Unpowered A and B units

Stormovic Dec 24, 2004

  1. Stormovic

    Stormovic E-Mail Bounces

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    I have noticed that only a few companies provide unpowered A and B units to go with the powered A units. Whats the solution to this when making up a freight or passenger train? Most of the freigts in my area are pulled by at least two or more units.
     
  2. Tad

    Tad TrainBoard Supporter

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    I don't have any unpowered units. I use all powered locomotives.
     
  3. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

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    I think Con Cor may still sell some unpowered Alco PBs and Life Like some unpowered E B units. However most of the industry is going to selling only powered diesels these days. Most will run quite well with each other unless you start mixing brands and models or very old with very new production. With DCC you can easily adjust any differences. Most better power supplies have no trouble providing current to run multiple units. Some of the cheep "Train Set" power pacs may not.
     
  4. LongTrain

    LongTrain Passed away October 12, 2005 In Memoriam

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    I only have 4 dummy units in my entire roster. 3 are B units sandwiched between passenger F-units, and one is a dummy A coupled with a powered FP9A. Dummies work OK for passenger service as one powered unit will easily handle my longest passenger train - 12 cars, so the second powered unit is just along for the ride. The dummy units are just for show.

    For freight use, I need everything powered. A "short" freight for me is anything less than 50 cars. ABA sets of Kato F3/F7s of the old production handle 100-105 car freights just fine. LifeLike Alcos, too. With 4 of the Alcos, all powered, I pulled 133 cars on the NTrak layout, with a little slipping here and there where there were humps. I cut that one back to 130 cars and ran it for 4 hours that way.

    With the newer GP and SD diesels, I need 4 or 5 to pull what I can handle with 3 of the old F-units.

    In any case, I have no use for dummy locos for freight use. Some of my diesels, Atlas RS1/3/RSD4/5, it takes 3 units to handle a short, 40 car train. Dummy locos would just add weight and drag.

    Real F7s were good for around 50 cars per unit, except in the mountains. It already takes 2 powered N Scale F's or FA's to pull 50 cars. A dummy unit in the consist would just make things worse.

    I realize real locos are measured in lbs of drawbar pull, not cars, and drawbar horsepower, but that is not practical in N Scale. 250,000 lbs of starting TE for an F7 ABBA set relates to 180-200 40 foot cars contemporary to the locos, so I use the Microtrains 40 foot boxcar for comparison. My N Scale locos pull about 65% of the load the real ones pulled.

    Those who fight with gunk and oxidation on their rails also like to have everything powered, as a train with 3 units will usually have 2 still pulling if one stutters momentarily. I don't have that problem, but I know a number of people who routinely add one extra powered unit to their trains for that reason.

    I hope this additional information helps you understand why dummy locos have never sold well in N Scale.
     
  5. Dan Crowley

    Dan Crowley Guest

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    I am not exactly sure what the original question is.? Are you looking for a solution to add dummies to your mix, or are you asking how a guy runs mulitiple consists?

    As most have mentioned they run all powered locomotives on the front end, and hence the lack of demand for dummy locomotives.

    I have built many dummies, but ultimately I have ended up putting power chassis under most of them for the reasons Bob points out. The only place where dummies end up remaining dummies are those B units that are used in passenger consists, or anywhere else I run an ABB or ABBA consist. Two powered locomotives will handle any train I plan to run on my layout so I can afford the luxury of throwing in a cosmetic dummy unit if two powered units are in service.

    However for people with smaller layouts who don't require the tractive effort, the dummy locomotive has some merit. I would have thought that would have been the majority of N scalers, but the sales numbers must back up the reason Dummy units are hard to find.
     
  6. Stormovic

    Stormovic E-Mail Bounces

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    If you hook up two powered A units back to back what about the reverse polarity on the rear unit? I am talking about a DC layout.
     
  7. NorsemanJack

    NorsemanJack TrainBoard Member

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    Stormovic - there is no reverse polarity problem (or, you could look at it as a "double reverse polarity"). When you turn the back A unit around, you've reversed the polarity going to the wheel sets, which in turn makes the motor run the opposite direction, which is what you want with the engine now facing backwards.

    I should add that there have been reports of some runs of lesser quality engines coming from their factories running the wrong direction. I think that is typically casued by someone assembling the motor upside down.
     
  8. Stormovic

    Stormovic E-Mail Bounces

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    Got ya.
     
  9. Grey One

    Grey One TrainBoard Supporter

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    About the only reason I can see for a dummy unit is if you wanted the visual effect of a locomotive in the middle or end of a long train. I hope to do this some day. We shall see.
     
  10. nmtexman

    nmtexman In Memoriam

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    Both ConCor and Life-Like make unpowered units (called "Dummies") and they do help you make up a train if you don't have full powered units. Personally, I like to use all powered and sold off my dummies a while back.
     
  11. Leo Bicknell

    Leo Bicknell TrainBoard Member

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    I agree the market for dummies is very limited. I think there are a few applications for a dummy:

    1) A dead loco being moved from a to b.

    2) Mid-train helpers. Most often that doesn't work too well in N Scale, although it can with good locos. Still, dummies may work.

    3) My pet projects - hidden stuff. Camers in the lead loco, sound generators, etc. This to me is the missing market, as too few people make dummies.
     

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