Fascinating and some what hard to understand the British slang and its meaning. I got home late from work tonight so I haven't much time to ask questions but will have more tomorrow. Thank you very much Chen. Steve
In the World War 2 Railway Study Group Bulletin for June 2013 (Vol. 23 No. 3) there is a short article by the late Wynford Fear, a military locomotive driver in WW2, who describes the technical aspects of the Whitcombs, and also comments one their usefulness: Of course, the Italian State Railways (FS) did exactly that, with the expected results.
I haven't heard of similar problems with the GE and Alco units which also were sent over seas during the war. In another forum I was told this by a gent who helped restore and operate a 65-ton Whitcomb from WW II : http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33922&start=45 Steve
Here is the website of the railroad museum that operates the only Whitcomb 65-DE-19a that still has its original Buda engines in it. http://www.kemptontrain.com/equipment/ And some information on these units: http://www.jeff-z.com/wks/locoroster/602/rhp.html I hope that our town can save the 65-DE-19a that was retired in Mason City, Iowa and move it back to Rochelle where these were built. The Buda engines were replaced with Cummings but I would love to see it brought back home. I have located and interviewed Bertrum Cote who worked at the Whitcomb factory during WW II until drafted in late 1944. He stated that the Army and Navy had representatives at the factory who upon successful trial running each unit would accept each locomotive which then would be disassembled before shipping. He still lives in Rochelle and is a great guy. Steve
This is a photo from the Army-Navy "E" award ceremony at Rochelle. On December 31, 1943 the War Department conferred the Army-Navy Production Award ("E" award) to the Whitcomb Locomotive Company and the presentation ceremony was held in the Rochelle plant on January 26, 1944. Bert Cote is on the right holding the flag. He said that he would run each locomotive for 15 miles to check for leakes and make sure everything worked. Then he was drafted and served in the 2nd Armored Division ( "Hell on Wheels" ) over in Europe in a half-track during WW II. Steve
Below is a rather poor reproduction made by the late Paul Cotterell from an unknown source, showing three Whitcombs, probably in storage or under repair, at the Ez-Zib running shed (engine house), probably c. 1944 I reviewed the surviving Palestine Railways Working Time Tables. The Diesels (as they are referred to there) only appear in WTT No. 3, which came into force on 1 May 1944, and are still there in ammendments issued during December of the same year, but not in WTT No. 4 on 1 November 1945. On the Haifa-Lydda section of the PR Main Line, they were allowed 400 (metric) tons on goods (freight) timings singly or 760 tons double-headed, provided vacuum braking was in operation on at least 5 wagons (freight cars) otherwise 600 tons. They were not normally allowed to run on passenger timings, and under no circumstances were they allowed to double-head with a steam engine. The values given for the Haifa-Ez-Zib section of the HBT-Line are the same, except that there is no differentiation between passenger and goods timings. They are not mentioned on any other standard-gauge section of the time tables, nor in the table summarizing locomotive types and their leading particulars.
Wonderful photograph. You are providing information unobtainable here in the states. I definitely want to include this in the book. Steve
Steve, You are can certainly use the info I post in your book, with proper credit to The Israel Railway Museum and respective photographers (where applicable). I will post more photos when I find them in our archive. Please note that the WTT summary I posted is definitely not the whole story - I already posted evidence that the Whitcombs where regularly used on the other PR main lines, i.e. from Lydda to Jerusalem and across the Sinai Peninsula to Kantara East on the Suez Canal. Chen
I just talked to the California State Railway Museum in Sacremento and told them about your information and photos and they would love to see them. So if it is ok with you can I forward the information to them - with proper credit going to The Israel Railway Museum of course ? They have the entire record and files of all the Whitcomb production. 746th Railway Operating Battalion, Germany c. 1945 Steve
Just recieved this email from CSRM: Series 1. CARD FILES The Whitcomb Locomotive Company, and later the Baldwin Locomotive Works, maintained card files to record information about each locomotive ordered. The Card Files contain the following key pieces of information: Serial number: Whitcomb assigned a unique serial number (or construction number) to each locomotive constructed. The serial number was also used to identify an accompanying bill of material. PSO number: In 1931, after taking over the Whitcomb Locomotive Company, Baldwin also assigned a PSO (Product Sales Order) number to each order. The PSO number may refer to a single locomotive or to a group of similar locomotives ordered at the same time. Photograph number: Beginning in 1931, the cards may include the builder’s photograph number. Specification number: The format for specification numbers is ## - [locomotive type] - ##. The locomotive types are: Gasoline-mechanical Electric storage battery Electric trolley Combined electric storage battery and electric trolley Diesel-mechanical and diesel-hydraulic Gasoline-electric Diesel-electric The cards may also contain other information about a specific locomotive such as the purchaser, its location, date order was received, date order was shipped, purchase price, gauge, dimensions, locomotive type, order cancellations, re-sale and returns for refurbishment. The CARD FILES are arranged into the following subseries: Subseries 1. Serial numbers Subseries 2. Product Sales Orders Subseries 3. Locomotive types Subseries 4. Orders received Subseries 5. Orders shipped Subseries 1. Serial Numbers [BOX 1] Arranged by serial number. Includes purchaser, location, engine class and weight. Specification numbers first appear with serial number 40001. Subseries 2. Product Sales Orders [BOX 1] Arranged by Product Sales Order number. Includes the PSO, purchaser, weight, class, and sometimes the serial number and specification number. Subseries 3. Locomotive Types [BOXES 1-12] Arranged by locomotive type and then by serial number. Gasoline-mechanical, 1-1299, 11300-13247 (1906-1948) [BOX 1-8] Electric storage battery, 1401-2081 (1914-1945) [BOX 8-10] Electric trolley, 20001-20046 (1922-1930) [BOX 10] Combined electric storage battery and electric trolley, 30001-30007 (1922-1924) [BOX 10] Diesel-mechanical and diesel-hydraulic, 40002-40743 (1929-1951) [BOX 10-11] Gasoline-electric, 50001-50010 (1929-1935) [BOX 11] Diesel-electric, 60001-61197 (1936-1951) [BOX 11] Electric trolley, electric storage battery, gasoline-electric (Westinghouse), 80000-80594 (1942-1951) [BOX 12] Mack International Motor Truck Corp., gas mechanical and diesel electric locomotives (1936) [BOX 12] Motor cars, 100000-100013 (1946) [BOX 12] Milwaukee Locomotive Manufacturing Company locomotives, M 740 – M 981-W (1933-1934) [BOX 12] Plymouth Locomotive Works, 615, 996 + miscellaneous (1925-1928)[BOX 12] Whitcomb Lehmer road shoulder finishing machines, 0200-0210 (1930-1931) [BOX 12] Miscellaneous cards relating to components [BOX 12] Subseries 4. Orders Received [BOX 13] Arranged by manufacturer and the chronologically by the order date. Includes order number, PSO number, purchaser, locomotive class, gauge, and price. Whitcomb: February 1918 - February 1953 Westinghouse: 80007-80610, October 1942 – December 1952 Subseries 5. Orders Shipped [BOX 14] Arranged by manufacturer and then chronologically by the order date. Includes serial number, purchaser, weight, wheel arrangement, locomotive type and price. Whitcomb: January 1918 – December 1952 Westinghouse: July 1943 – December 1952 I aked them about why the Milwaukee and Plymouth files were in the Whitcomb records. Steve
The linked (and previously-unseen) selection of photos from WW2 Egypt/Libya also has a very nice shot of a (brand-new?) Whitcomb, 33 seconds into the presentation: [video=youtube;ieGvXfGI8PM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieGvXfGI8PM[/video] Notice it has an American-shaped cab, which is not shown in any of the known diagrams. Chen
Off topic- Interesting bridge work. It would be fun to see that project in video. But most probably no such thing exists.
I have not yet contacted the owners of the photos (there is an email address on the web page) - there are many other very interesting photos for me in the collection! Chen
I found another WW2 Whitcomb photo in the Israel Railway Museum's archive, this being by Arthur Booker, and shows two of the engines (note different cab profiles) crossing a bridge in Lebanon on the then-new Haifa-Beirut-Tripoli Line with a freight composed of American designed and built cars (of USATC MEF types): Chen
Chen, it is safe to say that you have made it possible for the first time to see these rare photographs on our continent. THANK YOU !!! It makes me wonder if more photographs are buried in museums in Italy, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany and England. I've contacted the War Museum in London but only a fraction of their photographs are digitized. Unless one goes to London and the museum to search their archives, I'll never know. Steve
Actually I did find another series of photos showing the construction of a replacement bridge before a Whitcomb graced it with the first crossing. 746th Railway Battalion if I remember right. https://plus.google.com/photos/1155...544476866841256427/albums/5687955407915461969 Steve