Good morning. Was wondering if AZL had considered or was considering manufacturing the Amtrak Cascades Talgo trainsets in Z Scale? I think they would be an excellent addition (they use a F59PHI and a de-engined F-40PH) to the existing Amtrak West Coast sets (and the Sounder set) ... would be cool to see one of those snaking their way through curves and switches ... in case no one knows what I am talking about ... here are photos: http://www.photosbystevenjbrown.com/narp/cascades/talgo.html [ July 28, 2005, 12:31 AM: Message edited by: Gordon Werner ]
Hi Gordon, Welcome to Trainboard. I don't know if AZL is going to do more paintschemes for the F59's but I'm sure Rob Kluz will chime in with info. -Robert
Hello Gordon! Yes, AZL has considered doing the Amtrak Cascade Talgo train. There are some challenges actually manufacturing the Talgo cars in Z scale. It is not impossible, but is one reason AZL has decided not to offer the set at this time. They are considering offering the F59PHI Cascade locomotive in a future release. I agree, it would be cool to see! Rob Kluz
what are the challenges, if you don't mind me asking? I would imagine that the set would have to be semi-permenantly joined and that the cars would have to be seriously weighted down (to handle turnouts, crossings and the like) ... but if y'all can manage to make an authentic looking SD-40T2 in Z scale ... then I definitely think y'all would be the ones to figure it out. Furthermore ... the cars, if I am not mistaken are the same as the Spanish Talgo cars ... except for the unique end cars of the Amtrak sets (they have those upwards wings to keep the flow goin' (if you know what I mean)) ... which greatly expands the opportunities for releases (maybe through Swiss Z) Anyway, I'd be one of the first in line to get one (or two) Appreciate the reply nonetheless.
I am not part of the design process, but I am going off a conversation I had with AZL. The challenge came in the car connections. AZL was able to offer articulate passenger cars in their Daylight sets, but these were brass and of a different design. Trying to design and keep the costs down for injection is important for AZL. I know AZL and SZL are busy on preparing for a number of new releases. They actually have a 3 year time frame in place. I have not been informed if any new F59PHI releases are part of this time frame. I will though pass your comments on to the owners of AZL. Personally, I love the F59PHI release. The engines run exceptional and the sets look incredible. Ajin and AZL did a great job on this run! Rob Kluz
Unusual car connections/wheelset Perhaps this photo illustrates how tight and complicated the connection on an AC trainset would be to reproduce. In addition, check out the wheelset, and how different it is from more typical wheelsets (whether on freight- or passenger- cars), seemingly requiring a new type of (modeled) wheels. It's a pity that the Amtrak Cascades trainset would be difficult to produce, 'cause I would sure buy one!
Mike, Great photo. Yes, it shows the challenge faces with producing the set. Interesting, Marklin's Senator set announced last year features a similar connection between the cars. I have not received the set yet, but I will be examining how they produced the set. Rob
Thanks, Rob. I took the Amtrak Cascades to and from the GTE in Portland, OR this past weekend, saw a chance to get a shot of the trainset at Union Station (Portland), and, recalling this old thread, took the photograph to illustrate the issues.
Hi Rob, If they offer the Cascade scheme, would it be Amtrak cars painted in the scheme? I would certainly buy a set! John
Which cars and paint scheme? John, Rob can speak to AZL's preferences better than I (and even then, only as a NA distributor of AZL), but I suspect it would be F59PHI locos (one on each end), and Talgo cars, painted in the Amtrak Cascades cream, green and brown scheme.
Hi Mike, Glad you made it back north in one piece. Even if they don't make the Talgo cars, and just paint Amtrak superliners in the Cascades scheme, I would go for that. Not prototypical, but I think it would be a nice looking train. John
It's not Z, but... If anything, I'm guilty of selfishly keeping this thread alive. ;-) A group of friends in Maine, and in a larger scale, managed to put together a pretty impressive and accurate AC trainset (custom-painted). A photo album on Facebook.com is the only place I have yet seen them. Intriguing!
Gordon, Yes, we have considered it, but it is not on our current list of future projects. The problem is that the Talgo cars only run in a few select areas: Madrid-Paris, Barcelona-Zurich, and the Pacific Northwest. In addition, there are many separate cars to produce a working set, so the tooling cost in plastic would be very high (over $100,000) with some pretty limited sales options. You would be looking at a retail cost of over $100 per car. Even in brass, the cost would still be about $100 per car. We think this is a good kit project for a smaller group to do. I don't think you will see AZL, MTL, or Marklin making these anytime soon. Sorry! -Rob(A)
A pleasant dream, at least Thanks for the reply, Rob. Obviously, there are lot of challenges to producing the AC, particularly in Z, making doing so terribly impractical. Note that even the custom-job by the group in Maine is in what I am guessing is N, if not an even larger scale. I assume they had to re-paint an existing Talgo set. As discussed way back when in this thread, there's also the very tight fit between the cars, and the single-axle per car wheel configuration (each axle supports the connection between two cars), both unlike any existing cars available in Z. About the only "easy" part would be adapting the F59PHI (on one end of the trainset only) in the AC paint scheme. It's nice to dream, though. :tb-wink:
