Z Scale Decoders

Hello,

For people who would like to program their DCC-Decoders comfortable on PC, this may be interesting.
Not only it is easy, but you can also memorize the individual data of every loc or decoder.
This is even more important for sound decoders where you have to handle and to change from the default to Z-conformity up to 200 CV's.

For this I use the excellent program PROLOK from Thomas Borrmann
http://tt.borrmanns.de/prolok.html
And till now a modified ROCO Booster with ACK-Detector. This was working, but never perfect.

Yesterday I met Oliver Passmann and catch from him newly made programmer for DCC without the need of additional stuff.
It's wonderfull working, crazy quick and accurate.
You can also use it on USB with a com converter, for small notebook owners.

 

you might be using it and it might be excellent, but most of us won't get very far through a language barrier

Chris

ps what is this "thingy" on the picture you have attached and how does it work?

 

Hello Chris,

Please dont cry

There is a language file, if you look down on the homepage,
english.lng
If you copy this to the files directory, english is up.

The board on the picture is a programmer that you connect on
the RS-232 serial of your computer.
Now you also connect 12Volt AC on the first 2 pins,
and your decoder or programming rail to the next 2 pins.

From now on you can read out all data to your PC, write new data
into the decoder, and this also in decimal, so crazy easy.

More, you can keep file of your decoder(s) on your harddisk, so if
he disappear in smoke....the replacement decoder is ready to feed
with the same data, also if you put decoders in the same loc from
different company's (GP-35 out of 8 ;-)) you can always recover
your best data's for the job.

 

thanks Cleantex, for the additional explanations and language help
all makes sense now - downloading the software now to play with it

I suppose I only need the board from Oliver
(no sign of it on his web page? and it is in German only as well )
the whole thing sounds like a good idea - I want it:thumbs_up:

Chris

ps what do I do with Hilfe.zip? and does it work in English as well?

 

Hello Chris,

Me also not german, but just with the advantage that in Luxembourg most people know german, french and english...oh I forgot luxembourgish, of course :laugh:

I find no help file in english, but is easy to understand from the program, if you play around with it.

Now I make something that nobody make at this hour in your corner, I go to bed

Armand

 

not quite that easy, but not much more complicated either:teeth:
having copied english.lng you have to open prolok.ini and where it says:
Lang=
you have to enter english
only than does it know that it is supposed to use English

thanks for your help my "luxembourgish" :shade: friend
I also know three languages, unfortunately it doesn't help when none of them is German :angry:
so it is back to Google language tools :thumbs_up:

Chris

 

I tried the prolok too, looks like the key to what I have been looking for. I have been using the MS-1 with Pridos and this is just a great replacement. I am also looking for what Armand is talking about with the new thing from Oliver Passmann that works wonderful, crazy quick and accurate.
For the Prolok the way I got it to convert to English is I copied the english.lng file in the prolok directory and started prolok then clicked on

Einstellungen (setup) then a window pops up where you select English in the bottom right corner pull down menu and click on Speichmern (save). It seems to work with Windows XP too, but need to check the actual communication.

Kim

 

any more news about the "programmer" ?
I have checked Oliver's web page and shop and no sign of them?
I would really love to have one...
Chris

 

thanks Rob,
keep us posted on results of the test, cause I want this baby ;-)
btw anything on the problems you had with one of CT decoders?
Mine is still running great, but you can't really call it testing (especially when comapred to your running)
Chris

 

I have 2 CT Elektronik DCS74z and they are excellent. I've never seen such fine slow speed control for my finicky N scale locos. They do have some finicky qualities, however, in that they will not read back codes in Page mode, only in Direct Mode, and sometimes they will not obey the commend to reverse.

 

And I can't get the same kind of lighting effects quality, compared to the name brands. But they are really small and ran fine for me.

 

Small Decoder run a 3volt max motor?

Robert,

I am DCC illiterate! Can this super small decoder be used to power a small 6mm 3 volt max motor without harming it?

I finally recieved the motors I've been waiting on for a month. Came last night when Jeffrey White dropped them off.

http://www.solarbotics.com

6mm motor with a 25:1 planetary gear system. The dimensions are 6mm dia. x 21mm in length. Right at 3/4" in length.

I plugged 2.75 volts into one tonight and it works beautifully. Just right for my (Motorized O'Wonder) MOW Truck project I will be finishing soon. I'd say at 2.75 volts it was turning at about 2.5 rotations a second. Can't say for sure. Possibly more, but I doubt less.

This motor might be the answer to alot of Z scale solutions!

Look forward to your response!

Hobo Tim

p.s. Reason for question, might make the MOW DCC! :shade:

 

Tim, I have been eying that motor for some time and looking for other cheaper sources. Anyway, I could say it would work fine if you control it within its current limitations. The motor is a current device and as long as the motor is spinning and the current is within its range the voltage does not matter, If the motor is stalled it is a different story. From the specs the motor max current is 200ma (which is pretty high for its size) so you could monitor its current with a decoder limited by the %power output as Rob explained. The only main test to see if will work is to stall the motor and check its current, if it exceeds 200ma by a lot you will burn the motor at some time during its operation when it stalls or overloads. There are some ways to limit the voltage one would be limiting the decoder H bridge + power, by adding a voltage regulator or even by just adding a reverse biased Zener. Other methods of voltage reduction after the H bridge involve more components and need to be on both + and - side. Resistors might work, but will not give you the performance needed. The biggest problem you will have is speed control, the pager motors have very poor speed control at the decoder PWM frequency. I have been playing with speed control for these small motors and you need a very low frequency to actually control the speed at which point you could even drive it direct without the gears since it will have good torque at low speeds at this frequency. I am talking about few hertz to 10's of hertz. So in other words you will have to try them to see how well it will work. Kim

 

Tim, Kim, Rob:
I don't see a problem here. If the duty cycle is limited, then the motor won't run at super sonic speed. CV5 Max Volts for 32 (and CV6 Mid Volts to 16) would limit the effective volts to 25%. Ref: 128 is the max, 64 would be half (duh) and 32 would be a . . . 1/4. BUT, you need to change the Mid Volts or you may get a funny curve. I don't remember if the Mid volts auto halved (32) or not. Yes, the CV#'s are "backwards". 5 is the Max, 6 is the Mid (and 2 is the Min but just leave it at 0)

Now, as Kim commented, running at 25% duty cycle using say 12V DCC power is not the same as running 100% at 3V from a motor's torque perspective. 100% DC usually will provide better torque. Frequency of the DCC decoders can also effect this so as Kim says, you may have to lower the frequency (different CV fo different Mfrs).

Kim mentioned a Zener diode. This is likely the best option. Dropping the decoders assumed 12v pulses thru at 9v zener would leave you with your 3v at the motor. I assume that you want to run this bidirectional. If so, place 2 Zeners in series "back to back". Makes no difference if anode-to-anode or cathode-to-cathode. One zener will act like an ordinary diode when reversed (~0.5 to 1v drop) while the other 'zeners'. Reverse polarity and the swap roles.

I think this will be your best way and you can use the normal default CVs. You can test it with the pager motor or any Marklin motor safely.

So, need to know your DCC volts to pick the zeners. I can send you a pair.

 

GuyZZZZZZZZZ!!!!

Remember, I am not a DCC modeler yet!!!! All this technical talk is giving me a headache! :teeth:

But, I will keep this info for future use when needed. What I would prefer to do is have one of you DCC this little motor then post your findings.

See, regardless of whether I make this motor DCC I am still going to built the MOW trucks and put this geared motor in them. If I have to, I'll go strictly DC only. I am not sure I would be able to put the small 7mm x 9mm decoder in the truck and make it look natural anyways. Jeffrey White had asked me if it might be possible. From what I have read above, it is. First things first, the MOW Trucks, then if I have the room, we'll try DCC!!!

I want to heartfully thank you guyz for taking the time to write the above postings to my question. I appreciate it greatly!

When I start on the MOW truck, I'll post progress photos!

Hobo Tim