Longest N Scale Train Stories!

[SD75I]

I was wondering if anybody would like to share stories whether at home or at a club or at a show about the longest train they ever ran? How many units/cars? Did it make it without derailing? How many times around? etc.... The Solano Central N Scale many years ago at a Roseville Railfair ran a 335 car train with 5 units! This was amazing because the headend was about 8 cars away from the rear! It was a small layout! It was perfected by Donald Heimberger! I think it had 3 Bachmann F9,s on point about 8 more cars, then a gas turbine and another F. And then 327 cars! It started out to see how many we could run and evolved into a series get over the road manifest with no setouts! Please share yours!
Thank you and God Bless!

Dave

[Craig Martyn]

I've seen 90 car N scale trains going around with out any problems but 335, WOW!!!!! That must have been a sight!!! On the train that I helped my friend run, he had nine locomotives total, 7 SD45's in front and 2 Life Like SD7's in the middle. We ran it on our club's layout, the Orange County "N" gineers that is located around LA. The layout was split into 4 blocks, so, the middle engines would be in one clock while the lead locomotives were in another. The SD45's were faster so we had to constantly turn the throttles up and down. The train did pretty well once we had a pattern down. Haven't had one that long since....that reminds me, I gotta go call Bruce and set up a date to do it again!!! :)

Craig.......BLMA

[porkypine52]

I am a member of a Modular N-Scale Club in the Southern Indiana-Louisville Kentucky area, the Kentuckiana Society of N-Scalers (K-SONS). We are Ntrak based modular club. Whenever we do a show, several of the club members, including yours truly, like to do long trains when we have a little extra running time. 150-200 car trains are normal. We can usually get a good size train moving with about 7 or 8 engines(KATO mostly)and about 100 cars to start. This will tell us if our trackwork on the modules will be able to support a LONG train. We have found out a couple of things about long trains.
1) Make sure all your engines will run together and at the same speed for a given throttle setting.
2) Say you are using 8 engines to pull 150 cars. Put 5 up front and 3 about 2/3 of the way back, say between the 50th and 51st car. Make sure that the 3 engines in the middle are not only pulling 50 cars behind, but also pushing 10 car in front of them. This is so that the head end power is never pulling against the rear power.
3) Don't try a long train when you have a public show. People don't want to watch you spend an hour putting a train on the track just to have it move 1 foot and break apart. Do the long train before the show or after on club time. The public will be more happy with a 50-60 running train than a barely moving 150-200 car train.
4) Use the best rolling cars you have. Micro-Trains trucks on each car.
5) Digital throttles can help. You can put your head end power on one throttle and your mid-train power on another throttle. Start the head end power out and when the slack is out, start the mid-train power. Once the train is moving dail the mid-train power into the head end's throttle so you have one throttle for the whole train.
Sounds like a lot of work, and it can be. But it is worth it when you watch the HO guys jaws hit the floor when they see a 200 car train, stop, set out a car on a siding, and then take off again. HEH-HEH-HEH

What a Hobby!
MARK

------------------

[Alan]

At the close of model railway exhibitions we used to do this sort of thing, but layouts here in the UK tend not to be as large as your modular ones.

On my N Scale Andersley Western, we can accommodate 50-car trains. We have run these with head-end and mid-train power, also head-end and pushers, with no problems around 12" radius curves up a 3% grade (providing the locomotives are matched - all-Kato or Atlas). All cars have Microtrains trucks.

On the layout these trains look enormous - just shows how big the real ones are http://www.trainboard.com/smile.gif


------------------
Alan

www.ac-models.com (http://www.ac-models.com)
http://Andersley.homestead.com
http://galleryusarail_tehcaj.homestead.com
http://eurogallery.homestead.com

[This message has been edited by Alan (edited 01 April 2000).]

[eddelozier]

I run a minimum of 50 cars on any of my trains, except for a MOW train I pull out on the main once in awhile.
My longest right now is 90 cars, mixed freight, behind a (3)set of PA-1 with a lead GP-9 helper. Next biggest is 55 coal hoppers behind a triple headed steam, (2) 2-8-8-2 Articulates and (1) 2-8-2 Mikado. Smallest is 37 container, spine and trailer car mix being pull by a lashed threesome of Norfolk SD-60's. I can run these all at the same time with proper power control. No jerky starts or stops!! One short power loss can cause a car pile up do to motor power stopage.
Learned a neat trick to keep the cars running tight and to cut down on slack...put a dummy engine on the rear as a 'helper'. ( take all motor and electric pickup parts off first).
I have two levels of double tracked main lines of 100 feet each, running arould the walls of two basement rooms. No small train would look good running on it. A train of 150 -200 cars would not be a problem pulling, only the expense and storage yards to hold the cars becomes a problem. Not to mention the cost of replacing all the trucks to smooth running micro-trains (as mentioned in prior post, a must).
Long trains makes construction of curves and inclines important to get all the correct angles of lean-in and lean-out stress. Adds to the hobby.

Eddie

[Maxwell Plant]

Well, let's see, the most I've ever done was with head-end power only. I had about 75 or 80 cars with 2 SD45's, 2 CW44-9's, and 1 SD60. It really was a little over powered, but it's better to have more than you need in my book. It was run on my clubs (N-Trak of Bloomington-Normal, IL.) "Fun Run" layout with the help of Midwest Central (Urbana, IL.), Heritage N-Trak (Joilet, IL.) and Northwest N-Trak (Palitine, IL.). It was a BIG Railroad and we ran LONG trains. Another member ran a train of 90+ cars and pulled it with 2 CW44-9's! I was floored to say the least! All these trains were MT equipment or MT converstions. And you're right, it's cool to see the HO guys go NUTS when we do that! http://www.trainboard.com/biggrin.gif

------------------
MAX-RAILROADER

[Eagle2]

Just to put in a shameless club plug, one of the members of the Pikes Peak "N" Gineers in Colorado Springs ran 8 locos, 200 cars and a caboose back in January, 1998. I must honestly say I agree with two points: 1, do this sort of thing in private; 2, GOOD trucks and couplers (I've tried a measly 35 car coal train with unimates and AARGH)

[SD75I]

Hello Maxwell,

I must ask, How did the 5 units run together? & Where was the SD60 unit, lead/ trail? Thanks!

Dave

[Maxwell Plant]

Consist was running as listed...this time. I really don't have to much trouble running Atlas, Kato, Life-Like or even Bachmann Loco's together. I think to much worry is layed into that. I usually run the slow one up front and the fast to the rear, but that changes if I want a certain loco on the point. I haven't burned up a loco by ruuning them at "Different Speeds" yet. http://www.trainboard.com/biggrin.gif

------------------
MAX-RAILROADER

[Alan]

Yes, Maxwell, I have a friend who is very careful to match his locomotives to run together, but if you do as you say and put the slower one up front, they are all pulling, so no problems.

In practice I just run any Kato and Atlas together with no problems.

Some of you have some LARGE railroads to run your trains. A fifty-car train is about as much as my layout will take and look reasonable, although we have run more, just to see what happens!

I love main line trains, but also get much pleasure from switching, and running way freights with a couple of geeps. http://www.trainboard.com/smile.gif This is a wonderful hobby - so many facets http://www.trainboard.com/biggrin.gif



------------------
Alan

www.ac-models.com (http://www.ac-models.com)
http://Andersley.homestead.com
http://galleryusarail_tehcaj.homestead.com
http://eurogallery.homestead.com

[sd75mac]

On my layout, there is an approx 3% grade. I use 4 C44's and 2 SD45 on the headend and a C44 as distributed power in the middle. This is pullinng a 26 car, fully loaded container train. I could add more cars, but this combination suits me just fine.

------------------
Keep on Track'N
Harold Riley
www.phcomputing.com (http://www.phcomputing.com)

[Alan]

Harold, do you mean 26 wells, or 26 5-unit cars?

------------------
Alan

www.ac-models.com (http://www.ac-models.com)
http://Andersley.homestead.com
http://galleryusarail_tehcaj.homestead.com
http://eurogallery.homestead.com

[sd75mac]

Alan, 3 Gunderson double stack units and the rest being single unit cars (including 89'flats).

------------------
Keep on Track'N
Harold Riley
www.phcomputing.com (http://www.phcomputing.com)

[This message has been edited by sd75mac (edited 02 April 2000).]

[mtaylor]

Fast forward almost seven years.....
With new equipment available these days (more locos, better rolling stock, etc). What are the longest trains you run on your layout, club, NTRAK, etc.

Just curious.

[mtaylor]

Alan,
I know that your N-Scale layout is now history, but this has me in awe. My train of 52 coalporters had MAJOR issues on a 15" radius at about 2.5% grade with four SD70MAC Locos on point. What rolling stock and locos did you use for this feat? :)

At the close of model railway exhibitions we used to do this sort of thing, but layouts here in the UK tend not to be as large as your modular ones.

On my N Scale Andersley Western, we can accommodate 50-car trains. We have run these with head-end and mid-train power, also head-end and pushers, with no problems around 12" radius curves up a 3% grade (providing the locomotives are matched - all-Kato or Atlas). All cars have Microtrains trucks.

On the layout these trains look enormous - just shows how big the real ones are http://www.trainboard.com/smile.gif


------------------
Alan

www.ac-models.com (http://www.ac-models.com)
http://Andersley.homestead.com
http://galleryusarail_tehcaj.homestead.com
http://eurogallery.homestead.com

[This message has been edited by Alan (edited 01 April 2000).]

[NP/GNBill]

I've ran 50 car NP Atlas ore cars on my Tacoma Division behind an ABBA set of FT's or F7's. I usually run 30-35 car trains with at least three units on the point, or one of my ABBA sets of F's, either FT's, F3's, or F7's. About 90% of my equipment is Accumates, while the other 10% is MT's. I've had no real complaints about them after I clip off the metal pins.

[Powersteamguy1790]

Bob Woods (aka Longtrain) consistently ran trains with over 100 cars on the SandNSurf N Trak layout in Phoenix.

His loco power didn't include any of the large modern diesels. He always took great pride in the number of cars his small diesels could pull for over several hours at a stretch.

Unfortunately, Bob passed away about 15 months ago.

You might be able to pull up his comments about this if you do a search on TB.

Stay cool and run steam.....:cool::cool:

[Rossford Yard]

There are many N scalers who tell exceedingly long "train stories." Honestly, some would go on an hour or more about their favorite prototype or how to put on a coupler, or about how the mfgs are just hosing us compared to HO.

I try to avoid them if I can!

[mtaylor]

Jeff,
Not the type of "Long Train Story" we had in mind here :).

Do you have any sotries on Long N-Scale Trains?

PSG,
I remember Bob Woods and he is still missed. I had forgotten about his N-TraK trains :)

[jwaldo]

The most I've ever run was 23 freight cars and 3 commuter coaches. I ran out of freight cars after 23, so I threw on the coaches. Each has about the same rolling resistance as 4 freight cars :o.They all had assorted trucks and couplers. It was pulled by a single Minitrix F9 :embarassed:

Still, it took up 2/3 of my little mainline. And it ran beautifully right up until the F9 lost its rear driveshaft and could barely pull itself back to the yard for repairs :o

[mtaylor]

That is pretty impressiv for one loco!! Ouch on the drive shaft, did you get it fixed up?

[Frank Campagna]

Yeah, those Minitrix locos were real pullers. Probably today the best would be a set of LL FA's. Would be interesting to see how long a train you could pull with a couple of ABBA sets. For myself, I'll make do with a small layout. Frank

[randgust]

One of my oldest friends had a basement-sized N layout at his previous house... maximum .5% grades, 20" curves, modeling the B&O / C&O. He also had a custom run made by MT of black B&O 34' hoppers - 100 car minimum.

The challenge and great fun was to get all 100 of those hoppers in one train, and tie them behind ONE Rivarossi 2-8-8-2, and lap the entire layout. It could be done, and it ran reliably. There wasn't a passing siding or yard long enough to hold it all, but don't say those old girls couldn't really pull, or that a properly designed layout couldn't handle a train that long. Those MT hopper cars are really light, but seeing 100 of them in a continuous line was unforgettable. Never had a pull-apart, either. But you couldn't back it up to save your life, of course!

[mtaylor]

One 2-8-8-2 and 100 hoppers!! All I can say is WOW!!

[Pete Nolan]

I miss Bob Woods too. While I was visiting last summer, he took me over to the club and ran an 85-car train behind a single Atlas RS 4/5. The only modification was a second axle of traction tires.

http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/data/922/ant.jpg

This picture was taken before Helicon Focus showed up. I took three slices and manually blended them together. It ran for a good number of laps until until one of the tt axles started slipping. Bob was delighted, both at the length of the train, and the breakdown.

Bob and Victor Miranda (from the Atlas board) added a set of traction tires to the Life-Life 2-8-8-2, and stuffed every nook with weights. He said it walked away with over 100 cars. But then the siderods all popped off due to the stress. The stress caused the holes in the rods to enlarge, IIRC. These locos have only one geared axle per engine (i.e. two in all). I believe they don't even like added weight.

[mtaylor]

Pete,
That is amazing. So Bob just added traction tires to the Atlas loco and no weight?

[LADiver]

But it is only 43 cars.

[mtaylor]

43 cars seems very impressive for one locomotive to me....am I off track here (Punn Intended) :)

[jwaldo]

That is pretty impressiv for one loco!! Ouch on the drive shaft, did you get it fixed up?

Yeah, a dab of super glue on the slipping iniversal joint and it's back in service :shade:

Those Minitrix F units may be old, but since they're basically a block of solid metal with a motor cavity under the shell, they pull quite well. Oh, and mine also roars, smokes, and emits smells when running, just like the prototype! :p

[Tioga Railroad]

Yeah, those Minitrix locos were real pullers. Probably today the best would be a set of LL FA's. Would be interesting to see how long a train you could pull with a couple of ABBA sets. For myself, I'll make do with a small layout. Frank


Four or five years ago I had an ABBA lashup of Life Like FA1/FB1s pulling 165 cars (MTs or cars w/MT trucks/couplers) on our NTRAK layout. They would have puld more, but 165 is all I had room in my boxes for. The train didn't run very well though, there were constatnt break aways among the last 40 to 50 cars. I finally shortened the train to 120 cars, and it ran fine for several hours.

[HemiAdda2d]

I once lashed up all 53 MDC hi-side D&RGW CoalLiner gons I had, after installing body-mounted 1015's, and building 5-car drawbarred sets. I stuck 2 IM tunnel motors on them,a nd they wouldn't move! Then, I put 2 more midtrain. It started to move, then spinning again. Screw it, I thought, I plugged all 7 TM's I had on the train--looked impressive on my little 11x12' layout in my last house, but even 7 units could hardly move the train! What's going on?!?!?!?
I removed all the cars, and the cheap MDC trucks I reused had serious firction--some would not even roll. Shoulda checked!
After swapping out all the 'sticky' wheelsets with free-rolling ones, or MT low-pros that I had laying around, all 53 rolled behind 2 TM's once again. A funny story for sure, looking back; but a real hair-puller at the time!:o

[Powersteamguy1790]

Bob Woods routinely ran 100 car trains on his clubs N-Trak layout on Sundays, We often talked about that many times on the phone.

He did this to show the kids who visited the club what N scale loco's could do.


Stay cool and run steam....:cool::cool:

[David Bromage]

Several huge trains were staged using Jim Fitzgerald's custom built "Cotton Brutes". The Cotton Brutes were double length Minitrix U30 bodies with two Sagami 1630 can motors in each and chassis made from depleted uranium. They weighed 24oz each.

In November 1982, one of these locos hauled 513 cars from a standing start. The two locos together hauled 778 cars. The train was 6.625 scale miles long. This is a photo of the 778 car train.

http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/4586/longtrain3py.jpg

At the 1983 NTRAK convention a single Cotton Brute hauled 560 cars on its own. The two then hauled 950 cars for 3 hours. They couldn't put on any more as the layout wasn't big enough!

The longest model train ever is thought to be the two Cotton Brutes hauling 1103 cars. There is supposedly to be an attempt at breaking this at the 2008 convention.

Cheers
David

[r_i_straw]

Last November I ran a 60 car passenger train on our NTRAK club layout. Two Life Like E6's and a mix of Rivarossi heavyweight, Con Cor Budd cars and smooth side cars and a Kato Super Chief with a few odd other cars like a Bachmann full dome lounge. At over 30 feet it was longer than any straight section of our layout.

[Pete Nolan]

But it is only 43 cars.

There's considerable foreshortening here. I count 43 by mid-train on this low-res version for the Web. We counted the cars as Bob placed them on the track. The train was about 30 feet long. I may have posted the wrong photo--let me go look.

[skipgear]

I'll throw my hat in the ring for a long train story:

http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/data/1204/S-1Ntrak1.jpg

52 - Atlas 55T Fishbelly
7 - MDC 3 Bay w/loads
11 - 33' MTL 2 Bay w/loads

= 70 Cars + 1 caboose

Pulled by:

http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/data/1236/Scratchbuilt_2-10-2_BigSix_B_O_6127.jpg
1 - B&O S1 2-10-2

I didn't bring enough cars with me to stop it although I think it was getting close to it's limit. Maybe another 10 cars at the most. I have been talking to the Motorman about a possible motor and gear reduction to help it over come that. There is plenty of room in the boiler for more weight, I was more worried about burning up the motor. It is based on a Kato Mikado drive train and I think needs to be geared a bit lower to get the most out of it.

I have an EM-1 (2-8-8-4) in the works that I am shooting for over 100 cars.

[mtaylor]

That is just amazing!! Now by adding more weight, would that cause an wear issue for the siderods as has been reported with some LifeLike Steamers?

Awesom picture too....thanks!!

[Paul Downs]

The longest model train ever is thought to be the two Cotton Brutes hauling 1103 cars. There is supposedly to be an attempt at breaking this at the 2008 convention.

Cheers
David

I did a rough estimation of the longest train we can pull on the 2008 layout. If we are bigger than Chantilly (and we are gunning for them), we should be able to accomodate at least a 10,000 car train.

We just need a few more Cotton Brutes and its a chinch!

[skipgear]

That is just amazing!! Now by adding more weight, would that cause an wear issue for the siderods as has been reported with some LifeLike Steamers?

Awesome picture too....thanks!!

4 of the 5 drivers are gear driven. The #5 driver is the only one not gear driven and it is just along for the ride anyhow. It does not ride heavy on the rails because the #4 driver has a traction tire and I didn't want to take any weight off of it.

The issue with the LL steamers is the siderods transmit the power to the axles 1, 3 and 4 on each engine if I remember correctly. Only one axle is geared. The soft plastic they have to use to get the fine detail on the drivers is not strong enough to tranmit the power though. If the plastic was stronger for the spoke inserts in the wheels, I think you could get away with that. The crank pins stretch out their holes and you end up with failures. If parts were available, the loco could be easily improved. It appears if it was designed to have both the #2 and #3 drivers geared, they just didn't impliment it. All it would take is another set of geared drivers (with traction tires) and the LL Mallet would be probably one of the best loco's out there.

[David Bromage]

I did a rough estimation of the longest train we can pull on the 2008 layout. If we are bigger than Chantilly (and we are gunning for them), we should be able to accomodate at least a 10,000 car train.
Is that 10,000 40 footers or 10,000 Autoracks? :)

We just need a few more Cotton Brutes and its a chinch!
Or mid train helpers. I don't think that would be considered cheating.

Whatever happened to the Cotton Brutes?

Cheers
David

[mtaylor]

10,000 ore cars :) I am only jesting of course

[CCRunner]

When I used to run at Ntrak shows, I had a 105 car CP coal train that I ran every now and then. I had actually added weight to the cars, as well as a aftermarket load. I greased up the axles of the cars, and stuck four units on the point, with a couple on the rear, and it ran till the show closed. The extra weight kept it from straightlining in the curves, and the helpers had just enough shove to keep things rolling...nice train, still have it..may go back out and look for Ntrak agains someday....for now, it sits and waits patiently for me to start my newest layout out in the garage....soon as I sell our beloved boat. any hot boateers on here who want a true 100mph boat? I guarentee it will improve your dating life. ;)

[Flash Blackman]

Jerry Schamahorn posted this reply:

Likely the first attempt at any official "long train haul" came about as sort a lark idea at the first public display of NTRAK. That was in the summer of 1974 at the San Diego NMRA convention. That layout was the joint effort of Belmont Shore Lines, San Diego Society of N Scale, Elmhurst Ill. N Scale club, Phoenix N Scale club and 4-3 individuals.
In those early days, there were no smooth running split frame engines as are common today. That train consisted of 144 mixed freight cars (of various manufacture) pulled by 3 MRC RSD-15 High Hoods. These engines were used because of the extra weights in the front and they had traction tires making them the strongest pullers of their day. Happily 'N' Scale has come a very long way toward improving both quality and performance since those very early days. We decided that to claim any kind of record, the train would have to make two complete circuits of the layout w/o any un-couplings or derailments. That first one cleared that performance hurdle. I haven't kept up with subsequent records, ( no doubt there are hundreds ) and currently some standard is recognized as a minimum distance to qualify. Just thought I would throw that out if anyone was wondering where these long train records came from. We were just trying to show the public that 'N' was a very viable scale. Since it was the only exhibit with any action or movement at that 1974 NMRA Meet, N-TRAK was a huge audience pleaser from the very start. One of our purposes was also to show manufacturers that 'N' had a real future and hopefully they would start making us good quality products. It seems to have worked fairly well judging by today's array of products.


Jerry: Here is a bunch of threads (http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/forumdisplay.php?f=237) on how to get stuff done on TrainBoard. I can tell you I was really surprised and very glad to see your post. Welcome to TrainBoard and I really hope you will keep posting here. You have a lot of information about the old time N scale/NTrak. Maybe you could post pictures of the circus train. That was amazing!

I sent you an email, too. (Signed: Flash Blackman)