Newbee Question

[Steve Ervin]

Hi Everyone...As a first post...what is probably a simple (or Stupid) question: I am sure there are multiple answers for this. How do engines end up on somebody else's track? Here in Fresno we have both UP and BNSF with extensive yards and trackage for each. Several days ago I watched in amazement a UP train with a BNSF loco smack in the middle of a UP pair of locomotives. Likewise on the BNSF, I commonly see SOO, NS, CN engines in BNSF trains. I am sure many of these are due to mergers and slow repaints, but BNSF on UP?!! Are these engines destined for outsourcing repairs or what? It is something I have always wondered about.

[Thirdrail]

Railroads exchange locomotives based on horsepower hours. If two railroads operate a run-through train, and one railroad has the locomotives twice as long as the other, there is a hosepower hour deficit. Rather than pay this off with cash money, the road owing horsepower hours permits the railroad owed to use an equivalent number of horsepower hours of its locomotives elsewhere.

So, you're liable to see anybody's power anywhere. it has absolutely nothing to do with slow repaints, mergers, or outsourced repairs.

[Steve Ervin]

Thanks for the info...so how is the repay loco selected? By location? So it is possible for a locomotive to be stuck on the opposite coast for most of its life? Some fallen flags locos must be due to repaint questions. On the UP here there has been a resident Rio Grande loco forever. One still does not have the UP number patched up. Thanks again

[Charlie]

Third Rail has the correct answer, but I cant tell you how the "repay" locomotive is selected although I would guess it would have something
to do with a parity in horsepower rating. Locos dont stay away from "home" as long as freight cars. They need to be inspected and serviced and, while there are Federal mandates for that, most railroads have their own standards and methods for performing those necessities
and generally prefer to do their own. Also, carriers dont like to be paying the high prices another carrier will charge them for servicing the
engines. Some carriers, like the BNSF, will pay a "belt" or "terminal" railroad to service their engines while on their property. IE, the BNSF
pays the BRC to "build" manifest trains for them, hostlers will bring power to the BRC to be added to the train when it is ready. The BRC will perform any necessary servicing and then when the train is ready to go, a BNSF crew will be shuttled to the BRC to pick up the locos and the train and take it to company rails, either continuing on to its destination or tranferring it to a point where a road crew will pick up the train.

If you ever get to Chicago and can get anywhere near the Diesel Shop
on the BRC, you will see a plethora of various railroad logos and paint
schemes.

CT

[Steve Ervin]

Thanks Charlie...at least the practice(s) make for a more interesting time watching the tracks.

[Hytec]

On CSX's New Orleans-Mobile sub, we see about a 45/45% mix of UP/CSX, with the remaining 10% being a Duke's Mixture of whatever is wandering around the country.....:teeth:
Seriously, I've seen TFM, WC, BCR, CP, CN/IC, KCS, NS, and of course a bunch of leased. I see BNSF only on a phosphate unit train every week or so, but that's exciting because every few months they'll include one or two in Warbonnet. :shade:

[Steve Ervin]

Thanks! My question was prompted by the mixture of BNSF and UP engines last week. It was a bit of a surprise since the two are rivals here. Of course the two do mix it up over the Tehachapi Loop, but it was a surprise to see the mixture in one train. Lots of strange things come through Fresno as a major N-S route. we have lots of leased equipment too and several local railroads operating a strange mixture of engines with inconsistent liveries. UP and BNSF do operate over each other's tracks in case of a wreck or track outage. BNSF is used by AMTRAK Caklifornia as it runs right through the middle of town and right past city hall. The council is forever trying to get BNSF to permanently use SP track through town. Makes things interesting.

Regards,

Steve

[Mr X]

Steve welcome to trainboard! Good question. I always wondered that myself.

Mr X

[Triplex]

Railroads exchange locomotives based on horsepower hours. If two railroads operate a run-through train, and one railroad has the locomotives twice as long as the other, there is a hosepower hour deficit. Rather than pay this off with cash money, the road owing horsepower hours permits the railroad owed to use an equivalent number of horsepower hours of its locomotives elsewhere.

So, you're liable to see anybody's power anywhere. it has absolutely nothing to do with slow repaints, mergers, or outsourced repairs.
I've wondered for a long time: For how long has this system been in general use?

[Charlie]

that's exciting because every few months they'll include one or two in Warbonnet. :shade:

Story time.... dunno if I've told this one before but here goes...

I was working the switchmans list at Eola yard, I was lucky enough to
catch a day job and held that job for about a month, over the Christmas/New Year holiday period. At that time our division was originating a road-railer super-high priority train to the west coast.
This train operated on Fridays and their was a late morning cut-off time
for the trailer delivery and it was strictly enforced. This was a high rate
premium service with a guaranteed delivery time frame, or NO CHARGE!
This train orginated in an unused part of an automobile transloading facility(which has since closed)in suburban Naperville and was in the
industrial switching area where our job worked. Our job had a "must
report" instruction to be at the road-railer staging area at the cut-off
time. NO EXCEPTIONS!!!!! We were to cease whatever work we were performing, no matter what stage of the switching operations being performed and immediately take our power to the staging area and transfer to the road power which was waiting on one of the lead tracks. We would then use the road power to assemble the road-railer train. I was the helper and I would be with the hogger to throw switches and unlock the electric switch locks to enter the main track
when necessary. The foreman would be with the Trainmaster who was
supervising the assembly of the road-railers. This one particular day, we had had 2 Dash-9s in elephant style lash-up, the trailing unit being
in ATSF red warbonnet and lettering. There are private industries adjacent to the lead track to the road-railer staging area. A railfan was
in the parking lot of one of the industries and we happened to be positioned right where he was, about 30 feet away. He asked us if there
was any way we could put the ATSF unit in the lead so he could get a
photo. We had to answer in the negative. After we had a good laugh and thought about it, we sorta figgered if it was worth say mebbe $150
bucks we mighta found a way to do it!!!!! LOL
At any rate, the regular foreman of this job and the day Yardmaster were good buddies, so once we got the road-railer put together and brought down the main to Eola yard for the waiting road crew, we would get an early quit. Always a nice gift on a Friday afternoon!
One of the many benefits of working dayshift jobs!

CT

[Steve Ervin]

Thanks! And thanks for the link to the images.

Steve

[Thirdrail]

I've wondered for a long time: For how long has this system been in general use?

It got started with the establishment of run-through trains in the 1960's but gathered popularity with the reduction in the number of Class I's and the expansion of run-through trains, especially coal unit trains. Another factor was the deregulation of compensation between railroads with the demise of the ICC.

[Triplex]

Funny... a book I read from the 70s, in discussing run-through trains, didn't mention this practice at all. I've also never seen photo evidence of it from that era. Every instance of mixed-roadname power on one train warranted a specific explanation.

[Thirdrail]

Funny... a book I read from the 70s, in discussing run-through trains, didn't mention this practice at all. I've also never seen photo evidence of it from that era. Every instance of mixed-roadname power on one train warranted a specific explanation.

Well, it was certainly a practice by 1982, when I negotiated a major coal contract for my short line railroad employer that was handled jointly with CSXT. We ended up not sharing power since the motive power had to reverse train ends at the interchange and our roadmaster threatened to quit if we used six axle power. :omg: