Having fired and run oil burning steam engines for about 10 years, at the start of a 40+ year career, I was never really curious until I watched a show on TV. Is there someone out there who can answer this question? After pulling a steep grade, where maximum steam pressure is needed, how is the fire reduced on a coal burner, when the power is reduced, to keep the engine from popping off? As I recall, some of our old hoggers raised a fuss if we allowed the engine to pop, wasting their steam and water. Also, do coal burners really make that much smoke, or is it just for effect?
Interesting question. I'd never envisioned this scenario. Now you have me curious. My guess- On a coal fired engine, wouldn't you slow down, or stop the stoker at a point prior to cresting that grade? Close down the atomizer valve on oil fired in the same fashion? Boxcab E50
Thanks, Bobcab, for a quick reply to my question. We had some ornery hogheads, back in the '40s.Especially on passenger. The U.P. hadn't hired any enginemen for quite some time, when I hired out, and it does take a little learning to be able to do a good job of firing a steam engine. My question on all the smoke, I worked several movie trains in my time and was asked to make a lot of smoke, also run with the cylinder cocks open, just to add to the action. In my book, a good fireman didn't make any unnecessary smoke. The more smoke, the more times you had to sand out the flues.
Boxcab is basically correct in that you slow down or almost quit firing (slow down the stoker or go into "maintenance" firing on a hand bomber). The biggest difference between firing coal and firing oil (...and "Yes", I've fired both...:teeth is that on a coal burner, you've got to think and fire about 10 to 15 minutes ahead of where you are on the line/route to meet whatever your needs are...Sometime further ahead if you have a bad load of coal or she ain't steaming well for one reason or another. The reason being is that it may take that long for the coal to "gas off" and "burn". As far as smoke goes, I'd agree with you that if you're seeing a "big rollin' cloud of black", something ain't right (like the engine is being "over-fired", etc.)...Basically, you're just wasting fuel. On a coal burner, smoke a little harder to control than on an oil burner (i.e., you can't just shut off the firing valve, turn down the atomizer, and go to a "spot" fire), but there are things that you can do to cut down the smoke. Most coal burners have a door with what it called a "smoke notch" that the door handle can be "locked" into. This holds the door open a bit and allows extra air into the firebox which usually will cut down on the smoke. Obviously, holding the fire door open in this position will also "cool down" your fire and firebox...Based on what you're doing or going to be doing, it may not be what you want (i.e., if you're going to pull another hill, you're not going to want to "cool down" too much but if you're standing in the station for a bit, it might be OK).
The amount of smoke generated depended a good bit on the design of the locomotive. As to the heat of the fire, once the throttle is closed, the draft is reduced as much less exhaust steam exits the venturis, cooling the fire somewhat. Photos and movies on the N&W of its steam power in the 1950's proved it was possible to design a steam locomotive that rarely, if ever, put out large quantities of black smoke.
This "Ol Hoghead" has a picture of the 3985 as wallpaper on my computer, which I fired and run on many trips out of Los Angeles. This picture shows smoke so thick you could walk on it. While those engines were hard steamers, that fireman was not getting the best heat out of his fire.Perhaps he was sanding it out when the picture was taken. That class of engine had roller bearing driving boxes, as I recall. They were a running machine. OH, the memories I have.
I was told once by one of the firemen who worked the N&W 611 in excursion service that less smoke and a white color to the smoke tended to mean you were running a really efficient fire. However, he said, that's not what people want to see. Most of us photographing steam nowdays (I'm guilty of this too) love to catch a shot with a big dark plum of smoke and that is just what today's firemen give us. Not because they don't know better but because they know it's what is expected.
Like this, you can see back down the plume over the train where they really started putting out a black smudge.
Ah'Yep I agree 100 % most pictures /videos we see today with huge plumes of black smoke are strickly for effect....Matter of fact same goes for excess use of the whistle/horn...many train tapes i have make me wish they'd ease up as I would much rather listen to the beautiful stacktalk of these magnificent machines.
I, too, enjoyed hearing the stack talk. A lot of our engines were refitted with a bigger stack, probably to relieve back pressure, and BOY did they talk.I remember, as a young hoghead, I was working a helper job on the Cima hill and not qualified to handle the lead engine. on a passenger train. The passenger hogger had to run my engine, while I ran the road engine. The road engine was equipped with one of the big stacks, and as we went up the hill, I really had that baby talking to me. It wasn't long till the passenger hogger got the message to me that I was using too much of his water, so I had to ease off on the throttle. Those were the days!!
You've got that right. Especially some of the museum/operators of logging type equipment. Their continual overuse of whistles makes the viewing experience downright unpleasant at times. Bleh. Knock it off, and run the train. :sad: Boxcab E50
Here we have some folks who are positive smoke and cinder junkies. I could only take so much of this and had to retreat to the enclosed cars.
On the other hand, some folks fire like it was intended. Here's Jack Wheelihan firing 4449 at about 60MPH along the Columbia River Gorge in 2001 when she was painted warbaby black. Nice fire, Jack.
Write down your memories. If you don't, your posterity won't know all the cool things that you did. If my dad or granddad was a hogger, I would be pumping them for stories every chance I got. If nothing else, I'm sure guys like us would love to read them!
I have written a couple of short books on my 40+ years of running on the mainline. I'll have to go back through them and pick out something that might be of interest.
Any of you ever hear a steamer pullin' full stack pressure as she starts to roll a heavy load on a cold winter day? It sounds like cannon fire, and has sometimes blown smoke rings!
