Hi: I have been reading previous posts about building benchwork vs Sievers Benchwork and I am almost convinced that I will go the Sievers route. I really don't want to spend the extra money but being in a Manhattan apartment and not owning a car, transporting the wood required for even my small 9 x 10 layout is not a small matter, add to that neighbors and a landlord that will frown on power tool noise and it seems to add up to buying pre-fab benchwork. I would like to know however what people are using for the layout base. My layouts years ago were built on a plywood base, but I seem to remember hearing/reading about using a foam base of some kind. Can anyone give me an idea of foam vs plywood? Where do I get this type of foam etc.? Kevin
Having just returned from Brooklyn to visit my daughter, I understand your plight. You are looking for extruded foam board, which is dense and either pink or blue. You are not looking for beadboard, which is white and coarse. One-inch thick foam board is often used as a replacement for plywood for horizontal surfaces. You could probably get a Home Depot or such to cut up a piece into, say, 2 x 4-foot pieces that you could transport on the subway. The stuff comes like plywood, in 4 x 8 foot sheets, and sometimes 2 x8 foot sheets. It's very light--a 4 x 8 sheet probably weighs about 4 pounds or so. You can get it in different thicknesses sometimes--the 2-inch thick stuff is handy for stacking into mountains, or carving into valleys. Easy--and pretty noiseless--to work with. Surform files, a little white glue, and a good vacuum are all you need.
Pre-fab does seem like a reasonable method for your situation. It wouldn't be very easy to get even half a slab of pink or blue foam onto a bus or subway car. It's doable, but not easy. But living without a car in NYC is a wise choice overall. What it costs to park in a good neighborhood is about what I'm paying for my house here! (I'm from Joisey originally and went to college in Manhattan.)
NYC Home Depot here in Manhattan is more of a design center than a real Home Depot. I stopped in there on my way home today and the guy literally laughed with I told him what I would need in lumber, not that they wouldn't supply the lumber and they would even do the rough cuts but delivering it is another story. Plus I can just imagine my landlord seeing lumber delivered to my apartment and wondering just what I was up to. I like the foam idea, it would probably be easier to use than the plywood and easier to move when my lease inevitably ends. By the way, are the foam sheets that Woodland Scenics sell the same thing? Also I used to have a car here and between the parking, the tickets and now the gas it just isn't worth it. The subway gets me everywhere. Now if only I can find a bunch of operational N Scale subway cars
We have a local modeler here using it and he is very happy with it. He also sat with them at a train meet somewhere and got a bit of custom design, so don't be afraid to call and ask if you need a few unusual shapes, etc. Depending on your layout, and esp. if it is around the walls, hanging medium duty shelves on brackets is also a practical way to build N scale benchwork, and I am sure your neighbors have also hung shelving, so they would understand a day worth of noise. On the other hand, they are New Yorkers, so maybe they wouldn't.....(spoken as a man born in NY, now living in NY hating TX.....)
Along with the shelf suggestion have you thought about T-Trak? http://www.ttrak.org/ can give you an idea as to what it is and they sell small wooden kits that can be set up on shelves. My wife is an active T-Trak enthusiast and is working on a module right now. Not only can you build your bench work without power tools and run in your apartment, but you can join other T-Trak people at train shows and run with them. The concept is based from Japan where the people have the same problem you do. The reason why they choose the size is because they too travel by subway. The track standard is the Kato Uni-Track, if this does not appeal to you and you won't be running with other T-Trak people, you can use Atlas track. However consider looking at the work John Sing and Steampowerguy have done with their Uni-Track. Their results rivals many code 55 layouts. Check out http://t-trak.cincy.home.insightbb.com/ for more ideas. I was sceptical at first, but you would be amazed at what you can do with these mini modules.
Benchwork Update: Just as I was ready to order prefab benchwork, I came across a lumber store here in NYC that is known for cutting wood for various projects and being very accurate, I gave them what I needed and they quoted me a price of $260 about a $500 savings over prefab, then just as I figure I'm all set I come across Jonathon Miner's article in MR on using metal studs. At the same time the hardware store across from my office went out of business and has a ton of metal studs and tracks. I take the plunge spend $80 on 10 tracks and 10 studs, a few bucks on some snips and screws another $40 for wood for the legs and I'm in business. I cut the metal at my office into 2' and 3' pieces, grabbed a cab and an hour after getting home I had my first section. It means I now have an extra $600 or so for trains, switch machines and other goodies. The metal is fairly easy to work with, I had some problems cutting but that was more a problem with my hands being strained from typing all day then the metal. Let construction begin!!!
It is funny how waiting a bit sometimes results in a much better solution than you could have ever imagined.
I have seen Jonathon's layout and it is a great idea. I used to be in the same modular club as him and being a fellow B&M fan, we would railfan the old B&M sometimes. Good luck with the layout!
The metal is really forgiving, my cuts are not all straight but with the section I assembled I was able to reposition after a mistake or two and was able to get the section straight and level. Feels good to get started l
Glad you've solved your benchwork problem, Subway Fan. I'm a big fan of using extruded styrofoam for subroadbed, in fact I didn't use any plywood at all on my current layout (27 inches by 12 feet thus far). Home Depot carries Owens Corning (pink) styrofoam insulation, so the one near you should be able to get it for you. It comes in 2ft by 8ft pieces and can be scored and snapped using a utility knife, so getting it home in 2ft by 4ft pieces shouldn't be a problem. You'll want to use Liquid Nails for foam to attach it to the steel studs and to itself when stacking pieces for hills. If you use the regular Liquid Nails, it will attack and disolve the foam. To cut and shape terrain into the foam, I use a drywall saw for rough cuts, followed up with a surefoam tool with a curved blade for final shaping. The surefoam tool is a type of rasp and is available at most hardware stores. Some people prefer to put plaster over the styrofoam, but I don't. I just paint it with an earth brown latex paint and go from there with scenery. Feel free to contact me if you want any further info.
If you doing the rasp shaping step and since you are in an apartment, be very careful about the shavings. They are statically charged and will get EVERYWHERE. Do it outside if you can. Now since you are in NYC (I grew up in Manhattan) and there's no such thing as a workshop basement or garage, and outside means the sidewalk, how about the roof top?
Whoopee! Ain't it fun....:shade: I'd like to see what you are doing, do you have access to a digital camera?
I am actually taking some pictures, I'll post them this afternoon, I still have to finish emptying the spare bedroom but couldn't resist building a section to see how it worked. Kevin
first section This is a picture of the first section it 24" x 30", you can see that the metal has a little discoloration from sitting in the warehouse for years. The layout will be 9' x 10'
What am I looking at? Will this section have legs attached, be flipped to the horizontal, and become a frame for foam or plywood? Whatever it becomes, it looks like you are doing a nice neat job...!
thanks Hytec; this section is standing on its end it will actually be horizontal with legs attached. Because I have to plan for moving this layout I am at present planning to use a a plywood base with foam and homasote. I will need to be able to separate the benchwork from the layout and I think the plywood will add necessary stability. I'm going to experiment with a small section by building some test track and moving it around with and without the plywood. I have never used the foam and maybe once I have some in hand I'll be better able to judge.
Hey SubwayFan, suggest you consider 3/4" foam board instead of plywood or Homasote. Foam is one heck of a lot lighter, would be plenty stiff with the frame you are making, and would make moving around a lot easier. Foam board comes in 48X96 sheets which would give you 6 - 24X30 pieces, with a 48X6 piece left over for a hill or some other Brain Fart you might have at 2 AM.mg: By the Way, you can not be just a "SubwayFan" in "The City" - you have to be a BMT, IND, or IRT Fan. Or doesn't that distinction exist any more? OK, so I haven't lived in The City since '55, but you gotta have standards, right?:shade:
SubwayFan, just use a 1-1/2" pink foam board at Home Depot. No need to use plywoodl, homasote, or anything else underneath it. It's very stiff and very light.
Hytec: I grew up riding the IRT so it is my favorite, followed by the BMT and the IND. But I also loved the Bronx's Third Avenue El which finally closed in '73. They no longer really use the IRT, BMT, IND designations and the new cars don't let you look out the front and the hanging straps are gone as well as the charm, maybe I'm just older.
