I thought over your original plans and what Dave suggested. Here is a concept that tries to reflect both and maximize operation. Many would find it too crowded and too much altogether. Some may find it just what they like. The turnouts are a mix of #4s and #6s. Dave, your idea of a shared interchange track providing run-arounds for both railroads is a good one. I didn't implement it but I'm sure it could be. I put in some industries and sidings that can lead to interchange traffic. Sugar from the SCRR can be processed on the SFRR. Agricultural products that are loaded on cars on the SFRR team track from trucks can be hauled to plants on the SCRR and products from the agricultural industry on the SCRR can be off-loaded on the SFRR team track. Warehouses on both roads provide almost any type of interchange you'd like between themselves, the car float, the team track, etc. I put in a small yard for both roads. That is part of what crowds the layout. A single storage/staging track for each might suffice because you can't run long trains. You could also try to make due with one interchange track, either as I've pictured them or as Dave suggested. You might form an agreement between the SC and SF to share engine maintenance facilities on the SFRR, giving track rights to and from the engine terminal to the SCRR. Well, that's it. Hope it's food for thought.
Mike, I dowloaded Atlas RTS. It is much easier than Xtrkcad. The SC & SB is less busy then you have depicted on your second plan. You had it nailed on the first plan. The prototype wasnt big enough for its own yard. It was just a 14 mile line serving one main customer (the sugar plantation) and I love how you did it on your first plan. The sugar plantation does not need the second spur either. So cutting back on the traffic to what you originaly had is OK On the SFRR side: I like the yard here better than your first one. The sugar processing plant and its coal tressle I'm not sure of I maybe would rather have the space for a more involved model of the dock and coal tressle for the SFRR yard. All that eguals: 1. Eliminate 1 siding at sugar plantation 2. Eliminate SC & SB yard 3. Eliminate 1 interchange track 4. Again I am not sure about the Sugar Processing Plant and coal tressle. Just eliminate the plants coal tressle. "Dave, your idea of a shared interchange track providing run-arounds for both railroads is a good one. I didn't implement it but I'm sure it could be." Just out of curiosity, what would implementing that look like? Again fella's thanks for all the help. I never expected as much consideration when I signed on. I hope I will be able to add something to your enjoyment when I get better at this. Mark Peterson
Mark P. Nope...It is quite appropriate to talk about research resources related to the layout you are designing. As we all learn about the SC and SB, as well as all the similar type RRs in Florida, something may trigger a new thought that can contribute to the overall success of your layout design. As you can see, each of Mark's designs offers a slightly different way for the SCSB and the SFRR to interact with each other. Mine offers yet another. Others may offer even more variations. Our alternatives are not "right" or "wrong"...they are just different from each other. Pick those elements that you think will help you make your vision into a reality. The design you ultimately select for your layout will probably change from the time you select it to the time you actually move your first intentional traffic from Point A to Point B (and...no doubt...will probably keep changing even after you've had your Golden Spike Ceremony--just like the prototype in the 1920s was different than the prototype in the 1880s). I'll try to post a sketch of the interchange track with run-around options on both RRs. BTW...if you haven't seen it yet, check out the new Tutorial sub-forum in the Support Forum. It has some threads/Tutorials about posting pics.
I think I have a better idea of what you are looking for after your last post. Here are three layouts. Layout 1 is the original one I posted. Layout 2 incorporates the changes you wanted as best I understood them. Layout 3 incorporates these changes and moves the track that connects the car float yard to the very front of the board to give room for longer sidings in the car float yard. This necessitates moving the sugar processing plant and coal yard (squeezing the coal yard quite a bit). I know you'll find RTS a useful tool, despite its limitations.
Hi Mark, Don't mean to distract from the conversation but I've been trying to follow this thread and can't seem to see your attachments. Am I missing something? I see the box where it says 'TrainBoard Attached Thumbs' but it's empty.
Thanks guys, You are really helping alot. I need to let it stew for awhile. Do you folks every find that if you don't think about something for awhile you will get the right answer? JustInCase: I see you fancy the FEC. I found a great little book in the library called "Flagler's Folly" It is the story of Flaglers extention to Key West and its ultimate demise in the hurricane of 1935. It is a great rescorce. I can see Mark Smith's diagrams fine. I wish I could help you but since I am a newbie too, I don't know much about the pictures and attachments yet. Time to get my shoes dirty I guess again. I am trying to find the exact location where the Narcoosee depot stood. Narcoosee was the end of the line for SC&SB. Not many people here are even aware that a railroad existed here let alone where the structures stood. I guess I will become the unofficial historian of the St. Cloud and Sugar Belt. (now if I only knew how to do that...) End of the line. Photo hosted on Florida Photographic Archive
Well you seem like a good man and a pretty smart man. Im only 14 i have an HO set but me and my dad work on it together(actually my dad works on it i just play with it)but im not a good at modeling so i really cant help you but welcome to trainboard
Thank you Alex, Thank you for a terrific welcome. You seem very smart too. My youngest son is 11 and he is looking forward to working(playing) with the layout with me. I think we will do more playing than working. p.s. I aint so smarty. I jus like usin em big woordies when I is a writin somtin portant!
So how old is your oldest i work with my dad sometimes with the train set but we kinda quit modeling at this point until he gets some money in and no im not smart...lol but i can be smart when it comes to trains but im doing pretty good in school all A's & B's so my brain is working with me this year....lol well have fun with your train set and ill be looking foward to seeing pictures of your train set
some Inspiration Here are some photos of my friend Don Olsons layout for inspiration. http://www.maj.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=86074 His layout is HO scale. 3'-6" x 6' with an 18" x 4' extension. 2'-6" makes it really hard to turn a train around.
Mark P: Here's the variation I mentioned a few days ago. Sorry it took so long to get it posted.I'm pleased with most of it...maybe I'd adjust it so 5 cars could be pulled from the yard and spotted on the interchange track instead of only being able to fit 3 cars and a loco onto the modeled portion of the SFRR that is used to feed the interchange. I kept the mainlines perpendicular to the ends of the layout assuming you'll expand in the future and will want to use this layout as a starting point for a bigger layout. It will also be possible to abut an additional section to one end or the other, if, by some chance, you are able to negotiate another 3 or 4 feet of real estate in the existing room. On the other hand...you may want to consider starting over completely with any future layout expansions, because building and operating with this version will give you lots of experience that will let you improve your next edition of the SC&SB RR. You'll still only have a 5 car interchange track and a 5 car arrival/departure track for the SFRR. If you expand to the right in the future, see if you can find a way to move all cars to the interchange using a single pull from the yard along a yard lead, followed by a single push that moves all 5 cars directly onto the interchange track without the need for a switchback move or a second trip to fill the interchange with cars. I tried to minimize the number of S-turns through turnouts. It isn't strictly prototypic, but it will help reliability of switching movements. 1. It might be possible to eliminate the S-turn in the yard lead (near the stub end of the caboose track) by putting in two # 8 switches (one right and one left) back to back between the A/D track and the yard lead instead of the two #6 switches (both right handed) that I have there presently. But this will change the configuration of the other tracks and the length of the classification yard tracks and the coal trestle will be affected, too. 2. The S-turn of the siding into the sugar processing plant could be removed by angling the building and running the siding straight to the corner. 3. The S-turn at the left end of the Arrival/Departure track could be eliminated by angling the SFRR main a little toward the back corner as it goes to the left from the interchange area. Access from the main to the A/D track would be by going through the straight part of a left hand turnout (but this is obviously not the common practice on most RRs). 4. There is an S-turn where the SFRR turns into the interchange track from the main on the rightside of the layout, but this could be reduced to insignificance if the SFRR exits the right side of the layout at 20.0 inches instead of 17.5. If you aren't 100% set on keeping the tracks at right angles to the sides of the layout, you may be able to enhance the overall appearance of the layout by introducing gentle curves in otherwise straight tracks and by having the tracks meet the edge of the layout at an angle instead of at right angles.
My only suggestion is that less can be much more. I would get some track and a couple structures and just start fitting things together on your doorpanels. If you need to, you can simply photo copy or scan your switches and set those on the layout with track pieces for now. If you do not have one already, you might want to get an engine and some cars so you can get an idea of just how big those are on the layout and how many cars can fit into a spur or passing siding. Good luck. P.s. If you have kids, you really should consider a continuos run of some kind. Or simply have a spare board with an oval of track on it. Kids tend to like to see things run.
Add fathers-in-law to that as well. "You mean you can't just turn it on and let it run?" LOL. Yes, it's best to have a continuous run option if you plan to entertain the troops.
