the table is why Kato (although they seem to have gotten better) - and FVM get it wrong for NS - and also CSX for that matter.

Because there is more detail difference than just the headlight. It is my understanding that NS orders a number of things that make the unit unique to them. The fix the headlight, 10 other complaints come up. It's a small company. They can't afford to produce a number of dead-on versions, and have the price come in halfway reasonable. Maybe later.

Frank

Frank

 

I really like the detail that FVM has done for these locos. I know it's a bummer that there is only one body style but costs are a big thing here so right now making the correct versions is not cost effective for them. I can't recall how these units are put together as I am moving so they're all boxed up but perhaps FVM can put out correct cabs or something in the future (if the cabs are a separate piece)? I'd be upset too if I was modeling NS and wanted to be as accurate as possible. FVM needs support on these though so they can make more versions and perhaps even make corrections where needed. I hope I can snag one or two BNSF units before they're sold out but currently I'm short on cash.

 

Would you NS guys rather that FVM not released NS paint schemes if they weren't going to do the correct details?
I'm a big fan of modern power, and have all 3 of the UP and KCS numbers (and 2 Ferromex) of FVM's locos, but quite honestly, I couldn't tell you if the headlight is in the wrong place. They sure look good pulling trains on my layout, though!

 

Those look too clean... :tb-biggrin:

 

Disclaimer: I mostly model UP - but I live in NS land!

Personally I think it's far better to make the model - with the compromises!

But it doesn't hurt to discuss the differences either!!

 

Atlas got the 3 Ex-Conrail YN3 -8 right for CSX they even got the white and blue roof on the correct numbers which is very cool.

I would not expect anyone to make a detail specific mold for the 20 unit like the pre-production Aces that CSX got. Now if they had over 100 that would be different.

Look like Kato will get two of three thing right for the CSX GEVOS since they got the correct handrails and trucks, the only thing we dont know is the DB vents but with the release of the GE Demo and later delivery from Kato it looks like this might be correct as well.

 

Thanks for the pictures! :thumbs_up:

Can't wait for my Kato's next month although look really nice!

 

Well Scott, looks like you'll be busy upgrading the NS Gevo's units headlights because they really look great. FVM will still have my business because they're pushing the other Nscale makers to upgrade the quality of work we deserve. GO FVM!!!! Keep up the great products!!

 

The Atlas Dash-8's have a problem far bigger and harder to fix in my very humble opnion than a headlight- its their ride height and the lack of a "side-skirt" to hide the contact strips- ala the Atlas Sd60 that has the same issue- Kato has skirts to hide this glaring eyesore:



it appears that the FVM's also have skirts and a lower ride height:





The headlight issue is a bummer, but its one you learn to live with or fix- CP modelers (myself included) have NEVER had an accurate SD40-2 in factory paint with a low headlight and cab mounted bell, if you want one you have to get a Kato mid-production BNSF style unit and paint it yourself and add the bell, but until that model was released- and remember it was the latest of the mid-productions to be released by Kato- there was nothing to use for the low headlight SD40-2 for years, and that headlight location and the bell are MAJOR spotting features for CP.


the original productions Kato SD40-2 is on the right and the mid-production BNSF version is on the left.

I know this was an issue for Matt and FVM because when he originally announced the CP units he was going to use an incorrect headlight placement and there was an uproar that led to him going with a correct one, but he also said that it costs a LOT of money to change that little feature, so hence we see the trade-off. [I stand corrected here by GTRail-see below- it was the numberboards that were going to be incorrectly placed that were changed to a correct placement- nonetheless Matt had indicated that this was to be an expensive change in the molds as I recall] These are running in the 80+$$ range which is comporable if not a bit cheaper than a Kato and cheaper than an Atlas or IM.

so whether we like it or not- its what we have and you either don't get em' and miss a very nice running and incredibly detailed model, get them and comprimise, or get them and MODEL. Scott- I admire your work as some of the finest in the N scale world and I think these would look great on your layout! I agree that these look real good at the front of a train and pull better than anything I own at super slow speeds.

enjoy,
Jan

 

Uhhh it was the cab vs nose mounted numberboards on the CP and CSX GEVO's that was the issue, not the headlight. As it seems NS is the only RR that orders the high mount headlights just about all manufacturers have passed on doing them tho Atlas has done high and low mount headlights on their widecab Dash-8's.

 

Whoops- you are right- that was indeed the issue on the CP's, sorry folks,
Jan

 

Well, I'm still completely impressed that FVM pulled off a GEVO in the first place and I will be purchasing several. I'm also pleased to learn what the difference is between an AC and a DC GEVO: the panel arrangement behind the conductor's side of the cab (pretty subtle). Thanks for the link DrifterNL.

That said, there are compromises (which are understandable) and there are mistakes. I think the AC panels on the NS DC model are just a mistake, since the DC panels have been tooled for the BNSF. But maybe there is something subtle about the tooling design that makes this a compromise instead - I don't know. But as long as the other NS options had to be compromised, I think this one is "in the noise". In any case, you NS guys have my sympathies.

Painting & lettering problems are generally just mistakes. I can't wait to see the BNSF units in person to judge the shade of orange. Most of the photos I've seen look too red, but the shots ATSF5078 posted look more like a proper pumpkin (though he thought it was too dark). I'm buying them anyway.

 

Here's an example of an option change that must drive the manufacturers nuts. Spot the difference between these two BNSF ES44DCs:

http://www.locophotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=103448

http://www.locophotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=95541

(aside from the color of the MU hose).

 

I noticed that the back headlight is wrong to, should be high, not low. To much to fix for me.

 

LOL, does it begin with a "D" and end with "r" and one is on the left side and the other is on the right side of the front?

 

I've always wondered about that......

The doors are on different sides of the nose.

I was on FVM's website and they noted that there are (at the time) up to 20 variants of the ES44AC/DC and they will only cover 6, so, I wasn't expecting pin point accuracy all across the board. Can't wait to see what the competition has because I'm eager to purchase my UP and BNSF units.

 

A little bit less of a spotting feature, the Kato CP AC4400CW has duo rear lights but any picture I have ever looked up of the 1:1 scale CP AC4400CW has a single rear light.
Also some of the cab detailing on the conductors side is different.

 

I agree that the color may be a little dark on the BNSF, but they are a great model with easy conversion to DCC with a good price on discount. I for one will keep on buying anything that Matt and FVM puts out. Thanks Matt!!

JSL