I just starting ballasting with Arizona Rock and Mineral N scale ballast. After laying ballast, I carefully applied 70% alcohol with an eye dropper starting from the ties on down and then waiting a 2-3 minutes and then applied Scenic Cement with an eye dropper. The end result was kinda realistic looking. However, the ballast looks more like mud than ballast. It seems to have lost its texture. I also tried applying the scenic cement without the alcohol as an experiment but it didn't seem to help much other than there was less movement of the ballast. Thanks for your help. td
Even with the use of an eyedropper, it sounds as though there may be a bit too much cement, creating the look you're describing. I've also used the AZ N scale ballast, and one of the things we're both going to be dealing with is how fine the stuff is. That's part of the appeal (as well as better color choices) but it does mean that it's much easier for the glue to fill in the gaps between pieces and give a bad experience. Maybe set up some scrap track somewhere to experiment/practice, get a feel for how much is enough to hold without messing up the appearance.
When I have done ballasting before I have dusted the ballast with a light layer of ballast on top of the glued ballast while the glue is still wet. The light dusting picks up any excess glue and once dry I will use a vac plus a light bristle brush to pick up any loose particles. I have had the effect you describe on Arizona Ballast but it doesn't seem to be as prevalent with Woodland Scenics product. The effect you describe does make the Arizona product a choice for roads and parking lots that are gravel and dirt though. There used to be a dry powder ballast cement on the market that was mixed with the ballast before applying. Seemed to work quite well but I haven't seen it in years.
Eagle2, I hear what you are saying. Would you still use the alcohol or just rely on the wetting agent within the Scenic cement? thanks for the help.
This is one of the reasons I always mix in some other color ballast (usually one of the light greys, and some cinder) with whatever main ballast color I am going for. By having some unique particles showing, helps eliminate the uniform surface look. I also do as John suggests, especially if I think I got too much glue applied. I use a 50% white glue / 50% isopropanol mixture.
It was that loss of texture with the N scale ballast that got me started using HO scale ballast for the track and then used the N scale stuff for roads or other places where I wanted it to appear a finer grain than track ballast. Brad Myers Peninsula Ntrak / AsiaNrail My Blogs: http://www.n-scale-dcc.blogspot.com/ http://www.palisadecanyonrr.blogspot.com/ http://tokyo-in-nscale.blogspot.com/
I too use 50% white glue / approx 30% Isopropyl Alcohol / approx. 20% water, mixed well and I pour it into an old mustard bottle with the twister cap. I can dribble, at what ever rate I want, the mixture onto the ballast. Works very well. A lower percentage alcohol works well also. BTW, I do not use "ballast" from any manufacturer, as I use the sand used for sand paintings. IMHO it looks as good than some of the "ballasts" offered and it is less expensive. Carl
When I did some AZ over unitrack, and I didn't prewet the ballast. The scenic cement seemed to do just fine.
I have never, and still don't have an issue with AZ Rock and Mineral N scale ballast...and certainly not the issue you're describing. Are you certain it's ballast and not their pigment powder?...and which color is it? Item number? The reason I ask is that I saturate my ballast beyond belief with both, pure alcohol, then scenic cement...and, again, never experienced what you're describing here. Bruce
actually, in these pics the ballast looks pretty good. lol I'm using Northern Pacific gray N scale ballas medium gray granite 1301.
The ballast in post #11 looks pretty good to me. I'm also using Arizona Rock & Mineral 1051 Pennsylvania Grey N Scale Ballast. I used a one-step wetting/gluing method. My adhesive consists of 3 parts matte medium, 2 parts 91% alcohol, and 1 part distilled water. I carefully groom the ballast with a very soft paint brush. When it looks right, I apply the adhesive first between the rails, which results in some wetting of the side slopes as well. I then apply more adhesive on the ends of the ties, which soaks down the slopes to secure the rest of the ballast. Occasionally, I have to fill in some areas and re-wet, but this does not happen too often. Below is an example. - Jeff
I'd say your ballasting job looks nice as well. AZ R&M ballast is very fine, so it's easy to get that look before it's dry. A similar problem arises with the marble dust product they offer. I used it for ROW snow, and it is so fine, it is like talc powder. It is super picky about how much glue it likes, too. Too much (use less glue than usual--and divide that amount by half and you might still be too wet) and you have a runny mess. Too much glue water mix and nothing stays put and simply liquifies. Don't ask how I found that out! :frustrated: Once I got the amount just right, my snow banks and plow marks didn't collapse into a watery mess. This is AZ R&M ballast, prewet with isopropyl alcohol, and liberally moistened with white glue/water mix: Here is the marble dust "snow" ballast, after fine-tuning the glue application technique:
I'll come back in to say that I also think the result looks fine. If you haven't heard this one before, one trick I was taught long ago was to brush on some thicker glue on the shoulders and sprinkle a little ballast there first. It helps me get the ballast to stay in place on the slope better and allows the further application to proceed easier.
Sounds kinda what I do, I use a scenic sprayer with a water and a few drops of Dove dish soap wetting my ballast fully( not water running off, but damp) then after that is done. I go back with my water/Elmers White Glue mix and gently pour it down the center of the ties making sure to it fully weeps out to the edge of the ties. and let dry makes for ROCK HARD ballast that will survive the test of going to train shows everytime. Let me know if that helps. Shawn
I have a How To section on my website that describes step by step how I ballast my track. The example is on Z scale track, but I used the same technique on my N scale layout. I've had great success with this method. http://www.carlettatrains.com/how2ballast.html
