What has happened in the DCC marketplace that everyone,it seems, is using LokSound vs Soundtrax? IMHO the Tsunami decoders are easier or at least simpler to control the CVs and modify sounds than the LokSound which requires a programmer adn special software. I don't know the sequesnce of event s that led to this or am I in left field?
I think it has been like that for awhile now. What other decoder would you use? I guess there is TCS, but I know almost nothing about them. Their website doesn’t not seem very user friendly and the product codes just make the decoders seem vague. Loksound and Tsunami are the two best sounding decoders, but a lot of the time, I can get Loksound for less than a Tsunami, so my recent locomotives have all been ESU, whether it be sound or function decoder. While yes, you do need the LokProgrammer to mess with the ESU decoder, the ability to get a blank decoder and put whatever file you want on it simplifies the process. They sell one decoder that works for every locomotive, but with Tsunami, you have to look for a prime mover, the correct horns, or a custom light board-replacement decoder that only works in one specific model. I don’t do much CV modification myself, so this section is not a big influence on my purchases, but being able to pick one brand makes function mapping and programming easier. Digitrax is even less prominent in my mind. I have one Digitrax sound decoder and one or two function decoders. I will probably not buy another. They are slow to respond and the sound quality is a lot less than ESU or Soundtraxx. The reduction to just the two manufacturers only seems natural and frankly, does not surprise me. People are usually opinionated on one or the other, but in terms of sound quality, I am fine with either.
Well I still prefer SoundTraxx Tsunami’s . I do use the ESU’s too. I really don’t like the download time with the ESU. But it does give you a lot of options to use. I model in N scale so the Next 18 pin decoder makes installs difficult due to room. The Tsunami has gone to a plug also which makes things more difficult. When using a Tsunami micro in N scale I have resorted to removing the plug socket and soldering wires direct to the board. With Next 18 plug I can’t do that ?
OOPs! I may inadvertintly broken the rules. Sorry. Good to know you are still arounfd and we haven't conversed in a while. I wore out my DCC hand controller and plugins so I went to an upgrade unit of the same mfger. Big mistake. I need to go back to the lesser unit to get the ease of settings and readback of CVs in the handheld. I have not seen the Next 18 yet. Don't know anything about it. I have almost every major brand of sound decoder provided by OEMs and retrofits for sound. One particular brand can really put out the sound but the pickup is lacking. I need to find a keep along for all those and I have a bunch. The price on their units is great even with the electrical pickup issues. My other favorite has great pulling power and lots of pre-installed details but the sound needs an amplifier or run thru a sound board for improvement. If I can get some help on a Keep Alive for my one brand with the big sound, I'll be happy. I still have a FV Gevo with Tsunami retrofit that has never given me any problem and sounds fantastic! So is the reason on what has happened with the sound decoder suppliers.
People like options and the ESU Loksound decoders have the most options, Hundreds of options that can be mixed and matched any way the end user likes. The soundtraxx decoders are limited to the sound files they comes with. The LokSound Micro comes with a Next18 connector which has become the standard over seas and is starting to catch on here in the US. The option to simply plug it in is a big hit as not everyone has the tools or the skills to hard wire in a decoder. Plus they are the smallest Sound Decoder on the market today as such they will fit into more loco's than the larger SoundTraxx will. And they can be made even smaller by removing the Next18 connector and soldering the wires directly to the board. Not easy but it can be done and by doing so they can be shoehorned into Z scale locomotives. giving them a whole market that the SoundTraxx decoders won't fit into Plus LokSound decoders tend to be cheaper than SoundTraxx and no you don't necessarily need top buy a programmer, Many dealers will program the sound files for you if you ask, and the CV's can be changed with JMRI and/or your favorite DCC controller. David
For diesel sound, ESU has no peer. Their diesel sound files are recorded from actual running locomotives, then edited and tweaked for best sound from small speakers by Matt Herman and his staff at ESU LLC. If you install a file for an EMD567 or 645 prime mover, it is the sound of the actual engine, not a generic diesel sound. I've used Tsunami decoders for diesels in the past, and had BLI PA-1's that were supposed to be Alco 244's, and none of those sound anything close to what you get from ESU. If you don't want to mess with a LokProgrammer, you can have your dealer install the appropriate sound file before sending it to you. After that, adjusting sounds, functions, etc. can all be done via JMRI's Decoder Pro (which some folks find easier to do than with the LokProgrammer anyway). For steam, the Tsunami is still a strong contender, though ESU has some recently recorded steam files that I suspect will be terrific once they are released. Right now, the steam pickings for a LokSound 5 series are pretty limited, although the two files available (the SOO Line 2-8-2 and the UP 844) offer enough choices of bells, whistles, air pumps, etc. that they can be used for most steam locos. At the end of the day, chuffs are pretty much chuffs and steam hiss is steam hiss. The real difference are the whistles, bells and air pump sounds. John C.
I suppose with all the time I now have on my hands working exclusively from home, I might as well buy some hardware and learn how to program the LokSound System. I have 4 specific locos that need the sound files seriously modified and/or upgraded speakers. I even bought a new unit just to see if I had screwed up the factory sound files with a system reset. THAT WAS A $250.00 MISTAKE. It pulls like a mule but whispers like a kitten.
Well I would really like to see some one solder wires to the NEXT18 foot print pads. I guess it might be done but I question that and would like to hear & see some one who has done that.
As Requested here is your proof I have removed the Next18 connector and soldered wires on to several ESU Loksound Micro's Page 2 of this thread has pictures of the first one i did https://www.trainboard.com/highball...su-loksound-5-dcc-micro-decoder-8-pin.126470/ And a picture of the last 3 with wires soldered on and the 4th in OE configuration for comparison. And a Side view to show how much thinner it is with out the Next18 connector
Well you have shown me it can be done- hats off to you. I just got a new soldering station (PACE) with a very fine point. I will giving that a try. Again job well done- no shaking hands are a real help. Any special advise for doing this?
Program and test the decoder before you start to modify it Take your time. Work on a static free mat. Make sure you and your soldering setup are properly grounded and that it is rated for use on sensitive electronics. Clamp or tape the board down so it dose not move while your working on it. Take your time. Adding a tiny bit of paste flux to the soldering wick will help draw the solder into the wick. Take your time. Make sure all tabs have been de-soldered before attempting to remove the Next18 connector. I used a raiser saw & a #11 blade to cut the connector into pieces then removed it one piece at a time. Solder the wires closest to the edge of the board on first. Get and use the correct colored wires so you don't mixed up which wire is which. Solder the right rail connection (Red Wire) to both pin 1 & pin 18 and the Left Rail connection (Black Wire) to both pins 9 & 10. Double and triple check that their is no bridging between solder pads. De-solder and start over if your not sure as one bridge or crossed connection will let the magic smoke out. Take Your Time and check for bridging and possible shorts again before adding power. David
John, I am sure they could, but the cost of manual soldering the wires to the board cost way more than a pick & place machine can place a NEXT18 socket.
Yes, so charge me $10 more if I want a wired version. I actually have come to like the Next18 adapter. Easy to program a decoder by simply removing whatever adapter board is on the decoder, then "plugging it in" to the LokTester connected to the Programmer, and off you go. While the sound file is downloading, you can be wiring the rest of the engine, then when it is done, unplug the decoder from the tester, plug it into the adapter already wired on the engine, and you're done. The problem is thickness: because of the new design, there are a few (very few, actually) engines that I could not use the V5 decoder in, where I can use the V4. But this will probably be solved soon, with a V5 version of the 78100/78199 board decoders. I think the Altas RS3 is probably the only engine I have where neither a V5 nor a board decoder would work. And eventually, THAT problem will go away, because Atlas surely will modify the mechanism for the RS3 in the future to accept a board decoder. I guess life goes on, even when you're locked down at home contemplating building a helix and a second deck on your layout, that you just finished the scenery on last week . . . . sigh . . . John C.
I've had very good results with a Tsunami decoder in my Intermountain N scale cab forward. It's been working for years and it's easy to program with no special equipment. I wanted to install another one in my other cab forward but Soundtraxx no longer lists a decoder that has specific cab forward sounds.. So I bought an ESU decoder and had the sounds loaded by the supplier. The decoder arrived and didn't function at all. I mean nothing. Not even lights. I returned it to ESU and they replaced it. Now I can't adjust the speed very well and the sound is less than half of what I get out of the Tsunami decoder. I tried it with a cube speaker with an enclosure and a flat oval speaker. I called the vendor and was told to try programming with the Loksound programmer but it doesn't work with Mac computers. Now I have to send it back to the original supplier and have them program it. What a pain. ESU may have superior low speed operation but Tsunami's are way easier to program. Even if ESU decoders are a little cheaper , the cost of buying a PC and a programmer wipes out that advantage really quickly.
