is Z scale track available in anything other than nickel silver?

All I have been able to find, is nickel silver track, is Z scale track available in any other material?

 

Not that I know of. Micro Engineering is the only source of rail I know of. You have some interesting application that nickel-silver won't work ?
.

 

It's not that N/S will not work ( at least that I know of - I have been warned against grades exceeding 2-2.5% for even N scale ) - it just that there are some other materials that I think will do the job better.

I have some grades planned that are going to exceed 3.5% along with some very tight turns, and between the two, the light weight of Z scale and the way that nickel tends to reduce friction in it's alloys - is going to make the use of N/S in that application interesting, and I would just as soon avoid.

T scale makes use of magnetic wheels and a non-rusting steel to avoid tractive effort issues brought on by such lightweight loco's - and I was wanting to do the same with Z scale.

 

AFAIK Marklin track is Code 60. MTL track is a slightly smaller Code 55. The only smaller track is Code 40. Nickel-silver is an alloy.

Bachmann makes Code 80 steel track or larger for HO. There may be other makers with brass rail. The steel/brass rails are prone to rust & get dirty. Lionel may be able to get away with it in their oversize O rail.

Nickel-silver is your best bet.

 

N/S is not going to do this:

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEjQgHHzJOI"]YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.[/nomedia]


I have talked to folks who have T scale trains, and they don't report any problem with corrosion.

Not all steel is prone to corrosion and the same is true for the steel that is used to make the track for T scale and as shown in the video, there are other benefits.

Even a steel with nickel in it to inhibit corrosion, would work as long as it didn't have alloying elements that inhibit magnetism.

 

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoEhR02uhJc&NR=1"]YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.[/nomedia]

Perhaps the TTrack has a different alloy? Some magic magnetic stickum??

 

I'm not sure what the specific make up of the alloy is, other than it is steel and it has some fairly substantual non-corrosion/rusting properties - enough that the owners of T scale equipment that I have talked, don't worry about it and they run on 3 V.

If I can't find something other than N/S - I may have to contact Eishindo ( the company that came out with T scale ) to find out the alloy is - or even if I can obtain some of their rail for hand laying ( not the right shape - but from what I understand, it is code 40 ).

 

The item that is magnetized is the wheels on the cars and the steel rail is what it sticks too. Without magnetic wheels on your rolling stock I do not see that you would gain much from using their rail. The magnetism is the force that gives the adhesion not the contract between wheel and track.

 

I think that obtaining wheels that are magnetized, are going to be the easy part - I have already found magnet dealers that will make magnets in custom shapes ( looked in to it for a different idea ).

So it's a matter of having a custom shape magnet made and then replacing the standard wheel with a magnetic one.

While it may not be as simple as it sounds, I am beginning to think that finding the right track to work with them will be much more difficult.

 

Can't you just magnitize anything (metal that is) by rubbing a magnet on it?

 

No.

It only works with iron based alloy's ( or alloy's based on iron, and related minerals cobalt & nickel ), that do not have to much to much non-magnetizing alloying agents ( see chrome and copper below ) in it - there are some other alloy's that become magnetic, but with few exceptions ( namely super conducting magnets ) they do not have copper in them ( the biggest component of nickel silver and brass ) or if they do, it's a low percentage of the material.

Copper is actually diamagnetic - IOW it is extremely weakly repelled by a magnetic field, and so more than a certain amount it will cancel out any magnetic agents within an alloy ( such an in the case of nickel silver and US coin alloy ).

Chrome actually has anti-ferromagnetic properties at room temperatures - and this is why stainless steel ( under normal conditions ), doesn't show any tendency to be attracted by a magnet, despite being made mainly of iron.

 

I really think you are overdoing it. Many, many layouts have 3+% grades and run all day. Sure, trains slow going up and speed up going down (DCC's BEMF can somewhat diminish that).

It appears your concerns are:
1) traction
2) derailments?

MTL and AZL locos should pull 10 car trains in tight curves, with ease. Märklin locos will have issues due to their light weight.

You can minimize the curve issues by:
- shorter trains (less weight going up hill)
- heavier cars up front
- don't mix body mounted to truck mounted couplers
- shorter cars
- transition curves (don't use sectional straight directly to curves - use flex track)
- super elevated curves (place .005" styrene under outer rail side of track)

Take a look at Scott's (Othello) layout in the following post:

http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/showthread.php?t=115202&page=2

You likely will run into more issues with homemade magnetic parts, creating addtional drag due to both overmagnetized and polarized wheels and track locations.
.

 

Maybe - maybe not.

The layout I'm planning, is going to be having grades of at least 3.5-4%, but not just a foot or two ( as I see in most layouts ) - more like a few yards of constant grades - if I end up having to compress the layout laterally, then in order to keep the same sense of hight and openness, I will have to increase the grades even further, and I have been warned against grades that exceed 2% even with N scale ( let alone with Z ) for any real distance.

Primarily traction of the locos.

I checked, his layout, and from what I see, it is more traditional in that the grades are still less than 2.5%.

The layout I'm trying to deal with is compounding grades that hit 2% for only a small portion and then hit 4% over the majority of it's length, with curves that exceed 15* ( on the prototype ), and as I mentioned before the warning about grades that exceed 2%, has caused concern.

I am aware of the drag issues that can arise from installing additional magnetic wheels on the freight cars - thus the reason I'm planning to use them only on the loco's.

I am planning on taking the polarity of the magnets into account - with the polarity running through the axis of the wheel, and in line with the opposite wheel on the same axle - with these in order, and just a high enough gauss, to increase contact, it should minimize any tendency for additional drag through interference with each other.

My biggest hurdle at this point is to get samples of lead alloy steel track to test it - if it doesn't work, I may have to resort to N/S track and hope that without modification, the locos do have enough traction.

 

Chopper, I think your mind is made up. Why did you bother asking for information and advice?

 

There are slot cars that use magnets to pull the cars down to metal strips embedded in the track. Could you put small magnets in the locomotives and steel plates under the track on the steep grades? Some of the rare earth magnets are quite powerful, small and relatively inexpensive.

 

Please take a look at my question again - I have not in any way asked for advice on what type of track material to use - nickel silver / steel / yellow brass - I have heard the arguments before, but I also know that some people have had good results with steel, and frankly many allloys used now are different, so there may be different results, now than when cheep steel was used for base end starter sets - can you or anyone else say that a higher quality steel product might not be available and perform as well or better than N/S? The very fact that T scale is using a steel alloy with good results for 2-3 years now with no sign of the problems that plagued steel track in the 60's, suggest that possability is not impossible nor unlikly.

I simply asked if anyone knew of a source for track that was not made from nickel silver, so that I may experament with a different way of doing something, so I fail to understand why you are asking me why I bothered asking for advice - could you please tell me where the misunderstanding occured?

It may be that I will decide to go with NS in the long run, but I will have the satisfaction of exploring other possibilities.

Personaly, I thought that folks interested in Z scale, where alot of ground breaking strides occure in the hobby, might find this endevor to be of intrest -- my bad.

 

I think this thread is a very interesting to follow and I hope some good solutions and ideas will be shared here. Very exciting thread!! :thumbs_up:

 

Chopper Greg on the James River Branch site, David K. Smith hand laid his Code 25 track. He used a flat wire but doesn't state what it is made of. You might contact him to see what kind he used.
James River Branch: Handlaid Track